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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Is he a douchebag or I screwed up??

106 replies

AstroGirl5 · 29/12/2021 20:31

I need your help please. I think I may have just lost a great guy, and it might be too late. I met this guy online a month and a half ago. We are both in our early 40s, both divorced, both have two kids. His son lives with him. He just finished his divorce, which started a year ago, and is just finishing with property split. We slept together on something like date 7 - so not too early, that was important to me. And he invited me on a romantic trip to Paris for 3 days - where I am now, and he left.

We were talking about this trip for a long time, planning the logistics, he booked a very romantic hotel, we planned where to go together, made a playlist and so on. Before we went on the trip, I told him I had a slight complication - I would have to pick up my son from his father in Germany on the way back. My son was spending Xmas with his dad, but New Years with me, and that was the only way to make it work. So I asked my new guy whether that would be ok with him - he said of course - and then I said that I then needed to introduce my son to him beforehand so that he is not totally surprised when we pick him up together. He said of course, and suggested he comes to my house - where he ended up meeting both my kids, but I introduced him as a friend - and then we went sledging together.

It seemed rushed though and I told him I normally would not have introduced my kids so early on as it's best to get to know each other first, but that was the situation.

Anyway, then when we met in Paris, two days ago, I asked him if he had told anyone he was going here with me. He said he didn't as the whole trip away was a way to see if we work together as a couple. That was upsetting for me to hear, as I did tell my close friends I was going to Paris and that I met a great guy. By this time, we had been dating for a month and a bit. Then in Paris, we actually had an amazing time, laughing, going to a spa, museums, shopping etc. Earlier, he also had invited me to spend New Year's Eve with him, his friends and his brother upon our return. And so today, I asked him about that, who else would be there and just to know what to expect.

He then said he'd introduce me as a friend. I was surprised - and he then asked what I thought about people being friends if a relationship didn't work out. I suddenly sensed something was really off and asked him what he meant - was he talking about us? A serious conversation started - completely out of the blue, we had been laughing and kissing a minute before and spent an amazing half of the day exploring Montmartre. But suddenly, he said that with his divorce just being finalised, with his kids he needs to take care of, and so on he just can't see a relationship. That Paris is nice but we can't just do Paris - we live in Zurich and we both work and have difficult logistical situations. I said that I agreed but that we could try to make it work, without expectations. But he didn't say that he wanted to even try. He asked several times why we were suddenly having this serious conversation and how we got there so early in dating. That made me wonder - yes, it was still early but we had been dating for a month and a half, in contact every single day, and now on a romantic trip where he invited me. I kind of think that it warranted me wondering at least where this was going.

So I don't know if I again did something wrong. I would love to take it slow, without discussing future trips, and just go with the flow. No introductions to kids or even friends for now, just getting to know each other. At the same time, if somehow on this trip he already felt that something was off - I suppose it's not going to work regardless and he's simply not that into me.

What should I do now? Is there any way to still try and remedy this? Should I wait for him to contact me or should I text him and explain that I don't have any expectations, don't want commitment and don't want a relationship right now either - and then with time we just see how it develops? I worry that I may be too late, again.

OP posts:
ldontWanna · 29/12/2021 23:22

Too much too soon from both of you. You both jumped right in, both feet without looking and now you're coming up for air.

Ignore the intensity(again way too much), and romance and texting and talking every day. It's still 6 weeks. I have sausages in my fridge older than that. Life is not a romcom and treating it that way does not get you a happy ending.

Hawkins001 · 29/12/2021 23:27

All the best op

Glindaswand · 29/12/2021 23:47

‘I have sausages in my fridge older than that’ 🤣

sassbott · 30/12/2021 00:09

It’s all too much too soon. His brain has eventually just caught up with the rest of him. Or someone has read him the riot act asking him what on earth he thinks he is doing.

Leave him be. That’s your best bet. It’s what I’d do anyhows. If and when he re emerges, that’s when you can decide what’s what.

AstroGirl5 · 30/12/2021 08:56

@ldontWanna

Too much too soon from both of you. You both jumped right in, both feet without looking and now you're coming up for air.

