Tell me what to do with my life Mumsnetters, I feel so lost

[AintNobodyHereButUsChickens]

I'm sorry this is probably going to be really fucking long and maybe a bit confusing.

This post involves swinging, there are lots of different dynamics to swinging relationships so however you think it should work is not always the case. Please don't come at me if you think it's seedy and gross, that's just your opinion and I've heard it all a million times before from people who have no real idea

I have been with my husband since I was 15, and I am now 30, so half my life! He is 2 years older so we're almost the same age. We've been married 6 years. Many years ago, we discussed/fantasised about having a threesome, we decided to try and make it happen so we joined a swingers website and never looked back. We have been swinging for 12 of our 15 years. It's more of a cuckold swinging relationship where I will have sex with other men and usually leave DH waiting for me at home. I usually go to swingers clubs or will occasionally arrange to meet men off the site (but ONLY if they have several verifications from other members so you know they're genuine). Obviously not during the pandemic though, but with just one exception which I'm about to talk about...

Back in 2019, I met a man from the site, we went to a hotel and the sex was incredible, it sounds so ridiculously cliché but it really was like the sex you read about in erotic novels, where you just get totally lost in each other and keep going for several hours. After that meet we kept in contact, briefly chatting every few months (stuff like "Hi, how are you? We should arrange another meet if you're keen?" Etc just really brief conversations of 2-3 messages. About 9-10 months after the first meet, we met up again and it was just as amazing as the first time. Again briefly chatted every so often after this meet. The 3rd time we met was just before the first lockdown, after this, we started chatting a bit more often and we tended to meet up in between lockdowns (he was WFH and I'm a SAHM so not like we were constantly mingling with other people so the risk was as low as we could make it, although that does not excuse our recklessness and we've been extremely lucky not to end up ill).

I have met up with him 3 times this year and honestly, I really like him. I feel happy when I spend time with him. He's kind, courteous (he opens doors for me!), generous (sent me an enormous luxury hamper for my birthday!), he makes me laugh, he does incredible things to me in bed and he's just all around lovely. I often find my mind wandering, thinking about him. He has actually said he sometimes thinks of me too. DH knows about all the meets but he has no idea how I feel about him, I'm careful not to talk about him too excitedly or enthusiastically, I don't want to hurt DH by letting him know I like this guy more than he realises. He thinks I just really enjoy the sex. I haven't let on to anyone how I feel, well, apart from you reading this thread now.

Now, to DH. I love him, but I'm not sure if I'm IN love with him anymore. I'm feeling more and more unhappy. Over the last few years he's become increasingly grumpier, mostly with the children, he changes after they go to bed and he's all cheerful and lovey dovey with me. This carries on until the moment he gets out of bed the next day when he flips into bad mood mode again. I find that he brings the mood of us all right down almost every day. He's just so snappy and I don't know why. He can be laughing and cheery one moment, and snappy the next. I've tried bringing it up but he shuts it down and either denies that he's grumpy, or says he is tired. I don't believe his moods are anything to do with the swinging and how we do it, he loves it and wholeheartedly encourages me to have fun. And like I said, his mood disappears once the children have gone to bed.

At home I feel very under appreciated, like whatever I do will never be enough. He's always very quick to point out what housework jobs I haven't done. But if I spend all day cleaning and tidying, he won't say a word on how nice everything looks. I can't remember the last time he paid me a compliment other than 'sexy', I think the last time he called me beautiful was the night I gave birth to our son over 3 years ago. And I DO remember that because I recall being taken aback, thinking how out of the ordinary it was! I never get a general "You look nice today." type comment. Sex-wise, he is good with his mouth and hands but PIV lasts about 3 seconds and he's done, he feels bad about that but won't speak to anyone for help, we don't have PIV sex often because of this but we do other stuff.

I feel like I've painted him out to be this awful person, he's really not. He's always chipping in with doing housework (despite pointing out what I haven't done, he's always happy to run the hoover round, put a wash on, pick up the bathroom cleaner etc), he's generous with money, always buying us all treats like takeaways or going out for ice cream, days out (pre COVID) etc, when he's in a good mood he's so fun. He usually lets me have my own way on lots of things like choosing our kitchen cupboards, the house decor, getting a dog etc.

