Am I wrong? (Male input requested!)

[Lastoftheenglishroses]

Possibly a long post - apologies in advance.

I started dating someone last year, we split up earlier this year and tried again from July. Things have been much different and improved, however this weekend it seems old issues are still present.

Prior to this relationship, I was with an older man between 2016 - 2019. Our relationship was difficult for a number of reasons and as of January 2019 we carried on living together just as friends, in separate rooms. This wasn’t the best idea for either of us it turned out and I ended up moving out into a rental at the beginning of lockdown. We didn’t speak for a while however ended up having discussions and agreed to be friends as we’d been through so much together. We saw each other sporadically last year and kept in touch mostly via text. That was until after I split up with my partner earlier this year and I was in a bad place due to that and other issues. My friend commented how he was worried when I went to pick up some post he had for me (in addition to my closest friends) and I ended up on anti-depressant medication. I was also renovating a house and aside from supporting me as a friend during my difficult time, he helped me with DIY/tasks I couldn’t do alone when moving into my new home. There are no romantic feelings there and I truly think of him as a good friend only.

My most recent partner is younger than me and has an ongoing issue with my friendship with my ‘ex’. He has a problem with his age and also about my ongoing contact with him. He sees it always ‘running to him’ if we have an argument and I happen to talk to him (which hasn’t occurred since last year) and for some reason is obsessed with the thought I have slept with him, which is absolutely not the case - not even when we carried on living together as friends. I have tried to explain this but all my most recent partner can see is me spending time with an ex, not a friend. We had an argument over the weekend and he tells me he saw his ex-girlfriend as I’d suggested (I didn’t, but have said before I wouldn’t have an issue if they had carried on being friends after ending their relationship). He said he didn’t like it and ‘could see how seeing an ex goes’. He cannot seem to differentiate between an ongoing friendship with someone you happened to be in a relationship with previously and randomly meeting up with an ex-partner you are not friends with and have not maintained contact with since splitting. I should also say he went onto my phone last year and read our text messages and also seems to be aware that my friend text me this weekend (albeit only to ask how the remaining work on my house was going and to ask for the website links for where I bought my internal doors and handles from!)

He believes that most if not all men would not put up with this from their partner/wife and says if his friends knew they would think of him as stupid. So, men (and women) - am I wrong? Am I being unfair in expecting him to be able to understand and accept my friendship?

I can see his point - it sounds like your ex is pretty much your best friend. It's him you turn to for support, regular messaging, helping each other out with stuff. It sounds like there's a significant emotional tie there, even though nothing physical is going on.

Your bf obviously can't handle that, so it comes down to who you want more - your bf or a close relationship with your ex?

I'm friends with all of my exes, but we're not close, just speak occasionally, and usually only in a group thing when we catching up with mutual friends. It is quite possible to be friends with ex partners, but only after you've gone through the stages of grief and got over the relationship (which you may well have done). But being really close, best friends is likely to be off putting for any new partner.

It’s a tough one, I think I’d trust you but how sure are you of your ex’s intentions? Has he dated since? Is he just lurking around to be the shoulder in case this relationship struggles?

I think it’d be something I’d keep a beady eye on personally. Hiding things, increasing frequency of communication would be red flags for me.

In time the status quo might settle.

He believes that most if not all men would not put up with this from their partner/wife and says if his friends knew they would think of him as stupid. So, men (and women) - am I wrong? Am I being unfair in expecting him to be able to understand and accept my friendship?

For me this is one of the reddest flags of all. He doesn't want you hanging out with your ex because he views you as his now - his property, his trophy, his proof of his manliness. He thinks the fact you have a nice normal platonic relationship with someone you happen to have shagged is emasculating - he can't stand the thought of you having had a sex life before him. He thinks all men are like this hence the worry about what his stupid friends think.

They're not all like this. In healthy relationships there's no policing of your partner's friendships. I know several former couples who still hang out in the same social circles happily even though they're both married to different people now. DP has never once been bothered about a couple of my old FWBs still being friends (nor I with his exes). In almost all cases there are very good reasons those relationships didn't last.

Your current BF sounds a bit emotionally immature, as he doesn't sound like he's handling this very well.

Having a girlfriend that was practically best friends with her ex that ended 2 years ago would not be my first choice to be honest.

I'd likely see it as a red flag and not get involved with you. I'd wonder why you didn't have other best friends that you became so platonically close (pandemic aside) to your ex lover. I'd be thinking about the scenario of when you go running off to him when we both have a beef with each other (it happens) - it would amplify the feelings. Even if platonic, as a guy, I'd be suspicious about your ex being sexually attracted to you, and those little moments of vulnerability we all have.

