Feel so low about DS and DIL

[Casiloco]

They are having marriage difficulties and for context, my DS has suffered with MH difficulties (as my DH and his father before him did). I love both DS and DIL dearly and we have tried to supportive but not interfere.
When they are struggling and have a "blow up" which affects my DS to the point of feeling despairing, he needs someone to talk to and has tried counselling to varying levels of success.
But sometimes - we are close - he will phone when he is feeling particularly low about it all or if they have had a major argument. I make it clear I am not here to take sides and if I'm talking to him, the emphasis will always be on what he could do to help matters. Once or twice she has also shared with me (she has no family in the country and says that she has talked to me more about personal things than to her own DM) and I will just be supportive and allow her to talk about how she feels. she admits she has a temper and I've asked her how she thinks the anger could be dealt with more constructively
But I feel I'm being trapped into feeling responsible for "fixing them" and I know that is wrong.
Anyway, things are not good atm and it is really getting to me. I am feeling v low and wonder if it's normal to have this reaction. I feel pressure to say the right thing to each of them. They both still really love each other but seem unable to avoid these explosive arguments - about minor matters, it seems.
My DS has recently been weaning himself off anti-depressants and they have had a v stressful year - moved house, new baby, extreme work stresses, the pandemic of course.
I know they found the Relate counsellor pretty useless - she had nothing positive to say to them either individually or about their relationship. Was v much of the school of "I'll just sit and listen and you can sort it out" when I think they are looking for practical guidance.
Anyway, I am tearful whenever these crises arise - which is not me at all - and just feeling a bit lost in it all. It is so painful seeing them both suffer. Help.

This must be difficult as you want to support your son (& DIL) but it’s not fair of them to run to you to sort out their marriage issues.

Maybe just listen to your son but ultimately suggest that he needs to find a solution with her himself and communicate. You are not in their relationship so only they can really work out the issues together and try and make it work. I would point out marriage is not easy and has to be worked at. I think a lot of people nowadays don’t realise this (& seem to separate at a drop of a hat) and perhaps have higher expectations.

If the issues are minor, perhaps point this out, for him to get a bit of perspective.

You shouldn’t be taking on their worries, although I understand you want to be supportive if your son is fragile, otherwise how long will it go on for?

I would listen but say they need to sort it between them. What can you or Relate do? They need to work out how to communicate with each other.

You sound lovely.

They've got a new baby, don't all couples argue over relatively minor issues at that time? Try to not to worry too much, and just give what you can

Can you give practical support? Help with the baby or babysitting to give them a break and / or chance to communicate properly?

I think it's normal to feel sad at this situation.

But you certainly are not responsible for fixing their problems (and obviously you couldn't anyway).

I think the listening ear approach is the right one actually. If you offer advice or your opinion it will come back to bite you at some point down the road if it doesn't work out.

Concentrate on maintaining your relationships with them and being supportive, not an actor in their troubles.

Thanks all for your kindness - You have confirmed that I need to be less of the "go to" person. Have suggested some other counsellors who come recommended.
I think I just needed to offload so it has helped putting all down in writing.

If they are arguing a lot and going to relate, things sound pretty dire to me TBH. Yes it's been a stressful time for them, but even still this doesn't sound healthy. Particularly not for them to both be offloading onto you constantly.

I had to admit what you have described as a history of MH problems in the male side of the family, some people would read as manchildren who have been babied by the women in the family.

I think you need to step in for the sake of your grandchild and remind them that this isn't good for the baby. Tell them to stop fighting, get over themselves or separate.

FWIW, when my own marriage was going through a rocky patch, my parents also have me the tough love approach. They were honest and told me I was the problem (which I was but didn't want to admit it). It was actually the most helpful advice I've ever had.

You sound like a really supportive mum and MIL, and they are lucky to have you. I do think though, that the way you are feeling is your body's way of telling you that it's time to step back. As much as I understand your intentions, both of them speaking to you could cause some real issues, for example DIL may feel hurt that everytime they have a disagreement he is calling his mum to speak about it, and feel uncomfortable about this. Or DS may start to feel unhappy that his mum is supporting DIL when he feels you should be supporting him. It could also lead to "Well, DM/MIL said bla bla bla" and you could find yourself caught in the middle. Remember to look after yourself op ❤

I've struggled with my mental health and also had some relationship issues.

Firstly is now really the time for your son to wean himself off antidepressants, given all the stresses you've listed? It's his problem not yours but if he's turning to you for advice and support perhaps you could gently suggest that he reconsiders and discusses it with his GP.

Secondly, Relate is not great, based on my experience and what I've heard from friends and mumsnet. But a good couple's counsellor can work wonders. They need to find a professional and not rely so heavily on you. DH and I did counselling via video call (after DC's bedtime) with a therapist I found on here www.gottman.com/couples/find-a-therapist/
She was good and it was very helpful.

I advise you to encourage them to find a better therapist and to step back. You've been very generous with your support so far but there's only so much you can give.

They need to ask around and find a GREAT therapist that does couples work.

If they can get recommendations great, then ring each one up and explain the issues they have and the resolution they are looking for.

It sounds like they have massive communication issues between them and are both stuck in childhood cycles and possibly completely trigger each other.

I am not surprised you are find it upsetting

It does sound very upsetting. Also feel ok about changing the subject. You don't want to reach the point of dreading their calls.

I think as a pp said gentle encouragement for your ds to go to see his GP would be good.

I agree around the antidepressants. With a new baby and things being hectic he needs to stay on them. His dw will be quite hormonal after a birth and needs lots of support and understanding not a dh coming off his meds. It is totally unwise. He needs to be the strong one and at his best at the moment.
It might be better for you to say something like l'm sure ye will work it out ..rather than getting involved.
Does your ds take advice? My ds had difficulties during lockdown with his dp and when he chatted to me l took the risk of saying..this is actually
you !! And luckily he listened. It was like he had got into this spiral and was convinced he was the victim. Once he snapped out f that things went well.
But back on those meds until life is on an even keel. Maybe dil feels she has anger issues but it may be your ds frustrating her and then she loses it. At this moment with a new baby it's all on him l think.

*Butterflybookkepper"

Neither my FIL nor my DH have been babied by the women in their life, I can assure you. The first committed suicide and my DH had a major clinical depression (hospitalised) 15 years ago.

You are right though about the potential negative effects on my DGD - I have pointed out their responsibilities about this.

Some good Mumsnet wisdom here thanks. I did wonder about the timing of coming off antidepressants, so will have a word on that and I. also worry that I could get caught in the middle.

One of the difficulties seeems to be that they have v different reactions to disagreements - he always wants to talk it through and finds silence very anxiety-inducing, whereas she will either go silent or explode.

Anyway, hopefully a good therapist will be able to help them through that.