Social Services

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I split with my daughters' father 6 months ago due to his temper and drinking. There were a few incidents when he smashed stuff and shouted at me, the girls witnessed this twice (they were 2 and 4-6m at the time). At first contact was difficult - he wanted to have them over night which I absolutely wouldn't allow, or he would come to the house and see them then be nasty to me. During this period I spoke to women's aid for advice, and got legal advice. I was told if he took me to court he would 100% get unsupervised, court ordered contact as I'd never called the police on him. Therefore I need to ensure it never gets to this point.

Over the last 3 months he's stopped being so high conflict and is really trying. He's working on his drinking and is paying for private therapy. He's been coming to the house to see the girls several evenings a week, having tea with us and helping with bath time. We've also had a few days out together at the weekend. I'm happy with him trying to sort himself out for the kids sake, but we won't be getting back together and he is aware of this.

So womens aid have called to check in for the first time in a while and when I said he was coming over several times a week they said they would need to let social care know - fine, didn't see it as an issue. But social services have just called to ask for some background and to explain the current situation and have said they will need to refer it on to see if any further action is needed. I'm now stressed as to what this could be?

I know my own parenting is beyond reproach and that I'm doing what I need to do to keep the kids safe, so on that front I'm happy for social services to do any assessments they need, that's not an issue. But if he gets wind that I've "reported him" then he will be absolutely devastated and it will undo all the progress we've made. I dont want that for the kids - the current set up is working well and I'm in full control. I'm so worried that they will call him, he will feel I've stabbed him in the back and we will be back to square one.

Sorry for the essay, does anyone have any experience and could tell me what's likely to happen now?

No experience (sorry) but can you phone them back… tell them you’re worried and ask your questions about what happens next?

Him coming to your house several times a week is not a good idea for now. It would be different if he wasn't so abusive, you split up for a while and after a few years you developed a healthy co parenting relationship. But because of his previous behaviour, which I assume wasn't too long ago, he is not deemed safe at the moment to be in your house- at least meet at a mutual place (outside the home) and arrange contact to take place once a week and increase if things go well.

Social services are likely to get involved but they will assess and take account of your current situation. Worse case scenario is that they may say he is not allowed to come in your home but for contact to take place outside home and they will monitor for X amount of months, and if all goes well, they will close the case.

Sorry just read it happened 6 months ago. But still, him coming to your home several times a week should not happen at this stage. At least meet outside the home, let him take the kids out and through then develop a healthy go parenting relationship. Regardless of relationship status or when couples break up, I don't think it's a good idea for exes (even if child's father) to be attending the home several times a week. That's just confuses the kids. At least give it a couple of years.

@secular39 while I do understand what you're saying, I am 100% sure that if I was to tell him he could only see his children once a week in a park etc then he would take me to court, and would be granted unsupervised access which I would have no control over - the worst possible outcome. Both him and the girls would be very upset by the process, as the current set up is working well for everyone.

Also, there were 5 incidents over the space of 3 years where he shouted and/or smashed things, after his drinking got out of control following a bereavement. Never any physical violence. He then handled it badly when I threw him out as he was devastated to lose his home and missed the girls badly. His behaviour has been completely unacceptable which is why were no longer together, and I won't allow him to have the children unsupervised until I'm confident hes no longer drinking but 'so abusive' is a bit of a stretch.

It s been very short time
Too short to prove he really changed

You being with him is just confusing

Him in your house is confusing

If you believe he has changed let him have the kids supervised by someone else or unsupervised at his house day time first

If you not going to get back together then don't do things together except parents evenings etc

His response to you throwing him out was to behave badly and scream and shout til you gave in??? Or ???
Maybe he realises this was wrong
But it is too soon to decide he won't reaCt again

Also, there were 5 incidents over the space of 3 years where he shouted and/or smashed things, after his drinking got out of control following a bereavement. Never any physical violence. He then handled it badly when I threw him out as he was devastated to lose his home and missed the girls badly.

Shouting and/ or smashing things is bad enough. You need to protect your children. Can you 100% say that he isn't just 'behaving himself' to get back into your good books before he starts behaving dangerously again.

Your children deserve better. If he wants to see them he goes through the correct, legal channels.

It also sounds like he is still drinking if he's 'working on his drinking'.

The baby won't be away from me for any period of time, also there's no other adult who can supervise, so contact has to be supervised by me until I'm confident his drinking is under control. I don't believe he's magically changed, I believe he's trying, and I want to keep things amicable which they have been for the last few months. Totally different if the kids were primary school age but they're a baby and toddler, they're not confused about why he's there, they're just happy to see their dad.

Either way, are social services likely to insist that contact has to happen somewhere else? I'm really surprised if so, when things were at their worst they didn't show any interest at all and I was begging for support. So for them to pop up now, when things are stable and on an even keel, I just don't understand it.

