I think I'm toxic

[SouthernHills85]

Exactly the title I guess.
I think I'm the toxic one in our relationship.
With dh for 16 years and married for 8 with 2 young kids.

I'm not happy at the moment and am trying to make changes to my life to be happy and as I dissect our relationship I've started to realise that I think I am hitting a lot of key points for toxicity in relationships.

Are people always toxic, or is part of it because I'm not compatible with dh anymore as we've grown up, and that has led to us moving towards bad behaviour/habits.

My fears are:

I am quite critical of him (I'm a perfectionist and highly highly critical of myself too)

I don't really show him much affection anymore, it feels like I say "I love you" out of habit, not because I feel it. I kind of feel like he's a good friend there is no "heart filled with joy", it's just comfortable I guess. Is this just covid isolation/fall out, I can't even remember what things were like before anymore.

I get frustrated and annoyed at him easily, am short with him, we both can't seem to say much to each other without it being a dig or in a stressed tone or I take things he says poorly and respond by snapping.

I resent the fact that we live near his family and friends as he didn't want to move. I was quite depressed a decade ago and was desperate to be closer to my family but he said no, which is fair enough. But then he doesn't arrange to do anything with his family. Even though his friends now all have kids too, we don't do anything with them either and he never has "dad" days out with the kids and his friends (and kids) yet i take the kids for days out with my mum friends.
I also resent the fact that he cheated about 9 years ago and never went above and beyond to rectify it.

Am I toxic, what can I do to work on it? Is it just that we aren't right for each other anymore or will I always be toxic.

Did all this resent start after his affair? For me that would be the key turning point in a relationship. I wouldn't condemn yourself as a toxic person just yet. It might all stem from his infidelity.

*resentment

I don’t think “toxic” is a particularly useful (or even meaningful) word for anybody, whatever the circumstances. You sound like a couple bogged down in lots of frustration with and resentment for each other, navigating life without having each other’s backs, and therefore not treating each other with much respect and kindness. His affair isn’t going to have helped anything; although to some extent, if you agreed to stay together all those years ago when you found out, it isn’t fair to continue returning to it.

Do you still want to be together? It sounds as though you’d be much better placed having a proper open conversation about whether either of you think what you have is worth fighting for and whether you’re both able and willing to put in the effort, or whether it might be time to cal it quits and try to separate as amicably as possible, rather than worrying about labels like “toxic” and who they might apply to.

Cheating is pretty toxic behaviour.

You don't sound like a toxic person. Firstly, really toxic people tend not to have the self-awareness or guilt to contemplate that about themselves. Secondly, while the behaviour you describe in yourself is obviously not ideal, it's honestly just commonplace irritation between two people whose relationship has dried up and who don't like each other much any more.

To what extent has it dried up? To what extent is it fixable? Do you want to fix it, or does the idea of ending it bring you relief? Only you can answer those questions. Fixing it will necessitate hard work on both your part and his, but I know couples who've come back from worse. But there's no shame in admitting it's the end of the road, either.

I see your points for sure.

Affair happened after I resented the move I think my depression could have led to the affair

I hate the fact that the affair still haunts my mind and I was a one time thing and didn't go as far as sex from what I know.
I suppose I lacked any self confidence or self worth at that time so when I initially found out I cried, got angry and then had sex with him to exert my ownership or something, god I don't even know why. I think I was terrified it was over but instead of him fighting to save it, it was all me.
I regret the choice I made as I think we should have ended it then, but since I've had my youngest and I could never regret what led me to that point.
I think a talk is a good idea, he's not good at communicating though and I always feel like I'm his mum or something, sitting him down to talk.
How do I make it feel more 2 way for him, get him to open up etc.
I'm sure he can't be happy right now, but I think we both put it down to being stuck with limited external activities or opportunities to have a "life" in these current times.

it's your situation, not you.

if anything you sound really insightful and compassionate.

it's incredibly hard to process emotions. incredibly.

what does he do that's positive? even if it's an absence of nastiness!
you need to find ways to say nice things that are real - not just "trying"

Oh ffs you’re not toxic.

