Should I respond to this from ex?

[LightInTheCorner]

Ex was abusive twat and I largely try to grey rock him. We have dc together and went through lengthy court process to get contact sorted out (initiated by me as he wasn't seeing them due to safeguarding concerns but went over a year not applying to court himself)

Recently court process finally concluded and CAO issued in which it is written that I must 'make the dc available' for contact, but specifically not that I must make sure they attend. 1dc largely refuses to see father (older teen so decides for himself) and another has also begun to struggle to go.

Today I took younger dc to exs town (2hr drive away) for court ordered Easter contact. Dc2 refused to go in with the others. Ex said to go and bring him back if he changed his mind.

I went around corner and spent a long time talking with dc, talking through his feelings, how he can use techniques he knows if he feels stressed, reassuring him and helping him to find a way to feel ok about going. Dc said he wanted to go, so I took him back. Then other two dc started saying they wanted to come home with me and trying to get into car. Had to help and reassure them as well and off I went.

After 10 mins got a call from dc2, saying he had made a mistake and wanted to come home with me and not stay, very distressed. Asked to speak to ex, who said 'come and get him'. I said I was concerned the others might also try to leave and he said it was 'up to them, childrens rights to choose'. I went back and picked up dc2, dc3 and 4 both looked utterly miserable and I drove off feeling like shit all round because I have one totally refusing and 2 who might feel I'm ignoring their feelings.

Throughout the whole comings and goings ex did absolutely nothing to help or encourage any of them about staying. This is a recurrent theme.

He has just sent me a text saying 'Let me know when dc2 wants to come and stay as it would not be in your interest to break the order'.

I feel like replying that I have not broken the order, I made dc2 available and in fact went over and beyond the order by bending over backwards to help and persuade dc2 to go. When dc2 called me to collect him ex told me to come and get him. I had wanted to discuss what might help etc but ex just said come and get him. It wasn't my choice or my instigation.

But is it even worth entering into discussion with him or should I just ignore? He is not a reasonable person, he does not listen, he gaslights and tries anything and everything to draw me into his orbit. Is this just another way of trying to regain some control over me?

In Cafcass report they expressed concerns about his behaviour to and around me and recommended limiting direct contact between us as a result.

As an aside - when he last saw eldest dc he told him that I had spent thousands on court to try to stop ex seeing the dc. Which is just outrageous given he wasn't seeing them and I took him to court to get a CAO precisely because I wanted them to be able to see him in whatever way was safe to do so. I actually spent thousands on court to try to get them to be able to see him again.

Gosh why on earth did you take him to court when your children clearly don’t want to see him

Sounds awful..

How old are they..

I would do the order make available not spend a long time trying to reassure.

It sounds like they are all miserable

I would send him a message, similar to what you put on here. That way it's backed up, should he decide to try to say you have deviated from the court order.

Why on Earth are you doing all this?! ‘Make available for contact’ does not mean ‘drive multiple hours, fanny about and make your kids miserable’. Stop it.

I don’t understand why you forced a situation where neither parties want to see each other.
My ex doesn’t want to see the kids, the kids don’t want to see him. It’s a crap situation all round but it didn’t occur to me to go to court to insist on contact that makes everyone miserable to try to make him be a responsible adult.
Have you shot yourselves in the foot? Not sure what you can do now though

Agree to reply detailing exactly what happened in writing.

Kids really did want to see him. The current refuser in particular spoke a lot, to a lot of people, about wanting to see him. The two who are there now seem to have a good time with dad but just struggle with missing me and I guess found it tricky me coming back to drop and then collect the other one when they were just starting to feel a bit wobbly about a few days away from me. I am confident that they will be happy they went.

I have done and continue to do what I do because I am trying to do the best for the children. It's hard to get things across in a post which you're trying to condense to make readable.

So it's best to reply saying that he asked me to collect dc2 and I haven't broken order because I made him available?

So it's best to reply saying that he asked me to collect dc2 and I haven't broken order because I made him available?

