Friendship Trouble

[Botero]

I've debated about posting this as it will probably seem pretty boring and a bit of a non issue but since I've been struggling with it for a while, I thought I'd give it a go. I'll try and strike the balance between not leaving things out and then needing to drip feed vs not droning on.

C and I have been friends since we met at university at 18. We are now 34. We were good friends at uni but not best friends but our friendship continued afterwards and over the years has turned into very close friends.

For most of out friendship we have lived in different cities but throughout that have generally seen each other twice a year, been on holiday once a year together and catch up regularly on the phone. The catch ups have been dependent on what has been happening in each of our lives.

At the end of 2019, C moved abroad to live with a new partner, as did I. My relationship did not work out and I moved back to the UK in mid 2020. C stayed together with her partner but they had many issues. During this time C and I spoke roughly around 3 times a week, as she needed a lot of support. Our friendship strengthened further during this period.

In late 2020 I moved to a new UK city where I knew nobody but had been planning on moving to for a long time. I bought a flat here and am in the process of making this my permanent home. C unexpectedly also moved to this city a month after me, as she wanted to move back to the UK with her partner and thought it would be great to live in the same city as me. I was delighted by this.

The issues first arose when C did not want to meet up without bringing her partner along. I get along well with her partner but would also appreciate some time just with her. We spoke about this and both listened well to each other. I saw C sometimes by ourselves and quite a few times all together.

C and her partner hit a rocky patch, which at the stage was common for them and I spoke to C a lot on the phone. As time went on their relationship got better and C started to cancel plans between us. This happened a few times and then C had a frank discussion with me about her expectations for the friendship and that we seeing each other a little too much. At that point it was twice a month. We agreed to compromise and see each other once a month.

C started a job which I knew would take a lot of her time as she adjusted and I didn't see her for two months. At this point I began to have some negative feelings about the friendship. It felt quite wrong that my best friend was 30 minutes walk away and yet we didn't see each other.

In September we arranged to meet up and I spoke to C about this and said that I felt pretty lonely and it was made harder by having her near but not being able to see or speak to her. We agreed that we would still meet once a month and then try and do something a little more spontaneous, like a coffee or a walk every now and then.

C popped in for a coffee two days and it was great. A week later she messaged me and said she wanted to make things clear, that she would be applying for a PHD in the coming months and needed to focus her efforts there so would not be able to see me. I wished her luck and left it at that. But, I was very upset. I had made my needs in this friendship clear (something I don't find the easiest) and I don't think they were too much and C showed me that of all the things going on I was the least important. I really don't think it's that difficult to meet for a coffee once every few weeks.

I messaged C at the end of December to wish her a happy birthday and we had a brief text exchange. During this I asked how the PHD application was going and C said she hadn't really done much because she was busy and it didn't matter as it didn't have a deadline. I didn't say anything to this but it annoyed me.

C and I are due to meet today. I don't think she thinks there is a problem at all, but over the last few months I have given up on the friendship and I'm hurt by it. I'm very unsure about what to do now, partly thinking I just need to grow up and understand friendships change but also thinking I don't want to give my time to someone who has dropped me.

I would really appreciate some advise on how to proceed, or if anyone has experienced something similar. Am I being dramatic to throw this friendship away or does it make sense to not let people treat you like this.

Thank you in advance if you made it through this epic post. I did not find that balance of not droning on!

I don't think she thinks there is a problem at all

That's because C doesn't have a problem.
She knows that you do though - & doesn't care enough to make a small effort to get the friendship back on a more equal footing.

C is the kind of woman who will drop a mate as soon as she has a boyfriend, but expect one-way support when things are rocky with, or she eventually splits up with, the b/f.

I am so sorry I don't have constructive or upbeat advice to give, but C has shown you who she is. Short of exiting the friendship altogether, which would be extreme & also cause you pain, all you can do is decide to enjoy the her company on an occasional basis, but not expect too much from C.

& btw - this is NOT boring or a non-issue - it's hurtful.
You come across as a contemplative, deep person who has supported C unerringly for years. I bet you are a lovely friend.
Focus on other friendships, your own hobbies & interests, & on giving yourself a great deal of self-care over the next few weeks.

C is going to be C - so manage your expectations downward, & be on guard for a resurge of "friendship" if she splits up with her b/f.

Does the friendship have to be all or nothing? That is, can you not enjoy it when it's cut down and not at the same intensity as previously? Friends, whether very close or not, are always hard to find, and if you still enjoy her company, maybe it's worth holding on to it as a more casual friendship. The issue here is the difference in your needs - you need the friendship more than she does, because it seems like she has a lot on to keep her occupied. And maybe you need to do the same - find hobbies, interests, activities etc where you'll meet new people in the same stage of life as you and who you can meet more regularly.