The relationship sounds difficult and he previously betrayed you and is putting his own needs first with family - I think want you want is for us all to say no, he’s the toxic one.

You’re not toxic, the relationship is hurting you.

I don't think you sound toxic but it doesn't sound loving. The fact that you can see the absence of love and feel unfulfilled suggests to me that you're not toxic in the sense that a malignant narcissist would be.

You sound very hard on yourself and taking the blame for a relationship that is or has been going wrong. You are certainly not toxic for reacting the way you have to his affair and refusal to move closer to your family and friends. Resentment is bound to build up when your needs aren't being considered particularly regarding his interaction with his own children. You are not responsible for how someone else behaves. Having an affair isn't the only solution to marriage problems. He could have tried to talk to you about it.

Perhaps some counselling for yourself to explore what you really want. You sound frustrated and unhappy, not toxic. Some space to work out how to move forward would be very beneficial to you.

You've blamed your depression on him having an affair - don't do that! They were his actions that he was responsible for. You can't make a relationship work by yourself, he has to be engaged and care.

Don't blame yourself for the affair. Your depression didn't make him do it, that was an awful choice he made. A loving partner would have supported you, not cheated on you.

How do I make it feel more 2 way for him, get him to open up etc.

Focus on yourself and what you want out of the situation - don't let the talk revolve around his feelings. Tell him you're not happy because XYZ. Say what you want the outcome to be - whether you want to work on the marriage or end it. Tell him what you need him to do (sounds like proper rectification for the affair would be a start - tell him exactly what you need this to be).

You can admit where you've gone wrong while still being firm about what you want. Let him process it, respond to it - maybe he might need a day or two. Listen to what he says too. Then work out whether there's a way forward or not. And there's no shame in either path.

I am also wondering if your DH has used the word 'toxic' to describe you?

I feel really sorry for you OP.

To me, it seems like the affair, and the wider lack of care from your DH, has led you to a position where you are afraid to value yourself and have lowered your expectations of your relationship.

I suspect you don't think he is prepared to fix anything & are instead trying to take it all on yourself & believe you can change yourself & then make everything ok.

Sadly, while relationships involve both people, without your DH's investment in the relationship it has no future.

Do you think he is invested to the same extent as you?

I see no evidence of toxicity from your post.

I think you need to be brave, say how you feel to your DH and how you feel about the affair. He will either respond to you or not, and you can make a decision then.

@Dacquoise

I am also wondering if your DH has used the word 'toxic' to describe you?

Me too. My ex used many terms to put me down. Ultimately I believed them. It's taken a lot of therapy to see things differently.

He's the one who sounds bloody toxic, not you, OP. Where are you really getting the idea from that you're 'toxic'?

He had an affair 9 years ago - his doing. A horrible thing.

8 years ago you got married, and did your children follow after or did you already have DC?

He's crap at communication, doesn't meet your needs, doesn't particularly parent well. It's like he thinks marrying you is his free pass to do what he likes, that he's paid his dues.

If you feel guilty it's because you know you want out of this. I don't blame you.

@SouthernHills85

Exactly the title I guess. I think I'm the toxic one in our relationship. With dh for 16 years and married for 8 with 2 young kids.

I'm not happy at the moment and am trying to make changes to my life to be happy and as I dissect our relationship I've started to realise that I think I am hitting a lot of key points for toxicity in relationships.

Are people always toxic, or is part of it because I'm not compatible with dh anymore as we've grown up, and that has led to us moving towards bad behaviour/habits.

My fears are:

I am quite critical of him (I'm a perfectionist and highly highly critical of myself too)

I don't really show him much affection anymore, it feels like I say "I love you" out of habit, not because I feel it. I kind of feel like he's a good friend there is no "heart filled with joy", it's just comfortable I guess. Is this just covid isolation/fall out, I can't even remember what things were like before anymore.

I get frustrated and annoyed at him easily, am short with him, we both can't seem to say much to each other without it being a dig or in a stressed tone or I take things he says poorly and respond by snapping.