Ignore the intensity(again way too much), and romance and texting and talking every day. It's still 6 weeks. I have sausages in my fridge older than that. Life is not a romcom and treating it that way does not get you a happy ending.

Yes - I agree on all accounts. Way too much too soon. Sometimes, though, emotions take over - and even though I was very surprised that he invited me to Paris on date 3, part of me did think it was exciting and romantic. He probably thought so too back then.

So now we are where we are. Thinking back to yesterday, when he said he’d introduce me at the New Year’s Eve party as a friend, I should’ve either said that it was absolutely fine - or just politely said that perhaps it was too soon to have such a party together whether his brother would be. But I didn’t. I got emotional and hurt, and asked him if he saw any future in what was going on. And he ran for the hills.

What I don’t know now is whether he’d be ready to take it slow from where we were before Paris. He texted me yesterday saying sorry and that it wasn’t how he wanted our trip to end. I replied suggesting to rewind to before Paris and just continue getting to know each other, without commitments, kids intros, meeting the family or any talk about any future. He didn’t get back to me.

So what do I do? I would like for us to talk, but I wonder if he’s now already completely made up his mind that we won’t work on any level…

OP posts:
LIZS · 30/12/2021 09:20

Leave it. He has run scared and needs time to rethink. His apology is closure. You've only spent limited time together and are not at the same point in moving on.

SimonedeBeauvoirscat · 30/12/2021 09:27

It makes literally no sense that you would need him to go with you from Paris to Germany then back to CH. why wouldn’t you just part in Paris and head home separately? And what were you planning to do with your son while you were at this NY party - take him along?!

Logistical questions aside, it’s pretty clear that you need to back right off. You’ve stated your position, now just leave it. If he’s in touch again then you can see how you feel about letting him set the terms and pace like this. Obviously you’ve thrown yourself in headfirst and he’s attempting to cool things down a bit.

Naimee87 · 30/12/2021 09:36

@LIZS why do you say this? Unusual for a child to live with dad in CH though. wondering why this was brought up... i live in CH and know a few families where the child/children live with their dad or where custody is a 50/50 split.
@AstroGirl5 Sounds like it was a bit of a whirlwind romance and it's hard not to get swept up in it all. Has he replied to your latest text? I hope you manage to collect your son ok and navigate getting back to ZH feeling the way you do. Not easy to keep emotions in check... Perhaps he'll help cheer you up take your mind off what's gone on until you have some time for yourself again.

Journeynotdestination · 30/12/2021 09:37

Wow, incredible how fast this has happened! But I’ve been in a similar position so can’t criticise, shit happens.

But now I’d back off completely. He’s either decided it’s not going to work for him or he’s genuinely just freaked out. You have to switch off from him & get on with your life.

I do get the introduce as friends things however, it’s so soon after his solid/divorce it probably would seem weird and frankly wrong for him to introduce you as a partner.

Journeynotdestination · 30/12/2021 09:38

Separation not solid!

ibelieveinmirrorballs · 30/12/2021 09:40

@AstroGirl5

He left me early. We were supposed to go back together tomorrow via Germany to pick up my soon, all by train. But he got a flight back to Zurich after the argument tonight.

I pretty much fell in my gut that this is really the end of it. He’s clearly just not that into me, and he saw it in Paris - that we simply wouldn’t work…

Men like this are a nightmare - you’re either the answer to all their problems and the best thing since sliced bread, but then dropped like a hot potato without a second thought. It’s why we should be wary of smooth talking love bombers - the instant smittenness is intoxicating and difficult to resist but often an indicator that they’ll be just as able to instantly turn it off and move onto the next “best thing since sliced bread” person to catch their eye.

You absolutely should not be offering him “commitment lite” at this point - you’d forever be walking on eggshells in case you committed the cardinal sin of ever believing his future faking again.

AstroGirl5 · 30/12/2021 09:42

@SimonedeBeauvoirscat

It makes literally no sense that you would need him to go with you from Paris to Germany then back to CH. why wouldn’t you just part in Paris and head home separately? And what were you planning to do with your son while you were at this NY party - take him along?!

