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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Totally beaten now

10 replies

StartingAgain33 · 18/07/2021 08:22

Just split up with an absolute arsehole. He was strange in many ways, and pretty abusive, and I'm not sure I was right to trust him when I now look back in the cold light of day. I think he might have been up to things with other women. And now I'll never know. I wasted 9 months with him (he wasn't all bad to be fair, but there was a red flag in month 4 I wish I'd listened to)

This is after 3 years of Internet dating and a stream of odd and unsuitable guys. The avoidant I dated for 11 months, the weirdo who I found out was obsessed with his colleague after 3 months (again avoidant), the other avoidant for 3 months...the guy who I found out hadn't had a job in 4 years after several months, the nice guy who was so anxious he couldn't function.. etc etc... its been mostly a shit show with a couple of nice but too-troubled guys in between.

And all this after giving my heart and soul to someone for 3.5 years, a good chunk of that while he was having cancer treatment, then being very disappointed that he didn't return the same level of care when my dad was diagnosed with terminally ill cancer which eventually led to our breakup as I felt so drained (he was okay by the time dad was diagnosed). He was inherently selfish and I wish I hadnt been his primary carer and given my life up. I just felt I had no choice as he had no on else. Then getting pulled into looking after my drug addict brother for two years. If it wasn't for me he honestly would be dead by now but instead he's settled down and having a baby with a lovely lady and hardly ever in touch despite me putting my life on hold for him for 2 years with crisis after crisis, and despite him knowing our relationship is important to me. He has always been selfish.

I just feel so tired and drained now. I'm so tired of men taking everything. Of my propensity to give everything. Of how many shit, weird, abusive men are in the dating pool and how I can't immediately spot them. Of how few men are equipped to look after me when I need it. Of how weak they are. Of how tired I am of doubting things ans worrying about things. I'm glad at least I've put a stop to some of these relationships quickly but some I have let go on for far too long.

I'm late 30s and aware I'm running out of time for my own child. Usually I get quickly back on the dating horse, and enjoy it, because most guys you meet are nice at first anyway. But instead of feeling hope, I'm feeling defeat and bitterness now. Despite feeling I should get out there, I just can't. I need a break. I'm too angry. I also feel unattractive and old, even tho I know I look v young for my age.

Is this wise? What if I miss my chance? Im about to be 37. I just don't feel I'm in the right place for dating. My perception of men has been twisted this past few years, I used to have a very healthy attitude and lots of male friends but since going freelance the only way I meet tjem is through online dating and I think my perception is now very skewed. I dont want to hate a whole gender but I do feel very wary, weary and sceptical ill ever find a decent one that has his shit together and that I fancy.

I have frozen 28 eggs, at the ages of 35 and 36.

Just feel quite hopeless. Any advice on whether it is wise to stay out of dating at this age gratefully received. Can I afford to take a break?

And, how can I detox myself from years of shit with men? I feel deeply exhausted by it all now.

OP posts:
EvenMoreFuriousVexation · 18/07/2021 08:35

Hi op, I'm sorry you've had such a run of wankers.

One thing really leaped out at me, the number of avoidant men you've encountered. Looking back at those - do you think there were any signs you missed early on that in hindsight should have made you run for the hills?

(obviously you're not going to get a full picture on Date 1, I'm thinking in their communication between dates, and things they've said about relationship history on subsequent dates.)

It's really good that you've frozen your eggs - that means you're actually in the same position as a man who wants kids but doesn't have to worry about his age. You've bought yourself enough time to take a break if you feel burned out.

Do you think some sessions of therapy might benefit you in being clearer about what you want/need from a partner, what you're prepared to compromise on, and what is a total deal breaker? I say therapy but perhaps a life coach might be more appropriate... But sadly my experience of those is that they're either affordable and crap, or expensive and crap 🙄

There are a lot of shitty men out there - equally there are a lot of shitty women. I'm wondering what dating sites you're using - I've personally found the paid sites better for serious relationships, simply because if a guy is paying for membership then he clearly wants something serious rather than just idle chat.

Hanger0n · 18/07/2021 09:55

Is there anything in you're psyche that leads you to gravitate toward men who are like this?

StartingAgain33 · 18/07/2021 12:56

Thanks both, I think the pattern with these men is that they often have not had long term relationships before, or at least v patchy dating history- the last hadn't had a girlfriend for over a decade and he was 42. He said it was because he'd worked too much and also was really hurt by the last one, but I think he also didn't really have very good relationship skills... it was flattering that he thought I was so amazing apparently that he wanted to spend the rest of his life with me but he was full on in the first few months and I probably should have seen it as a bit much. I think I get flattered when these men that are very picky, attractive, successful etc choose me but its not like I'm the only attractive person in tbe world, maybe I'm just a chump who doesn't spot red flags!

OP posts:
StartingAgain33 · 18/07/2021 12:57

I think maybe at this age a divorcee is a good bet? As long as they broke up for good reasons and he is over her

OP posts:
username18702 · 18/07/2021 13:44

OP you have a pattern of putting other's needs above your own and being co-dependent. You need to address this pattern and start to cut and run at the first signs of it in others. Stop trying to 'fix' others and start focusing on yourself. There's a power play going on here that might be useful to address.