Also, don't give quite so much to any friendship, when friendships get closer because one person is supporting the other through a tough time, they cannot last. That becomes a slightly codependent dynamic that one person will grow out of. Maybe adjust your expectations and see her not as your 'best and closest friend', but as a friend you can enjoy the occasional catch up with and have a great time when you do meet. And I think if you can split the time and attention you need between a few friends, rather than just the one, it is more sustainable for you and them.

Sound as the rest of your advice is, @todaysdilemma, I can't agree with
Also, don't give quite so much to any friendship, when friendships get closer because one person is supporting the other through a tough time, they cannot last.

Friendship is golden. Why would you not put as much into it as you have to give? Would you advise similar withholding in a marriage, or with family members?

My friends & I have often supported each other, in some very trying situations. Not only have those friendships lasted - they have deepened. I think OP should certainly hold back more from C now, to protect herself, given the hard evidence that she is not valued as much as she values.
But as a blanket rule - that's no way to live!

@ChargingBuck

Sound as the rest of your advice is, *@todaysdilemma*, I can't agree with Also, don't give quite so much to any friendship, when friendships get closer because one person is supporting the other through a tough time, they cannot last.

Friendship is golden. Why would you not put as much into it as you have to give? Would you advise similar withholding in a marriage, or with family members?

My friends & I have often supported each other, in some very trying situations. Not only have those friendships lasted - they have deepened. I think OP should certainly hold back more from C now, to protect herself, given the hard evidence that she is not valued as much as she values.
But as a blanket rule - that's no way to live!

I wouldn't compare friendship to a marriage or a relationship, because those are singular relationships - with only one person holding that role in your life. Unless you're polyamorous, you'll have just one partner, and one family unit. And you are also their one. It makes it a lot easier to give and take in equal measures in a 1:1 arrangement.

However, with friends, you can have many. They can have many, and this is key. You may not be their best friend even if they are yours. In the modern age, where we all live away from family anyway, and struggle to even find work-life balance for our children and our selves, it isn't realistic to expect that you can give the same amount of support to multiple friends. The only way this works is if BOTH friends are equally invested in the friendship and have similar needs for it. And it's rarely the case these days because friends don't always grow together or move through life in the same way.

Also partners and family relationships have a lot more at stake - we aren't sharing finances, homes, children, providing health care and carer duties for our friends. So of course these relationships get priority.

So friendship is important but it will very rarely be the priority for anyone, unless it is also someone who has exactly the same emotional needs as you. That's why it's much better to have a wider network of people in your life who can all step in if someone else can't.

@todaysdilemma
My friends & I are grown ups, so we don't pay any attention to relationship rankings & "best friend status".

People are not appliances. They don't need to be assessed for value & assigned various priorities. It's sad that you don't value friendship as highly as romantic relationships.
I'd even hazard that many friendships are for life, whereas 50% of marriages end in divorce ...

Thank you both for your responses. They are hugely helpful and represent both the ways I keep thinking about this issue, although somewhat more deeply.

I have asked C to change our meet today to a phone call as I'm still not sure how to approach this. I think it is best once again to tell her truthfully about how I am feeling and hear her thoughts on it too.

I understand that people's priorities change over time but ultimately don't think it's acceptable to not be a priority at all and to allow that to happen.

C and I have always had fun together but the main element of our friendship was an open honesty that we have with each other where we share everything and help each other with life's struggles as well as celebrating achievements . It would seem fake to meet up every few months for a catch up like a casual friendship.

Thank you again for the advice. I'll continue to reflect on it and see how it goes later.

[quote ChargingBuck]@todaysdilemma
My friends & I are grown ups, so we don't pay any attention to relationship rankings & "best friend status".

People are not appliances. They don't need to be assessed for value & assigned various priorities. It's sad that you don't value friendship as highly as romantic relationships.
I'd even hazard that many friendships are for life, whereas 50% of marriages end in divorce ...[/quote]
We'll have to agree to disagree. I've had all my friendships for over 15-20 years, and the reason they have lasted is because we have ridden out the ebbs and flows of our friendships as we have done life. Understanding that friendships need to evolve and adapt too. The key word is 'friendships' - it isn't just one person, it's many, so I can split my emotional needs across all of them. I also have a family I am very close to, and a partner who meets most of my emotional needs so obviously my needs of a friendship will be different to someone without this support network. I don't expect all friendships to last for life unless you never move away or meet new friends throughout your lifetime - and the ones that do last a lifetime are the ones that allow space for people to grow and dip in an out as life dictates. The type of friendships where you won't speak for months but when you do, it's like no time has passed.