Those few short hours I spend with the other man, he pays me more lovely compliments than DH ever does. He calls me beautiful, he says he loves my pale white skin, he says he loves my curvy body and that he can't get enough of me. If I ask to meet up he won't hesitate to say yes because "I can never say no to you." I've spoken to two friends about him and they both say it sounds like he likes me, I haven't admitted to them that I like him too.

Now, here is where I'm confused. I love DH but I really like this guy. Am I just latching onto him and projecting my feelings because he's so lovely to me? I know DH loves me but I just feel so taken for granted, I'm nowhere near as happy as I used to be. To be completely honest even before I realised my feelings for this other guy, I was fantasising about how it would feel to leave DH and be single. I regret settling down so young, I wish I had done more, I wish I had lived as a woman on my own. Instead, I became a mum at 20 and have been a SAHM ever since, even if I did leave DH I've no idea how I would manage life without him. I've been trying to get a job to earn my own money, I don't have any personal savings at all, but because I've been a SAHM for so long and from such a young age I'm basically unemployable. Every job application I either don't hear back, get a no thanks because I don't have experience etc and on the rare occasion I do get an interview I don't get it because of a lack of experience/confidence/knowledge.

I just don't know what the fuck to do with my life. I need some guidance because I can't see a way out or a way forward, but clearly something has to change because I cannot carry on like this for much longer :(

Oh shit that WAS long

It's a difficult one.

If this guy wasn't there, would you be thinking of leaving DH?

Has this guy ever indicated that he would want more than this casual situation?

Having some experience of swinging, many single men that I have met through it, actually like it because they feel safe from being drawn in to the trappings of the whole relationship thing.

Even if he did want a relationship, you would need a reasonable amount of single time before he could meet your children. I don't think he should be the reason for leaving.

If you wouldn't seriously be considering leaving DH otherwise, I think you need to spend some time communicating and working on this relationship first. Unless you have the ick.

Oh I don't know what I'm trying to say. You know your own mind. Just keep your feet planted in reality.

I suppose the risk of finding someone you prefer to the one you have, can only be increased by mixing intimately with other people. I suspect you have blurred the boundaries of just sex by doing other things that people do within relationships - eg. lots of chats outside of meets, sending gifts etc. I assume you don't meet on a weekly basis yet, so what you are seeing is bits of him being on his best, most flattering behaviour. Being realistic, he's not likely to behave the same if he were to find himself living with you and your children. Is he in a relationship too?
I wonder, did it start as a cuckold agreement, or did your DH expect that he would be having sex with others too? Perhaps he realised that he wasn't satisfying you, so knew he wasn't satisfying anyone else either and gave it up, he may actually resent your successful encounters on some level. If he doesn't have it in him to physically perform with you, was the threesome fantasy always MMF, as he's not going to manage 2F's by the sound of it?
It may well be that it's just a case of meeting and sticking together too young, perhaps it's actually the excitement of swinging that kept you in your relationship,. By what you say, you were swinging from 3 years after you met, had you not, you may have got bored with him sooner and not gone down the road of marriage and children with him. I suspect the excitement on the side made your relationship seem more thrilling than it was in reality.
I can only imagine that relationships like these can only work with open communication, so, you need to find out what his moods are about and he should be open to telling you. Could it be that he was never paternal, doesn't actually like children, just had kids from the start with an expectation that he could pass all parenting to you? I'll bet he was only too happy for you to be a SAHM so he can be as little involved as possible - a sure fire way to put any mother off a man.

He is lovely to you but don't forget he doesn't have to worry about the children/housework/ picking up dog shit/homework/ the gas bill/ maintaining extended family issues/ financing the family / there are surely more ?

He sees you when you want mutual sex and that is it - so that's all the expectation , the excitement pleasure and build up is a bit of a get a way for both of you ?

No judgement here but is your partner stressed by family life ? Could he get help for that ? I ask as you say his mood changes when children go to bed ?

I have no knowledge of the swinging lifestyle so would never comment but surely this is common for feelings to become involved from one or all sides involved ?

How happy really is your DH with the swinging?

And yes, the other bloke is amazing because it’s just a sex meet. He doesn’t have to do the day to day with you.

Hold on - you've been exploited by randoms 'swinging' since you were 18?

This doesn't sound like swinging it just sounds like you being allowed to go and shag other blokes. And it's clearly going to end In disaster, unsurprisingly. I don't know what you both expected tbh!

Leave the whole swinging aspect out, it sounds like your DH is an absolutely shit dad.