Take a look at the Karpman Drama triangle
Read Co-dependence for Dummies

Have a think about taking a break from dating (I know your biology is ticking) and getting some therapy. It will save you time in the long run. You could also look at having a child by yourself - it's always an option.

StartingAgain33 · 18/07/2021 16:15

I actually have been in therapy for a while and I don't think he thinks Im particularly codependent, but I agree I think this is a bad pattern. I don't think the therapy is helping and I might stop it and look for another person. I have read those books but find it hard to put them into practice in the moment and really understand what they are saying in practical terms. I think I just have no idea what an equal relationship looks like and if I'm honest I don't know if I'm capable of one. How do I learn more about this?

OP posts:
StartingAgain33 · 18/07/2021 17:16

Although to be fair the minute I've realised the guys I'm seeing have something that needs 'taking care of' I have disengaged. So I think I have gotten a lot better. The guy I was with just now was quite independent, as was I, but I realise now I overlooked my feelings too much. So that's my next lesson.

OP posts:
Newjobcrap · 19/07/2021 23:41

OMG I could have written the exact same post, OP. Same experiences, same age. It’s not just you. Are there other ways you can meet men? Through groups/hobbies perhaps? I’m very jaded at the moment too, and found men from online dating to be the worst.

StartingAgain33 · 21/07/2021 11:16

@username18702

OP you have a pattern of putting other's needs above your own and being co-dependent. You need to address this pattern and start to cut and run at the first signs of it in others. Stop trying to 'fix' others and start focusing on yourself. There's a power play going on here that might be useful to address.

Take a look at the Karpman Drama triangle
Read Co-dependence for Dummies

Have a think about taking a break from dating (I know your biology is ticking) and getting some therapy. It will save you time in the long run. You could also look at having a child by yourself - it's always an option.

Hiya, yes I think you have a point. I have cut and run quite a few times early, and to be fair me and this guy split up because we both realised he couldn't meet my needs. I dont think I was putting him first too much, although I did obviously want it to work and stayed longer than I should have as I kept seeing what I want to see.

I am in therapy already. He actually encouraged me to stay a bit longer as he thought I was picking faults!

How long would you recommend staying single for? The stupid late 30s panic is setting in.

OP posts:
username18702 · 21/07/2021 12:42

Hi, if you're not seeing any real life change with therapy, I would have a think about getting a new one. You could contact the BACP helpline 01455 883300 for a chat about it.

Your pattern doesn't just cover your ex, it covers your brother. That's a sign of codependence but at heart, co dependence is about power. If you think about it, when you're the one fixing others, taking care of others, putting others first - it achieves several things.

  1. You don't have to look at yourself or focus on yourself. Your sole focus is others.
  2. You're the one in control. You're the one managing others and their lives.
  3. Self esteem is gained through being 'needed'.
  4. You are the 'good' one, you are the 'martyr', you are the once sacrificing yourself for others.

The Karpman triangle is an unhealthy dynamic in relationship and, if you think about the relationships where you have put your own needs aside and 'rescued' others, you'll see how caught up in the dynamic you are. You want to get to a place of 'I'm OK, you're OK'. When you're caught up in the triangle, the dynamic is 'I'm OK, you're not Ok.' This is power at play, I'm OK (I'm your sister, I'm taking care of you, I'm doing my best, I'm sacrificing myself for you...) - You're not OK (You're an addict, you're a mess, look at yourself, you're inferior...)

Transactional analysis looks at the games people play in relationships. Take a look at the book as it's really interesting: Games People Play by Eric Berne.

Check out the four life positions, developed by Frank Ernst:
southcottpsychotherapy.co.uk/transactional-analysis-life-positions/#:~:text=I'm%20OK%E2%80%94You're%20not%20OK%20is%20occupied,'re%20not%20OK%E2%80%9D).

The triangle moves around, so you don't always remain in the same place.

Victim
Persecutor
Rescuer

At the moment, you're the victim, - poor me, I'm beaten down, I've sacrificed for others, done everything I can and look where it's got me. Sometimes you're the rescuer (which is where you may feel most comfortable), rescuers feel resentment towards those they are helping as they sacrifice their own needs for others. They tend to be co dependent and enablers. Persecutors tend to be authoritarian and unpleasant in order to mask their fear of becoming the victim.
You can read more about it here: lindagraham-mft.net/triangle-victim-rescuer-persecutor-get/

Whenever you find yourself caught in a pattern, reflect on what YOU are getting out of it. Let's take your brother for example.

Brother - bum, loser, addict, mess, irresponsible, immature, dependent...
You - the 'good' one, the martyr, the responsible one, the one people rely on, the 'rock'.

Quite the pay off in terms of status in the family and self esteem. Cookies for YOU. On the surface, you were doing your best, trying to help someone you loved but there are other motivations at play here. The point of reflection on this, is not for me to persecute you and point the finger, it's for you to reflect on your behaviour and make some changes in order to improve your relationships. That's the work.

It sounds as though your therapist is of the tea and biscuits kind and isn't challenging you enough. If you want to make changes and get out of these patterns then you need to focus on what is motivating you to make these choices.

You need to stay away from relationships until you are making healthier choices for yourself (although there is a counter argument that you can make changes through relationships). The most important thing in therapy is not the type of therapy you have, but your relationship with your therapist as that's how you learn and grow.

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