I resent the fact that we live near his family and friends as he didn't want to move. I was quite depressed a decade ago and was desperate to be closer to my family but he said no, which is fair enough. But then he doesn't arrange to do anything with his family. Even though his friends now all have kids too, we don't do anything with them either and he never has "dad" days out with the kids and his friends (and kids) yet i take the kids for days out with my mum friends.
I also resent the fact that he cheated about 9 years ago and never went above and beyond to rectify it.

Am I toxic, what can I do to work on it? Is it just that we aren't right for each other anymore or will I always be toxic.

You're not toxic, although you have a few bad traits. But mainly you don't love him any more, that's what I'm getting from your post. Lockdown has made many people re-assess their lives. Cheating and expecting to be able to brush it under the carpet, hit the reset button and everything is fine again, was a recipe for disaster. Its disrespectful, but so is cheating, so hardly surprising behaviour. You've been suppressing resentment ever since. Maybe that's what's killed your love?

Perfectionism is a problem quality to have. Puts too much pressure on everyone, including you.

Irritability is irrational anger. But your anger is justified, he cheated and on a basic respect level nothing has changed. He never takes the DC out alone/with mates, giving you a break occasionally like you do for him (I know you don't just go as a favour to him, it's a side effect of seeing your friends). Does he leave you to do the majority of the childcare even when you're all home together? Are you the default parent? Because that's not fair and its another justified reason to be resentful. So because you're not talking about the justified anger that's been simmering away for years, you're boiling over and snapping at him over minor stuff that should be let go? You need to stop snapping, but suppressing and ignoring your feelings isn't the answer.

No it's not "fair enough" that he wouldn't move when you were depressed and needing extra support, for no reason other than it was easier for him to stay where he was than to make changes. He put his comfort (not his friends/family because he doesn't see them) over your mental health. That's not ok.

He's not abusive, you don't hate him, but you don't love him so you're having a relationship out of duty. Now you're thinking of making changes and that's fine. I think most people would want more than "he's not abusive and I don't hate him" as criteria for a relationship.

Affair happened after I resented the move I think my depression could have led to the affair

No. He refused to support you, you then felt resentful as well as depressed, probably you withdrew a bit which is a natural reaction for both situations. His response to that, instead of putting effort into your relationship and rectifying his mistake in refusing to support you, was to start another relationship. That's incredibly shitty behaviour, extremely disrespectful.

All about him: what does he want, is he getting it from you, where can he get it from. Like you don't matter to him other than as a resource for meeting his needs. He should have been thinking what does she need, can I provide it, how else can it be provided for her. That would have led to realising you needed more support than he was able to give and moving closer to your family. He's selfish. Selfish people aren't that great to be around most of the time.

I think a talk is a good idea, he's not good at communicating though and I always feel like I'm his mum or something, sitting him down to talk.
How do I make it feel more 2 way for him, get him to open up etc.

You don't. It's his choice to open up or not. You're not responsible for his behaviour or emotions. If he refuses to take responsibility for himself and engage in a conversation with you about your marriage, than what does that tell you? He couldn't be bothered to try to make your relationship work before and he can't be bothered now. Don't carry the conversation, expect him to take an equal part, refuse to be pushed into a mum role with him. This conversation (or lack of one, which is what I expect will happen) will tell you everything you need to know about how he feels.

Don't make it all about him though. Think about what you want. He could secretly be a changed man (yeh right ) but if you've had enough you can still choose to end the relationship, you're under no obligation to give him yet another chance.

Thanks all.

He has never commented that I am toxic, he has pointed out that he feels I criticise him a lot and I think that's a justified statement as I can see it myself when I take a minute to look.

Yes, I think I am the default parent. He's been a lot better with our second but I think being on furlough allowed that involvement and forced it with having 2 kids to take care of with me on maternity and him furloughed and then made redundant.
But I'm still the one who carries the "mental load" so to speak and do a majority of the childcare. He does take on more with the eldest (the little one has been impacted by covid and has attachment issues) but I think I'm still "aware" of more, like when Nursery needs paying, booking social clubs etc. He does the fun dad bits like watching films together.