What would you need to do to become employable? Anything will help at this point, including volunteering.

I don't think this new guy can work out considering what your relationship is built on. No problem to keep him as a sexmate but I would be almost certain it couldn't work as a relationship. I bet he would continue to swing and you're not used to your partner swinging, just yourself. As a relationship this has disaster written all over it.

If you want a different life and future, I'd consider first stopping swinging, focus on your own future as a woman and plan for work and to support yourself from 35 onwards. You can also decide as you go if you want to stay in your marriage or not. You need a clear head without the complication of swinging messing with your head/desires/motivations etc.

@Kittykat93

This doesn't sound like swinging it just sounds like you being allowed to go and shag other blokes. And it's clearly going to end In disaster, unsurprisingly. I don't know what you both expected tbh!

You clearly don't understand what a cuckolding dynamic is Stop being so nasty about something you're ignorant of.

Op, I think maybe this man seems like the answer because other routes to improve your situation have been quite disheartening? It might be an idea to focus on getting some training or volunteering to get experience, so you build a better cv and confidence about getting work?

An adult apprenticeship might be a good route for you?

There are two issues and you need to tackle them separately. Firstly you and your husband need to have a long (probably several long) conversations about your marriage, your goals, your true feelings about your joint future, if there is one. When you do talk make sure you both actively listen (google it) - if you can't, then a counsellor might be a better option.

If you can, don't see or speak to the other guy during this process. He might be right for your future (or he might run a mile) but at the moment he's a distraction. If he IS right for you he'll respect your confusion and step back.

I think it's interesting that you fantasise about being single, rather than jumping from one relationship to another. So, get practical. Explore options for adult education, apprenticeships, volunteer work. What are your passions (apart from the OM!)? With your background of swinging, you could think about working in that sector - admin, improving web sites, etc. Sex is an industry - use your inside knowledge.

Those few short hours I spend with the other man, he pays me more lovely compliments than DH ever does. He calls me beautiful, he says he loves my pale white skin, he says he loves my curvy body and that he can't get enough of me. If I ask to meet up he won't hesitate to say yes because "I can never say no to you." I've spoken to two friends about him and they both say it sounds like he likes me, I haven't admitted to them that I like him too.

It does read like you’re looking for an escape route. The swinging chap sounds great but you don’t know him. I know it might feel like you do. I could be a totally different character when only spending a night with someone a few times a year. It’s a fantasy… a good one but just a fantasy.

I really recommend marriage counselling to see if this can be resolved. No harm giving it your all

If you are not happy with your DH, separate.

This other man should not be a factor here.

@ThePurplePalace

Those few short hours I spend with the other man, he pays me more lovely compliments than DH ever does. He calls me beautiful, he says he loves my pale white skin, he says he loves my curvy body and that he can't get enough of me. If I ask to meet up he won't hesitate to say yes because "I can never say no to you." I've spoken to two friends about him and they both say it sounds like he likes me, I haven't admitted to them that I like him too.

It does read like you’re looking for an escape route. The swinging chap sounds great but you don’t know him. I know it might feel like you do. I could be a totally different character when only spending a night with someone a few times a year. It’s a fantasy… a good one but just a fantasy.

I really recommend marriage counselling to see if this can be resolved. No harm giving it your all

This is why I feel so confused. Because I know that I only see those snapshots of him on our meets and through texts. I don't know what he's like day to day. I like the him that I know, if that makes sense? I completely understand what you're saying about it being a fantastical escape route and I agree, like I said I'm not sure if I just feel this way because he's lovelier to me than my husband is.

Well this isn't swinging. Its an open relationship. Are you sure your husband actually, enjoys you just going out and sleeping with other men? Especially, repeatedly seeing the same one?

The other man is a fantasy. If you aren't in love with your husband and having an open relationship isn't enough, then you need to decide what to do about your marriage. Independently, of this man.

He doesn't see you often and when he does his role is male the time you have together as great as possible. I can guarantee if you were in the long term relationship, with him, compliments would also drop off. Normal everyday life would take over. If you lived with him and your kids, do you really think he would be the same as he is with a few hours here and there?

I would suggest not seeing this man for a while. Really figure out how you feel about your marriage. Without thoughts and day dreams of this man, poking in. Decide what you want to do with that, then look at everything else. In the meantime, you want a job so keep pursuing that. If that's what you want, work towards it. Look to get qualifications or skills to help get a job.

