Should I keep pushing someone to do something even tho I think they don't want to?

[imonthetrainanditsawful]

Hello!

I would love some advice!!

My mother has always been a quiet person, but I've always felt she is very anti social and generally doesn't like others. She avoids going outside as much as possible and generally has nothing nice to say about anyone!

That has never been the case in our relationship tho. We have always got on well and would always talk and do things.

Lock down happened, and we stopped going out and eventually calling each other. Now that things have opened back up again, I tried to initiate meetings but she will only see me for 10 mins and then leave.

I invited her for a bbq and she stays 20 mins. Didn't eat the food I bought for her.

She's stopped answering my calls and never is first to contact.

I feel like she may be depressed and that I should be persistent and not let me turn into what she sees the rest of the world to be. But at the same time, shouldn't I let her live her life the way she wants?

I don't know what the right thing to do here is and I'm trying to arrange something for her birthday but I feel she would prefer I just didn't.

Thanks for any replies

What does she say about it?

I think you need to say to her something like "Mum, I feel like you're pulling away and don't want contact with me or anyone, and I'm trying to understand what you want and how to help you if you need it, please tell me what's going on with you."

Thank you for your reply.

I haven't spoken to her about what I'm feeling.

I worry that she may think I am disappointed in her and that she is upsetting me.

I believe she may try harder out of guilt, but I wonder if she may just truly prefer to not have much to do with me.

I have two young children, and she has stopped asking about them and when she does see them she hardly acknowledges them.

She used to be so happy with us but lockdown has turned her into a completely different person. I don't know if it's just realisation that a quiet life is for her, or if it's depression making everything seem pointless.

Thank you again for your response

Well, if it's a change in her since lockdown, I think you're being a bit paranoid to think she no longer wants to be with you or the children - it's far far far more likely she's struggling with her mental health and needs help.

That's a good point.

Lockdown was what started it and I do believe she may be feeling depressed.

I will keep on trying and hopefully she starts to feel better.

Thank you

It does sound like a bit of depression but also may be a slower adjustment to returning to "normal". I'm wondering why all contact seemed to stop during lockdown if you normally get on so well? Maybe your Mum felt a bit abandoned and is worried it would happen again? Or sad about it?
Definitely keep contact up with gentle encouragement.

It may be that her dislike of the outside is actually a form of agoraphobia? Her anxiety about being outside/socialising may have worsened as she hasn't had to manage it?

She's your mum. You have a right and maybe a duty to ask her. Just say what you have said here as you sound very caring and not at all pushy - that you don't want to make her change her ways if she is happy with a quieter life since lockdown, but that you have noticed a change in her socially and wanted to check if she is unwell in any way?

Our phone conversations moved to messages, and I started receiving really short replies. And I think I sort of just stopped messaging her as much.

I didn't consider she may have felt abandoned.

She stopped calling and then we stopped messaging and I didn't think anything was overly wrong until we met.

It was like she didn't want to look at me and kept talking to the floor. She only spoke about how much her neighbours were bothering her and didn't seem interested in anything to do with me.

I started a new job 2 weeks ago. Something she knew because I went round there the day before and reminded her as she had forgotten. She still hasn't messaged me to ask how it went or if I'm enjoying it.

It's just all very different.

I asked if she would like me to invite my sisters to her birthday celebration and she said no.

I'm at a loss

This is all very good advice, thank you.

I think mentioning I have noticed a difference and not making her feel guilty is a good idea.

If she is feeling down I don't want her to feel worse

I think you need to have a direct conversation with her and just ask her what's going on with her. You don't really have anything to lose since she's withdrawn from you so much already.

I think you need to ask her how she is feeling and whether she thinks it would help to have a chat to her dr. If she has changed since lockdown then depression or anxiety could well be the issue. Keep in contact and encouraging her to get out even if it’s just a 10 min chat or a short walk.

I find it a bit odd that all this has happened and you haven’t said anything to her. Is there going to be some big drip feed about a history that explains why you have such an uncommunicative relationship?

She’s your mum. Say ‘Hey Mum, I’m a bit worried about you - you seem to have withdrawn during the pandemic and now things feel quite distant between us. Have I upset you in some way, or are you feeling down or anxious? What can I do to help?’.

I've not given much thought as to why I haven't communicated this with her.