I'm friends with a number of past girlfriends. Very good friends with one in particular, but we were never in each other's pockets. We see each other frequently in groups, and a couple of times a year max one to one.

You are where you are now though. I think a lot of men would have some issue with this. I think if I'd fallen for someone and ignored the red flag, I'd put up with it, despite it not being my preference. I think if you want to keep you best friend relationship with your ex, you'll need to find someone that is very understanding of feelings and a 10/10 with emotional maturity.

Umm tricky, your new partner sounds a bit immature and bit of jealous of the history you have with your Ex.

BUT, I do see his point, I don’t think anyone (man or woman), would be able to feel really settled in an ex was still in the shadows, bit of an elephant in the room really,
So yes, overall I would say you are being a bit unfair in expecting your partner to accept this friendship, but of course, your friends your choice 🤷🏼‍♂️ So he has have like it or lump it really.

Personally I wouldn’t like this either and it would probably cause resentment and mistrust

Thanks everyone.

I can understand his point of view and I suppose it’s easy for me to think he is being unreasonable as I understand mine and my ex’s dynamic and history, whereas he doesn’t (and doesn’t want to know, despite me being happy with discussing/explaining anything he wants to know).

I should say I have other close friends and one very best friend who is female. I would not call my ex a best friend by any stretch; I did see him more regularly admittedly when I was moving as he has a vast knowledge of DIY/‘man’ tasks and was willing to help me when I was really struggling. He was also a support emotionally because he knows me better than most I suppose. Until this weekend however, the last time we had contact was when he text to wish me a happy birthday 4 weeks ago. My time and effort since trying again with my recent partner (I refer to him as that as he has told me our relationship is over as of Monday) has been spent with/directed towards him.

To answer another question raised above, my ex has dated briefly but he has been through stuff himself in the last year so has been concentrating on that and also making improvements to his own home in addition to long work hours.

Whether there is a way back I don’t know, but I feel it’s unreasonable to be asked ‘it’s me or him’ but I also don’t want to make someone I Iove uncomfortable. How would you move forward in this situation?

How would you move forward in this situation?

I would make it very clear that I do not expect to have to choose between a friend and a partner. Ever.

I would tell the boyfriend that if he doesn't trust me enough to keep things appropriate with an ex, perhaps he doesn't trust enough to be in an adult relationship.

I would also pull him up on his "all men think like this" nonsense that implies he thinks another man hanging around is a threat to his masculinity.

I would make it crystal clear that this is a problem he has to sort out in his head - not in my actions.

I would be very close to ending the relationship. I'm not an automatic LTB-er but this is fundamental for me. Don't police who I'm friends with or when I see them.

Whether there is a way back I don’t know, but I feel it’s unreasonable to be asked ‘it’s me or him’ but I also don’t want to make someone I Iove uncomfortable. How would you move forward in this situation?

Hmm another tricky one, personally I’ve been burnt when as Ex has reappeared on the scene and I’ve been the one being dropped like a hot potato so I would look for actions on your part to put some distance between you and your ex (but again that’s just based on my previous experiences),
Certainly agree that the him or me style ultimatum leaves no room for a way out and can easily backfire ( or not depending on your POV)
Ultimately I suppose you need to decide which relationship you value more?

I'd end the relationship. I don't think it'll work out in the end.

I'm not sure how hard you qualified your current BF with the relationship with your ex at the beginning, but I'd make sure the next relationship you go into, you are incredibly explicit about it before feels develop.

Some of the responses on here are confusing - it is wholly inappropriate to have a close "best friend" like relationship with your ex, or anyone you used to date or sleep with. I wouldn't expect my husband to share his personal problems with an ex-gf before me and I wouldnt think it was appropriate for me to do so.

Nothing to do with thinking you "own" someone, it's just called having appropriate boundaries.

Wouldn't bother me in the least tbh. I have female friends and I don't see it as a big deal. In fact, being on good terms with an ex is a "green flag" rather than a red one.

Your BF sounds immature and insecure.

"if his friends knew they would think of him as stupid"

Is he 15? Why would a grown man be bothered what his friends think?

Name-changed for this.

I had an ex who I dated when I was younger, we had a great relationship, as well as a friendship and he was my soul-mate, my first love, timing wasn’t right and we both split amicably but still kept in touch for many years, mainly on Facebook/Messenger. He knew my personality well and always made me laugh and I thought it was just that, a friendship. Until one day, he sent me a message asking if we had both been single, do I think things would be different between us, he also started to reminisce about our past and said he often thought about me and it made me question everything, I was actually planning my wedding to my fiancé at the time and he was in a long-term relationship too. I don’t think he wanted me to leave my fiancé but I felt he was becoming emotionally connected and I realised that I had to call this friendship off that we had, it was playing with my mind and in the end I had to end contact. I think you can be friends with an ex but there’s always that history and attachment between you both and you’d have to ensure you didn’t involve yourself too much emotionally.