Do something that's for you. Not for your dh, or this other man or the kids. Look at what you want from life. You may find that if you actually focus on your own goals, some of these things may become and easier decision for you.

Loads of blocked manage to be lovely for a few dates but it doesn't mean they are partner material. If you did get with him, you would have to share him with other women. How would you feel about that?

Also, if you didnt fancy him would you really think it was ok for him to be sending you gifts. Or would you actually feel it violates boundaries? Because if you've told him it's just a sex thing then it certainly does.

Agree with pp that his compliments have highlighted what you are missing in your marriage. But surely that should be easily remedied with a talk. 'Hubby, I'm feeling a little neglected. I cant remember the last time you told me I was beautiful. Could you make a bit more effort please? Perhaps we could arrange a regular date night?'.

Give him a chance to buch up his ideas. If he doesn't then it might be time to call it a day. But not for some other guy.

*loads of blokes

Well this isn't swinging. Its an open relationship. Are you sure your husband actually, enjoys you just going out and sleeping with other men? Especially, repeatedly seeing the same one?

Cuckoldry fetish is when someone gets off on their partner fucking other people. Sometimes they like to watch or film it, sometimes just knowing about it is enough.

@category12

Well this isn't swinging. Its an open relationship. Are you sure your husband actually, enjoys you just going out and sleeping with other men? Especially, repeatedly seeing the same one?

Cuckoldry fetish is when someone gets off on their partner fucking other people. Sometimes they like to watch or film it, sometimes just knowing about it is enough.

Thank you Category, that's exactly it. On occasion I've even facetimed DH when I've been DTD with other men (with their agreement obviously!), it's a big turn on for all involved.

@category12

Well this isn't swinging. Its an open relationship. Are you sure your husband actually, enjoys you just going out and sleeping with other men? Especially, repeatedly seeing the same one?

Cuckoldry fetish is when someone gets off on their partner fucking other people. Sometimes they like to watch or film it, sometimes just knowing about it is enough.

Yes, I know what a cuckold fetish is

That's not what I said. I didn't say it wasn't cuckold I said it wasn't really swinging.

But it doesn't appear that he is particularly happy in general. In swinging, open relationships etc its the norm to have converstations to ensure both are still happy in the situation or want to to change it up again.

If one person seems generally unhappy or has delevloped sexual problems, it's worth having a convertation about the situation in general. And lots of people have a fetish, that they enjoy in the moment. But then feel unhappy about it, in between then. I know several people who are really turned on by threesomes, but in-between they feel anxious about how their partner felt about the 3rd.

I didn't say he wasn't happy. I simply asked if op is sure he still was. The vast majority of my post, was advice based on how op feels. Not dependent on her dhs feelings (either way) about their sex life.

Do you? Cuckoldry fetish doesn't equal an open marriage

I heard an expression once:

Those that have much, love little. Those that have little, love much.

I know it’s not the point of your post, but I’d focus on the job stuff. It’s your ticket to independence and freedom, despite what man you’re with.

What job do you want to do? Have you looked into colleges or Uni? Could you get work experience or an apprenticeship?

You might feel old to be starting work she’d 30, but you still have 37 years of working ahead of you, and you’ll never need to take a maternity break.

You seem to have rather a low bar in your relationship; your dh "helps" around the house, buys you treats, "allows" you to choose kitchen cupboards?? Also, pulls you up on your standards of housework...?

This doesn't sound like an equal adult relationship. I would work on this first
before worrying about the other man, tbh.

@ThatOtherPoster I wish I knew. As a kid I always wanted to work with horses or dogs. My dream was shattered when I found out just how allergic to them I am, but I've never found anything that really interests me. There are certain dog breeds I'm okay with but I'm allergic to the vast majority. A few weeks ago I had this great idea that I could make and sell my own dog treats but that fell flat on its face before I'd even started, it's a huge ballache to get set up with the council, lab testing etc. I'd basically need an entire separate kitchen and I just can't make that work.

It's funny that a previous poster suggested I work in the sex industry in some way, I have actually toyed with the vague idea of setting up a swingers club in our area as there's nothing closer than an hour and a half away. But that would be mega expensive and I wouldn't even know where to begin. Plus that would mean coming clean to our families about what we do and that would be excruciating 😬 plus the crippling expense if it failed.