I totally get what everyone is saying, but the legal advice that I got was that if I let it get to court, he will be allowed unsupervised access and I'll have to facilitate that. Even if he turns up drunk, I won't be able to prove it so could be prosecuted if I don't hand them over. So I need to allow some form of contact so it doesn't go to court, and him coming to the house is what works best for everyone. He is very aware that if he was to turn up having had a drink or if he was to be unpleasant in any way then contact would stop again.

But if he gets wind that I've "reported him" then he will be absolutely devastated and it will undo all the progress we've made.

This is worrying. By 'undoing the progress we've made' does it mean you think he might kick off? Or go on a massive bender?

I don't think 6 months is long enough to judge that he's ok to be back in your children's life. You say there were 5 incidents over 3 years? Was there a 6 month gap or longer between incidents? I imagine so.

Yes, he is currently down to drinking one night a week. He doesn't visit for 24 hrs after a drink. He's maintained this for 9 weeks so far so still very early days. He knows he won't be allowed the children unsupervised until he's been fully sober for 6 months, and that's what he's aiming for. If it goes through the legal channels I won't be able to put this condition on, and he would probably go back to how he was

Do you still have threatening texts or messages so you could still report to the police so you can get the whole thing done properly and safely.

It feels so risky that he's coming to your house when he's still drinking and was being confrontational only 3 months ago. It's a huge risk to you and your children.

@NerrSnerr the thing is, I don't get to choose if he's in my children's lives. If I fully stop contact, he will take me to court and I will lose all control over contact. Womens aid and the family law solicitors I spoke to were very clear on that. I've got zero evidence, he will definitely get unsupervised contact. I'm trying to manage the situation so the kids are safe and he is trying to get better not taking me to court.

I'm sorry it's an impossible situation. I really hope you're all able to stay safe.

I've got nothing. No evidence at all. I'm not worried he will suddenly kick off - all incidents have been when drinking heavily, and if there was a sniff of alcohol on him he wouldn't get through the door. When I say he was nasty when we first split up, it was more things like telling me he was suicidal, that everything that had happened was my fault because I made him miserable etc. Nothing aggressive just made me feel like shit every time he came for the first couple of months, whereas now he comes over, eats tea, chats to the kids and goes on his merry way. Brings us nappies etc when we need it, sometimes helps bath the toddler. Has stopped pushing for unsupervised and knows he needs to sort himself out first and that its a long road ahead.

Try not to worry, I know this is easier said than done. SS got involved due to DV in my previous relationship. A social worker came round for a chat and cup of tea after I got the police involved. They were incredibly supportive and helpful. I was honest with them and they told me if I didn't leave the relationship then I would end up losing my children or dead. I was advised to take part in the freedom program which I did. They were brilliant and offered help and support at every step.

I think social services can give you advice and guidance if you’re open and honest with them. They’re looking to see if you are able to keep your children safe. Children and babies who experience domestic abuse are at risk of harm so you have to listen to what they say. They will likely assess the situation and both parents parenting capacity. Maybe this could be a good thing for the kids dad so that he can learn how his behaviour impacts on his kids wellbeing and yours too.

I know my own parenting is beyond reproach and that I'm doing what I need to do to keep the kids safe

Other than allowing him to be in their home regularly (several times a week and some weekends) despite this happening for three years and only ending six months ago.

But if he gets wind that I've "reported him" then he will be absolutely devastated and it will undo all the progress we've made. I dont want that for the kids - the current set up is working well and I'm in full control. I'm so worried that they will call him, he will feel I've stabbed him in the back and we will be back to square one.

If you think that him finding out you've done something to safeguard the kids will mean he thinks fuck it, I'm going to make life difficult for her, stop trying and resent her... then he hasn't changed at all has he?

Never any physical violence.

Smashing things while shouting IS physical violence. You think small children wouldn't be terrified by that? That they wouldn't feel scared? He did it five times, twice in front of his tiny kids. Someone sorry would have sought out help after they did it once. He didn't do that after he did it once. Or twice. Or three times. Or four times. He ONLY did it when HE had lost everything. When it benefitted him. Not when it would have benefitted his kids.

If it goes through the legal channels I won't be able to put this condition on, and he would probably go back to how he was

Then he hasn't changed. He can hold you to ransom forever with this.

It's an impossible situation really. This is why reporting to the police when someone is physically smashing things up and shouting, especially in front of kids, is vital. Hopefully someone reading this in future who is at that early stage will be able to see that and do so.

This man hasn't changed and isn't motivated by his children's best interests at all. Only by what HE can gain from being sober(ish). He will hold that over you forever to control you.

He will make you think he'll spiral whenever you make life choices he doesn't like eg having a new partner. He wants your life to be on hold so he is in control and has found the perfect ammunition.

He is awful.

You’ve been given appalling legal advice there. If you have a safeguarding concern - father is drunk - you absolutely do not hand your child over and you would not be ‘prosecuted’ for breaching a court order over that. It is not a given that he would be granted unsupervised access to your children. That is a decision for a judge to make, having heard all of the evidence and countless judges grant orders stating contact must be supervised, even when a victim has not called the police.