You are right that I don't think he would fix things. I don't think he thinks anything needs fixing. It's definitely me driving the idea that things aren't right at the moment.
He would happily stick his head in the sand. In all aspects of his life he wouldn't choose to make a change. Whether that is a job or relationship.
Even if he's unhappy, he stays as he is until his hand is forced (ie he loses his job, contract expires etc, he is proactive, he's reactive)

I definitely want to find a way to save what we have if I can.
We used to be happy once and like people have said, on the whole he's not a bad person. I think maybe we have been bringing out the worst in each other and need to reevaluate.

I've had some therapy before but didn't feel it worked. Maybe that was the wrong therapist or maybe we need couples therapy to help us identify our issues in a safe space with someone who can stop the snapping/lead the chat in a positive way.

Yes, I do think maybe we never resolved the cheating incident and that's something I never got past.
But I feel like it's been so long now that I can't bring it up as that was me not dealing with it at the time as its not like he was going to want to

Oh and I think I've heard the word toxic fly round a lot recently on tv/media etc and as I have been making positive changes in my life (new job, weight loss etc) I reevaluate myself and my faults as I'm by no means perfect and felt like I related my behaviour to some of the things I've seen/heard recently.

couples therapy sounds like a good plan

I think it's really common/normal to have simmering resentments after infidelity.

OP you said he had "an affair" but then you said it was a one time thing and didn't include sex. Are we talking a drawn out emotional affair or a one-off drunken grope at the works xmas do?

I don't think YOU are toxic, but holding onto resentment from 9 years ago is going to be toxic for you.

For me I'd be more concerned about his passivity and lack of engagement with the DC. It's a very heavy (and often lonely) burden to always be the one driving the marriage.

Ultimately though - you can change the way you interact with him, but you can't change who he IS. You can get him to agree on doing XYZ in terms of parenting, chores, life admin etc - but you can't make him WANT to do those things.

That said - sometimes even if someone thinks they don't want to do something and they're just going along "for a quiet life", they do eventually realise, hey, everything is so much nicer and I feel better about myself as a person when I am doing my fair share/standing up to my awful family/speaking up and saying "no I'm not happy with this" instead of just silently moping... No guarantees though!

Even if he's unhappy, he stays as he is until his hand is forced (ie he loses his job, contract expires etc, he is proactive, he's reactive). I definitely want to find a way to save what we have if I can.

This bothers me. You might want to fight to save what you have (I'm struggling to see what good there is from here, but hey ho) but does he want to save it, or is he drifting along like he always does, unhappy but waiting for you to end it (or not)? Do you want to be with him if he'd prefer not to be together but will go along with if that's what you want? So you want to be with him if he's indifferent and couldn't care less either way? I think you need the answers to those.

Of course he doesn't want to change anything. He's selfish. So he doesn't care that it's hard for you. He's pointed out you always criticize him, but that's the only part he's interested in, the part that affects him. He doesn't care to think about why you're criticizing him and whether you might have a point.

From his perspective someone else carries the mental load of life and relationship so he needn't bother, he gets to do the fun easy parenting stuff and someone else does the life admin tricky annoying parts. He doesn't even have to think about whether he wants to be in the relationship job etc. He can keep waking up in the morning, ignoring his feelings and carrying on regardless, until someone else makes a decision. I wouldn't call him bad, as such, but I definitely wouldn't call him good either. Relationships where you bring out the worst in each other is another way of saying "incompatible" IMO, not good for either party.

You don't ever have to "get over" him cheating on you, you know. Perhaps you need to admit that you may never be able to get beyond it. Do you even trust him anymore?

Thanks for all your really helpful and encouraging comments, thoughts and advice.
Me and dh had a long talk tonight. I was very honest about everything including how his betrayal still hurts even though its a long time ago.
He was very receptive and shared his thoughts after initially being a little reluctant to.
We've made some positive goals (little steps) to try and get back on track and I think it's a good start for both of us to reflect on our issues as we identified some bad traits in each if us.
Hopefully it's the start of a road that makes us both happy either by finding our way into the marriage or deciding that we need to move on.