If I hadn’t have been with my fiancé, at the time, then I have no doubt we’d be together today.

Right or wrong asside, your new bf is controlling and spiteful. That whole seeing his gf comment was deliberate spite. Once contempt enters a relationship, the relationship is over.

Generally speaking I think your friendship with your ex sounds fine in this particular circumstance. So long as you are never meeting him in private places, alone (which would be disrespectful to your partner). As long as you are also sure there is no interest in you romantically from him. Hmm...hard for us to judge.

But your current bf is petty, petulant and problematic. Walk.

Aldo, how does he know your friend texted you? Has he tapped your phone? I'd be worried if I were you, he sounds obsessed.

Thanks again for the new replies.

It’s a real mixed bag, I can see some people are ok with it (seemingly those who have experienced it themselves) and others would not entertain it at all.

But yes, @Pinkbonbon he read my phone last year and appears to have accessed my WhatsApp remotely to see the texts from this weekend given they were sent after I last saw him. He had been fine up until this weekend, things had been better than ever. But I guess sooner or later the old behaviour (if someone hasn’t changed in the way they say) will come out.

Why are the most inappropriate partners the ones we love the most? Rhetorical question!

I wouldn't class that as 'innapropriate' op, I class that as fucking terrifying.

He is reading your private messages remotely.
That's some straight up psychopath shit right there. Goodness knows how long he has been doing that. He could even be accessing other private accounts you have. Hell, he could be reading your posts here.

This is straight in the bin -and change your bloody locks asap- territory.

Pretty standard male behaviour, especially if he's younger and sees this older (possibly more financially established) male "sniffing" around "his" woman.
Ultimately he knows that 99% of men sniff around women for the chance if the Shag.

Unless you're a wind up merchant you must know this??

On whatsapp, go to the menu on the top right and then into linked devices. It'll show you any device he's paired your WhatsApp account to, and you can impair to yourself.

Regardless of the friendship with your ex, snooping like that is not on, that's a criminal offence and a reason to LTB right now.

I'd be quite worried about such an immature reaction. Do you really want to be 'modifying' your behaviour to suit this guy?

@Pinkbonbon

Aldo, how does he know your friend texted you? Has he tapped your phone? I'd be worried if I were you, he sounds obsessed.

Yeah, a factory reset sounds in order.

OP I don't think this is a yes/no, man/woman thing. I don't think most people in a monogamous relationship would be happy their partner was so close to an ex. But equally your latest ex (?) sounds like a controlling, immature tosser. His friends would laugh at him, really dude?!

I’ve turned on two-step verification on WhatsApp now. I did check on WhatsApp web and on the app and there are no linked devices so I’m out of ideas on that front 🤷🏻‍♀️

Thanks for everyone’s thoughts, and to clarify @Watchingyou2sleezes - no I’m not a wind up merchant and I refute that 99% of men just ‘sniff’ around women for the chance of a shag and that genuine male-female friendships can exist.

@Pinkbonbon

I wouldn't class that as 'innapropriate' op, I class that as fucking terrifying.

He is reading your private messages remotely.
That's some straight up psychopath shit right there. Goodness knows how long he has been doing that. He could even be accessing other private accounts you have. Hell, he could be reading your posts here.

This is straight in the bin -and change your bloody locks asap- territory.

Agree.

Can't emphasise enough how much this sort of snooping is not to be tolerated. And potentially dangerous.

Pretty standard male behaviour, especially if he's younger and sees this older (possibly more financially established) male "sniffing" around "his" woman.
Ultimately he knows that 99% of men sniff around women for the chance if the Shag.

This is such a grim way of viewing male-female relationships. Luckily it's bollocks.

I second everything Pinkbonbon said. He's controlling who you can be friends with and stalking you by monitoring your communications

This all falls under coercive control and will only get worse. The only men who have ever had an issue with my friendship with an ex were ALL abusive bastards.

You split up previously for a reason so I imagine these are not the only abusive traits he has already shown you.

Don't walk, run!!! This is exactly what the start if abuse looks like.

Probably already unlinked it because he realised he had gave himself away with his comment.

Either way op, he is controlling and it's not OK.

I wonder what the response would be re the friendship if the OP was talking about if her boyfriend had this relationship with an older ex lover?

Aside from that - the remote linking of your whats app is scary - time to walk from this relationship.