Yes...or summarise exactly what happened in your reply.

So one child wanted to see him so you took him to court to force contact? How bizarre, you would have been better supporting your DS and helping him cope with his absent twat of a dad.
Stop driving them to him, he can collect (if they'll go)

I wouldn't bother responding to that text.

Am also puzzled as to why you are driving them to him.

No, three wanted to see him, one didn't. The one who didn't doesn't have to. The others were unhappy not seeing him and ex kept saying he wanted to see them but didn't go to court, presumably because he didn't want the scrutiny, just wanted me to overlook safeguarding issues and let him see them unsupervised. Which I wouldn't do. I wanted them to be able to see him because they wanted to, but I wanted it to be safe.

Now another one has started to not want to go, and for that reason CAO is worded in a way which allows any who don't want to see him not to.

Next time he doesn't want to go I'll just bring him back again, though last time he stayed home instead he saw d he regretted it towards the end. That's why I wanted to help him feel ok about going this time if he could.

Ex collects for half the contacts and I take them there for the other half.

It's hard trying to condense lots of stuff into a readable op.

So it's best to reply saying that he asked me to collect dc2 and I haven't broken order because I made him available?

I would suggest that you ignore his false accusations, he is just trying to exert control over you. Make sure that you record in a diary everything that you have told us about the visit, and record any further contacts/visits so that you can easily disprove any false accusations.

You sound as though you are doing your very best for your children, keep it up and be strong!

stop calling him and use text messages and emails etc, basically written records only and keep them as proof.

and tell the kids to text you too not call.

Ignore and keep a copy of all texts/emails etc from him, and your reply’s.

@KhansMambo

Why on Earth are you doing all this?! ‘Make available for contact’ does not mean ‘drive multiple hours, fanny about and make your kids miserable’. Stop it.

this, I mean you could do this for awhile and keep contact to texts etc, then put your kids mental health first and cut contact, knowing that you have proof if he tries anything that the kids want nothing to do with him and he makes them depressed and miserable.

It's not your job to persuade them! It's his. Give yourself, and your kids a break.

"Make available for contact" - doesn't that mean you say to your ex they will be ready at 4pm at their home (or somewhere nearby if you don't want ex around your home) for ex to pick up? I don't think you need to put yourself through all this.

You both don't seem to understand how the process works. Unfortunately you can't force a father to see his kids, a court order doesn't mean he has to see them. Why force someone to do something they don't want to do? Maybe that's why your children don't want to go because they know they're not wanted by hun

I'm not making him see them. He said numerous times for the 18months that he wasn't seeing them that he wanted to, was desperate to etc. At the same time 3 of the dc we're getting increasingly upset by not seeing him.

He wanted to see them, unsupervised, with no oversight of things that had happened and no professional input on how things could be made safe. I went to court to get that oversight and input.

It does seem that he doesn't want to see dc2 unless dc2 is easy and perfectly behaved. Dc2 is suspected not NT, his elder sibling who largely chooses not to see dad has ASD. Dad does not appear to be either willing or able to make adjustments to help a ND child. I will not do anything with dc2 going forwards other than make him available and accept his choice if he chooses not to go.

Me taking dc for half of contacts is in CAO. Probably because I moved to escape ex, as well as be closer to my family. It's annoying but fine and doable. Ex collects for half, not from my home because I won't have him there.

I was advised by everybody involved - various mental health people for kids, school SENDCO, childrens services, that getting a CAO would be the best thing and in many ways it has been.

Not least that it is now legally written that they reside with me, he can't take them abroad without permission, and if he refuses to return them ever I can get them back because I have the order.

Obviously there are drawbacks to being held to a court order, but I think the wording minimises those. Pragmatically it was the best thing to do.

I am just trying to do the best I can for the dc, while navigating Exs attempts to regain control of me and as of today to use the dc to continue his attempted alienation of me from my best friend. It's sad that he still wants to do this and to some extent is managing it.