Relationships not lasting forever is irrelevant, because while it does last, it's an extremely important part of anyone's life and can never be compared to a friendship. I wouldn't expect my friend to take time off work to look after me when sick, or make career decisions based on me, or agree to live with an age-ing parent who can't live alone, or financially support me when i've been made redundant etc.

This is also my view. I have a few close friendships (10-20 years plus) where they have ebbed and flowed and for me the reason they are my friends for life are that the friendships have endured the nature of that up and down.

One of them lived with me last year after a breakup, the same friend we have gone a year without speaking before. I am so lucky to have her because not only is she an excellent person to be around, we have the same expectations of each other. We go through phases of seeing each other loads and/or talking most days or going ages without either meeting or talking. I know I could phone her any time and if I needed her, she would be there. And vice versa.

The reason this friendship has lasted and others haven't from my perspective is that I just couldn't always meet the pressure of meeting monthly. I am stretched between a husband, children, my family, other close friends and a few years ago realised I wasn't meeting the needs of anyone, let alone myself. So I dont expect myself to now.

I have a lot of sympathy for you because it does really hurt when your feelings and efforts aren't reciprocated but it does come across that you would rather have that 1 really close friend to lean on for everything and she isn't able to meet the requirements for that (you said she's too busy to apply for her PhD...surely that should be an inkling that she's got a lot of plates spinning and can't add another one?)

You've clearly thought about this a lot but I would encourage you to consider if its worth ending the friendship if you can't get exactly what you need from it. You will struggle to find friendships as intense as that as you get older and people have more commitments.

Thanks again for the replies and I've taken them on board. I am lucky to have quite a few good friends and our friendships have stood the test of time. I've moved around a lot over the years so my friends are dotted around the world and these friendships ebb and flow.

I have a very close friend who I've known since we were 2. Sometimes we speak monthly and other times we don't speak for months, but like it's been described in previous posts, the friendship picks up like it was yesterday we spoke.

I understand that friendships do this, so was struggling to understand why this feels different. I think the difficulty here was that I told my friend I was in need and she left me during this period. It was made harder as she was just a walk away. I'm by no means by myself here though, I have other friends, hobbies and a very intense job that takes me away for weeks at a time. I guess I really just missed my friend and needed her and when I reached out she closed the door.

I don't want to end this friendship and actually didn't end up speaking to C about these things this evening as the conversation on here has given me lots to reflect upon. I have supported C in the past by listening a lot to her problems and now it sounds like the support she needs is more space and I have to accept that.

Thanks again for the replies.

I couldn't help but reply because I have experienced a similar thing but where I was more in the role of C (but with lots of differences in the situation too, so I will try not to project!)

Opinions will vary, but I think it's good you didn't raise this today. In my situation my friend "called me out on" (her words) her perception that I wasn't giving enough to the friendship - in the middle of the first lockdown and with very significant health issues I was dealing with, in relation to an immediate vulnerable family member, amongst other stressors, even including my own PhD - and it led to a dramatic cutting off (her decision) (she does have significant mental health issues, which is likely very different to your own situation, but I was very unsettled by the dramatic and abrupt "cutting off" which in my view really escalated a situation in which I was happy to remain friends!) This was preceded by years of her commenting that we should be doing more together and that she didn't like that we mainly met for meals out. I think ultimately she was seeking more from the friendship than I was able or willing to give, however I was happy to remain friends, but it was really the needling about this and then dramatic cutting off that led to the deterioration/end of the friendship.

Anyway, I am sure your situation is very different. But I have a number of friends similar to the close friendship you and others have mentioned where you've known each other for a long time and may go 6+ months without speaking but when you do it's the same as always. In fact that sounds similar to the dynamic that originally existed between you and your friend. I have lived in the same place all my life so all my friends are within easy driving distance but we may only see each other between 2 and 7 times a year, which is a frequency we are both happy with - and these are treasured friendships to me. I think close friendships with long histories are valuable and if I were in your position, I would try to lower my expectations of my friend, meet her where she's at and broaden my means of getting my own needs met so that I'm not relying too much on any one person. I do see that there is an element here of your friend happily seeking your support when she is struggling but not seeming willing/capable of giving that support when you need it. That is disappointing. As she is a long-standing and valued friend though I would lower my expectations and appreciate what the friendship does offer, rather than "calling her out" on her behaviour because I am sure there are reasons for why she feels she cannot offer more, so confronting/criticising her over this may just push her further away. This was the case in my own situation as a lot of stressors influenced the frequency of our contact so being challenged over that felt very myopic on the part of my friend. And of course we as humans all tend to be primarily focused on ourselves.

You do sound like a lovely, caring and conscientious friend who people would be lucky to have and I wish you all the best in this situation, I am sorry it's been difficult. 🙂