Logistical questions aside, it’s pretty clear that you need to back right off. You’ve stated your position, now just leave it. If he’s in touch again then you can see how you feel about letting him set the terms and pace like this. Obviously you’ve thrown yourself in headfirst and he’s attempting to cool things down a bit.

You’re absolutely right. It actually didn’t occur to me to part in Paris and then get my son by myself. Grrr - so stupid of me, this is exactly what I should’ve suggested.

And for the party - he invited me with my son, as his brother is coming with his kids of a similar age. And I just (stupidly) thought that it would be ok as they had already met.

So yeah, mistakes all around. We had a very nice time together, and when we were dating before Paris, it was indeed absolutely amazing. And I think we both blew it. He was testing me, testing us all along - looking for a long term compatibility so early on. Talking about my tastes in kitchen and bath designs, what car to buy and where to go on his motorbike for our next trip. It was too heavy from his side - but to me, it felt romantic after a year and a half of being single and meeting some weirdos online for just a first date.

Anyway… We just talked on the phone. He’s getting tested after the trip and is worried about Covid, of course, with his brother coming and all. He said he wanted to talk in the afternoon about what happened yesterday… I said to him that the trip was too early, the timing just wasn’t right but we can see if we want to take it slow from here. But he just said let’s talk in the afternoon. So I’m pretty sure he’s made up his mind… It’s sad, very sad actually, and I do feel like I failed his ‘tests’ (a wrong approach to begin with…) - but I just feel that because I handled yesterday’s conversation in such a serious, black-or-white only way, he will not want to give us any other second chance.

OP posts:
Somebodylikeyew · 30/12/2021 09:49

I think you need to stop worrying about what he’s thinking and spend some time working through why you have handled the whole thing like this tbh. That kind of desperate commitment seeking after SIX WEEKS (eapecially when you have kids to think about) is just madness tbh.

ibelieveinmirrorballs · 30/12/2021 09:53

It’s absolutely awful he made you feel like it was a test that you would either pass or fail. Just awful. I know you are feeling sad at the moment, but if you were to continue this anxiety/fear would not disappear.

FallonCarringtonWannabe · 30/12/2021 09:57

He isnt the one. You moved way too fast. This wont end well.

AstroGirl5 · 30/12/2021 09:59

Yes, I agree I handled it badly. I suppose I’m really not good with ‘gut feeling’ - it felt right, and great. I should’ve said no to Paris to begin with - he surprised me with the invite, and then planning everything together. I wasn’t sure till the last moment we were actually going to go. But we did - and we were having an amazing time, visiting museums and going to restaurants and so on.

We were not discussing far future or living together. But I did ask him about next week, for example. I think when people are dating - when it’s been more than a month especially - it’s fine to wonder where this is going and whether we’d meet next week. Of course, we could’ve avoided topics like this and then I could’ve just been waiting for him to invite me on another date after our return from Paris. That probably would’ve been a more responsible option. But indeed, I thought that since it has been several weeks of rather intense romance, it was totally fine to discuss next week or the near future rather than wondering whether he likes me enough to invite me on another date.

So now he wants to talk in the afternoon. I don’t think it’ll be a good talk. It’ll just be him telling me he doesn’t think it will work out on any level, slow or not. So what should I do? Not answer his call? Text him that I’ve decided there’s nothing more to talk about and suggest being friends?

OP posts:
FallonCarringtonWannabe · 30/12/2021 10:03

So what should I do? Not answer his call? Text him that I’ve decided there’s nothing more to talk about and suggest being friends?
No. Ignoring the call solves nothing. Hear him out.
Texting him to suggest being friends is ridiculous. Neither of you want to be friends!

AstroGirl5 · 30/12/2021 10:04

@ibelieveinmirrorballs

It’s absolutely awful he made you feel like it was a test that you would either pass or fail. Just awful. I know you are feeling sad at the moment, but if you were to continue this anxiety/fear would not disappear.
Yes, this constant testing was really quite awful. He even said it point blank that Paris was a ‘milestone’ to get to know each other and see if we would work well together long term. And he constantly asked me my view on stuff like kitchen designs and flat designs and whether I liked brick walls and what colour sports car I would choose as he wants to buy one. That really made me feel like a Q&A exam at school or something. Anyway - too late now. Yes, I’m upset but I just don’t want to seem even more desperate - and as he wants to talk in the afternoon and I’m pretty certain just dump me all over again, I don’t know what to do.
OP posts:
Eslteacher06 · 30/12/2021 10:13

Answer the call and hear him out, and give your thoughts, otherwise you won't get closure.

