Estranged Grandfather

[Bracey56]

My Dad lost contact with me and my brother and sister when we were teenagers and I have seen him in person 3 times in the last 15 years. My parents divorced when we were very young and my mum had full custody, we saw Dad on Saturdays and then just special occasions as we grew older but never overnight. My mum passed away when we were teenagers and guardianship was awarded to my Grandmother. After this he chose to cease contact with us completely. He now sends birthday cards and we sometimes chat briefly on Facbeook messenger.

I now have a 4 year old child and my brother also has 3 young children. We have both reached out to him when our children were born to ask if he wants to meet his grandchildren to be either ignored or half promises so has never met them. He sends them birthday and christmas cards and £20 cash.

He rang me last week for the first time in 7 years to say he was going to be staying in our nearest city with a new girlfriend and whether I could help him get in touch with my brother (no mention of children). I passed on the message and my brother has arranged to meet up with our dad for a drink after work tonight without any children. My brother has asked me to come with him (no invite directly from Dad). My brother and I have both agreed that if he wants to meet our children the next day then he would have to make more regular visits otherwise it might confuse or upset the oldest two children who will ask about him if they meet him.

My husband is very hesitant to let my Dad meet our child. He doesn't think that my Dad will make more regular visits, and he thinks our child is going to be confused and upset when he realises he isn't going to see his Grandfather very often and then ask difficult questions. He is only 4 so I don't want to tell him all the horrible details. To make matters worse, my child has created these fake stories and memories that he and my Dad have been on together. So we are concerned that our child is going to think my Dad is the most wonderful person which we will have to go along with.

My Dad is a narcissist and doesn't deserve to meet his beautiful grandchildren and I don't want him to inflict that same sense of loss and abandonment on my child. However, on the other hand am I punishing my child because of what my Dad did to us and my child should have the chance to meet his Grandfather?

I'd be grateful for people's thoughts or advice on this. Thanks!

Think your DH is right. Your Dad has not been in any form of regular contact from your own childhood onwards.

Re your comments in quotemarks:
"My Dad is a narcissist and doesn't deserve to meet his beautiful grandchildren and I don't want him to inflict that same sense of loss and abandonment on my child".

Correct. He's never made much, if any, real effort with you as his DD from childhood either. He's only contacted your brother also because he wants something from him.

"However, on the other hand am I punishing my child because of what my Dad did to us and my child should have the chance to meet his Grandfather?"

No. Your child will not miss what they have never had. It is not possible to have a relationship with a narcissist in any event and you indeed don't have a relationship with your dad. All he cares about is his own self.

If the other set of grandparents are nice then concentrate your efforts on them.

I don’t know why you are trying yourself in knots over this.
He hasn’t asked to meet your children, he hasn’t actually asked to meet you, you are tagging along with your brother.
I say this as the child of a man I went NC with because I was pg and I didn’t want him near my children, he’s nothing to them and so you are not denying them anything

Children are often quite indiscriminate in their love which is why they need parents to guide them. Not every person is safe to have around and this is a good time to teach that important life lesson. The more matter-of-fact you are, the more matter-of-fact your children will be. When we act hysterical, they will usually reflect our hysteria. If you act anxious, they will act anxious. If you appear unsure, they will push. Model the reaction and attitude you want your children to adopt.

If you have another set of grandparents in the picture then focus on them. It is rare that both sets of grandparents are nasty. Emphasize to your children how much we enjoy being around grandma and grandpa so-and-so (the decent and loving grandparents). Cultivate your children's relationship with the decent, loving grandparents. Teach your children to be grateful for the decent, loving grandparents. Gratitude is a highly effective antidote to loss. Focus them on what they have, not what they don't have. Model that attitude of gratitude.

You will find that the children will eventually stop mentioning the loss of the narcissist grandparent if you are not bringing it up. If you are talking about your Nparent in the hearing of your children then you are inviting them to keep talking about it, too. I can not over-emphasize the need for your explanation to a younger child to be calm, pragmatic, measured and short. Long explanations make you look defensive which will tend to peak the interest of the child and prompt him to push the issue. You can gauge what is appropriate information depending on the age of the child. If the child is older and has experienced or witnessed the grandparent's nastiness in action then you can say more.

We have an excellent relationship with my husbands parents, and my child sees them every week. He is particularly fond of his Papa.

We don't talk about my Dad at home at all, he is not a topic of conversation. This isn't even deliberate, he has just not been part of our lives for so long that there is no need to talk about him. We open his cards and tell my child who it is from and my Dad signs it as Grandad Surname . We put the cards up with the rest of them and thats that.
The only time my Dad is spoken about is out of the blue by my child who says things like "Grandad Surname taught me how to ride my bicycle when I was a little boy" or "I've been here before with Grandad Surname" We've just always responded with, "that's nice, or ooh have you". and not commented any further.

Thanks for all the advice, I think I just needed to hear it frankly from someone that wasn't so close to it. I am not going to let my child go tomorrow, probably go and see his other grandparents and go to the beach instead!

I mean.....your child wasn't invited?

And actually neither are you???

My kids don't see their grandparents very often because they live in different countries and it doesn't confuse them.

But if your dad is a narcissist then I wouldn't be seeing him or letting my kids see him. The fact that he didn't look after you after your mum died is awful.

If he (your “dad” as he’s not any kind of dad in my mind) asks to meet the children the next day or at any time you simply reply “no, that’s not convenient” or if you want to be stronger about it “no that’s not going to happen unless your behaviour towards me changes significantly”.

My brother has assumed that my Dad wants to meet the children and I've only heard things through him after he spoke to my Dad on the phone. So I can only go from what he has told me about plans for meeting the children on Saturday.

I wouldn't assume a damn thing with this man who has never had any interest whatsoever.

He wants a pint, with an adult. That's all. If he wants to actually see the kids then he can actually ask directly. But I bet he won't. It'll be half promises again.

I would not subject my child to his whims.

I replied to my Dad last week to say that we wouldn't let him meet our child if he was going to continue to disappear for 10 years at a time etc. He didn't respond to me and I've just heard things from my brother since.

I would see how your own meeting with him goes before worrying about your children - you're way way ahead of yourself.

I think you should gently correct your child when he says he remembers this grandad doing things with him. I can't understand why you just don't say what actually happened.