No drip feed that I can think of the only relevant thing I thought was that I do think she is anti social by nature which I mentioned.

I don't think there's ever been a situation like this. Normally if she upsets me, I tell her. But she hasn't upset me, she's worrying me. I don't think I've ever had to deal with something like this before and I just really don't want to make things worse.

She does not like doctors and whenever she gets sick, she thinks they do not believe her. She puts off any kind of appointments and normally would only go if I took her but now I don't even think she would trust me to go with her or want me too.

Thank you for the advice tho

Is there a possibility she is agoraphobic?

I am and contrary to the popular misconception it doesn't start or even continue necessarily with NEVER going out it tends to be a gradual thing or can be the case that the sufferer limits how long they're out for or where they go (sticking to "safe" places)

It can also affect willingness to communicate as well as other things

How is she regarding you visiting her?

WRT pandemic - does she have underlying health issues or other factors that make her worried about catching COVID?

Is the new job one where you have a public facing role?

Is she "anti social" or a natural introvert? Extroverts tend to not understand introverts and think their way of being is "normal"

Bear in mind too even if she is ill she has the right not to seek treatment or diagnosis.

It might help to keep the contact to little & often. if she has got used to being alone, she might find it overwhelming to be at a bbq with lots of people etc.

short frequent visits & frequent whatsapp messages etc may help. And give your visits a purpose - bring a new magazine to talk about or a little treat or similar, so you can keep the conversation light.

I think some people are really struggling to return to "normal" and by your description she sounds like she may be struggling with her mental well-being. Do you think she would be receptive if you asked what she missed doing most during lockdown, try to encourage her in that area, maybe planning a short trip out somewhere like a favourite walk, visiting gardens, something outdoors so lots of space from other people and only an hour or two to start with, easing her gently into being back out in the world again.

I may need to read up on agoraphobic, I've not actually heard the term before so thank you

She seems more open to me visiting her, but I just get this feeling like she wants me to leave not long after arriving.

She often finds jobs to do around the house while I'm visiting it feels to almost distract herself from me being there.

She loves castles, so I talked about arranging a day to seeing one she hasn't seen before and she didn't seem too fussed. A lot of 'could do' 'I don't mind' 'possibly''s.

I definitely take after her in a lot of ways. I like my own company and would also happily call myself an introvert. We always loved each other tho. Family has always been very important to us.

Dh isolated during the first lockdown because he was told to as he was one of the vulnerable.

His mental health deteriorated dramatically, not just about when he could go out he didn’t want to. We thought he had dementia as well as agoraphobia.

It took 3 of us, all living with him to persuade him to make the steps outside.
For a few trips (at our insistence) he would drive himself to the supermarket and sit in the car and then come back without having got out of the car.
Eventually he returned to “normal”. When he was told he had to isolate again he refused to as the fear of losing his mind was far greater than the fear of a virus he more than likely had contracted and recovered from.

I think the after effects of lockdowns won’t be quantifiable until years from now.

I think if your mother is anything like Dh then it is going to take a lot of pushing to get her back to her old self.

When I was suffering from depression it was painful to be around and talk to people, but I desperately needed someone to reach out. I hope your mum isn't depressed, but if she is, I hope you manage to help her open up.

What helped me was a GP appt/ psychiatrist and anti depressants/ follow up with CPN. I needed a family member to be an advocate for me access these.

I think if she'd wanted to fade from your life she could have done that anytime. Please don't stop trying to reach her. Small and gradual steps. If you could maybe start with seeing her by yourself. More people is harder to cope with.

Isolation makes things like depression, anxiety and agoraphobia worse. I know myself I can desperately want to see someone and be unable to reach out, even in answer to a text or call. It's not a reflection on how much I want to see a friend or family member. It's all these thoughts in my head telling me other people are better off without me in their life that are the problem. If I'm communicating with or seeing someone regularly I can usually fight my way past the thoughts, but if it's been a while the thoughts are much stronger and harder to fight.

These thoughts aren't necessarily what your mum is having, but it's a similar process with anxiety, or depression or agoraphobia or panic disorder. Isolation makes mental health worse, makes it much, much harder to interact and reach out or respond. It's much more likely her behaviour is a reflection of what's going on in her head, then how she feels.