Tbh it doesn't sound like you're ready to be in a relationship if you're thinking any other way to handle it.

ibelieveinmirrorballs · 30/12/2021 10:13

I agree re taking the call, hear him out but do not suggest being friends.

This is a really good learning experience. Have a listen to some of the Baggage Reclaim podcasts to help you through it - there are several episodes which will speak to your situation I think (eg this one on fast intimacy

Justmuddlingalong · 30/12/2021 10:14

I'm sorry, but your reaction to him treating you badly, seems to be to clutch at any semblance of a relationship with him. I agree with you not wanting to appear desperate, but your behaviour now sounds just that.

EarringsandLipstick · 30/12/2021 10:15

@Somebodylikeyew

I think you need to stop worrying about what he’s thinking and spend some time working through why you have handled the whole thing like this tbh. That kind of desperate commitment seeking after SIX WEEKS (eapecially when you have kids to think about) is just madness tbh.
This is good advice.

Don't think about him or this afternoon's conversation.

Move on, and focus on you. 💐

LeifSan · 30/12/2021 10:16

@AstroGirl5

Indeed. I think after a month and a half, hours on the phone, constant texting and several long dates - and now a trip - there should be at least a conversation about some commitment! But yeah, he either got cold feet or simply decided - in Paris, spending hours and days together - that we will not work.

It’s all been rushed. His invite to Paris and to celebrate NY eve with his brother (ie his family) was also way too soon. Exciting - yes, and made me wonder if magically he was ‘the one’ haha. But rationally speaking, I should’ve said no to Paris. And meeting his family. He rushed - and then himself got cold feet.

Anyway, he just texted, apologising for how the trip ended. I replied - saying that if he wanted to rewind to before Paris and just do dating without expectations and heavy stuff, I’d love to do that.

I wonder if he will reply. But I feel that this particular relationship is now over…

Hang on a sec - you were the one posting the other week about how you were worried he was hiding you from friends despite the NYE invite. You were asking him about meeting family and friends. Now you’re saying HE rushed?

You’ve posted a lot of threads about this guy since the beginning of December - it’s very full on for only 6 weeks of dating from your part. I think you’ve been rushing things along and being very anxious about it all. You’re only six weeks in and you appear to be constantly questioning whether this situation is going to be a long-term thing or he is ‘the one’ - that’s a LOT of pressure for anyone.

This man has barley come out of a divorce and you’re really pushing him from what I can make out and are extremely anxious about whether he’s going to commit. It’s just too much too fast and i’m not surprised he’s backing off.

Can you try and relax a bit and just enjoy getting to know him? If his recent divorce and your respective practical situations mean you can’t see as much of each other as you want or get the sort of commitment you seem to be looking for then perhaps this guy is not right for you at the moment.

Eslteacher06 · 30/12/2021 10:19

I too have noticed the multiple posts about the same thing. I get it you're anxious to make this work, but it just confirms to me that you're not ready for a relationship. He can smell the desperation a mile off (I can, and I'm in a different country to you!)

TheOccupier · 30/12/2021 10:21

@AstroGirl5
Yes, this constant testing was really quite awful. He even said it point blank that Paris was a ‘milestone’ to get to know each other and see if we would work well together long term. And he constantly asked me my view on stuff like kitchen designs and flat designs and whether I liked brick walls and what colour sports car I would choose as he wants to buy one. That really made me feel like a Q&A exam at school or something.

He is not over the failure of his marriage. The "testing" is him trying to mitigate the risk of another relationship failing. This is his issue, not yours - he is used to being part of a couple and probably misses that, hence wanting to plan trips etc, but he isn't emotionally ready for a new relationship.

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