Handhold...is this abuse?

[Lostmyway86]

I've been married for just over a year and have two baby DDs with DH. He has two older children with his ex and they had a toxic break up. I came onto the scene 2 months after they split so was unfortunately around for everything re. selling of their house, custody arrangements for DSC etc. Right from the start I was led to believe ex was a narcissistic, toxic person. His friends (men and women) backed this up as did his family. Also ex's behaviour appeared extremely volatile and toxic. I was so in love I chose to believe his version of the story, we married and had two daughters in the space of 4 years.

Rewind 1 year and his ex wanted to change custody from 50/50 to 1 night a week and EOW. He refused and it ended up in court. That's when shit really hit the fan. She had him arrested for historical domestic abuse and a 20 page document detailing all the 'abuse' was posted through our letter box. I was pregnant at the time and it was horrendous. She accused him on emotional, physical, sexual violence and even physical violence against his child. The police dropped the case seeing no reason to prosecute but the courts agreed to her custody request.

Obviously reading that document planted a seed. There was bits about me where he'd supposedly tried to get her back when we'd been in a relationship which he obviously denied. However, it's the little digs that I used to brush off as banter that are now like red flags. He says I'm useless at everything, that I've still got a long way to go with regards to my weight loss since DD2. He ignores most of what I say and says it's because I'm boring. It's all done in jokey ways but it chips away. He's also raised his fist in arguments but never actually hit me. I'm now starting to wonder if the ex isn't the psycho she's been painted as and whether her statement has truth. He says it's all to do with getting what she wants which is why she waited 5 years to bring it up. I'm just so confused. I feel totally overwhelmed with life with 2 children and 2 babies as it is. I just feel I've been led a merry dance by both of them...

OP have you thought about contacting his ex directly. She might clarify some things for you.

Your babies are the reason you should leave. While they are still babies.

Developmental trauma is irreversible. Don't inflict that on them by keeping them in an abusive home.

Because no, you are not protecting them. It is impossible for a child to be raised in an abusive home and not be damaged.

Speak to Women's Aid. Consider making your own police report.

I don't think what she did was cruel. More likely she was desperate at seeing you sucked in and another child about to be born into the abuse and trying to protect you. You'd bought into his narrative about her and refused to listen before, how else was she supposed to make herself heard?

I don't think I could cope alone with them so young.

That's a feeling, not an objective fact.

And you feel that way because of years of abuse telling you that you're useless. Not because it's true.

The constant put downs are an abuser's way of building a psychological cage to try and get you to stay because you feel it's all you deserve, the best you could hope for, and that you'd never survive alone.

None of that's true.

Don't make your decisions based on the fear and emotions his abuse has filled you with. Make them based on objective fact and information. From speaking to experts like Women's Aid.

This is a link to a free pdf version of the Lundy Bancroft book a PP mentioned if you want to have a look OP sites.google.com/site/24aprl20benisonn2/18sarikgrokan2020ghtyfh8381

@user14515324156262562

Your babies are the reason you should leave. While they are still babies.

Developmental trauma is irreversible. Don't inflict that on them by keeping them in an abusive home.

Because no, you are not protecting them. It is impossible for a child to be raised in an abusive home and not be damaged.

Speak to Women's Aid. Consider making your own police report.

I don't think what she did was cruel. More likely she was desperate at seeing you sucked in and another child about to be born into the abuse and trying to protect you. You'd bought into his narrative about her and refused to listen before, how else was she supposed to make herself heard?

She'd never rasied anything about abuse before. It wasn't until she wanted to change the contact arrangement and he challenged it that all this came to light. Which makes me wonder if this was more about getting what she wanted than getting her voice heard.

@Lessthanaballpark I'm not sure this is an option. Even if what she says has truth she has still treated me and DH appallingly over the years. I do still believe she is narcissistic. The court case is also still ongoing due to her claims around one of my DSC which means there's cafcass involvement so if I was to approach her that would be brought up.

I left a week before the youngest was born. I let him know I would be leaving - once my plan for leaving him was set up - a month before her due date for birth. It was a difficult period. Especially as my hormones were everywhere and my two year old was distressed about Daddy being absent - which was just before the birth - and playing out. But frankly she quickly adjusted and much more easily I believe than had we separated later down the line, in years to come. The latter part of my pregnancy was a mess - uncontrollable crying all the time, I struggled to manage my gestational diabetes, but I am now on the other side. I have my own place, I have my mental well-being and I feel the most robust I have for the past 10 years.

My youngest is now 15 months old. It has been hard, being a single mum, and I now have so so so sooooooo much respect for single mothers and total appreciation of all that they do. And there are days that I struggle. But I have my sanity and mental well-being. Nothing beats this. Than the insanity and deep deep lows and regular emotional turmoil of being in a deeply frustrating and [emotionally] abusive relationship. I am getting myself back day by day.

And it wasn’t like my STBXH (we are not divorced yet) was really very much help anyway. And my nagging him for support which never came, and deep deep resentment is now gone and a weight lifted from my spirit which means I can look after both girls much easier and with a lightness usually.

It was shit at the time but absolutely the right thing to do. I have no regrets. I had to protect my 2 DDs from growing up in an emotionally abusive environment and I needed to set for them an example I am proud of, and to be the best person I can be, which was not possible had I stayed.

It was hard raising a new born and 2 year old on my own, but I sought out some help (a friend to look after my eldest at the birth) and actually, I was doing so much of the new born heavy lifting anyway, it wasn’t like I noticed much of my partner not being there.

I can’t think of any single day as a single parent of a young baby and toddler that was harder or more challenging, than any single day I had in the abusive relationship.

@Poolbridge wow you were so brave to do that and I'm so glad it worked out for you. What are the custody arrangements? I really do have safety concerns regarding one of my DSC and my youngest baby which would be out of my control if we split. He currently has them weekends and half the holidays so a significant amount and I couldn't keep them from their half sisters.

Maybe she’s a “psycho” because of he years she spent with your DH. He’s making you doubt yourself, so why wouldn’t he have done that to her too? Maybe she wanted to change contact arrangements because seeing your DH was having an adverse effect on the DC, rather than being about her being narcissistic and wanting her own way. Maybe she’s trying to protect her DC from a dad who is emotionally and physically abusive (raising your fists in an argument is abuse. Just because he doesn’t hit you doesn’t make him a good husband). You will know what the issue is with DSC and CAFCASS. What has been alleged? It is not his ex’s job to stop you getting married and the timing of the report was probably outwith her control. You say “why wait?” until you were married, but would you have listened to the psycho ex? This is a man who constantly puts you down, he ignores you and outs you down, he tried to get back with his ex while seeing you, he will not intervene to stop his children being harmed by their siblings and he raisies his fists to you (he doesn’t need to hit you at the moment because the threat of violence is enough to get you to behave). If there were things in the report that you thought might be true or made you question his version of events (plus you don’t know what he’s said to his ex so it could be she’s put off raising the abuse allegations on false promises etc then just got to the “No more” point) then maybe she’s not the psycho.

Does he have the DSC at weekends and during holidays, or do you end up doing the childcare? I'm wondering how much he'd actually have them over if you weren't around to facilitate it.

@LannieDuck

Does he have the DSC at weekends and during holidays, or do you end up doing the childcare? I'm wondering how much he'd actually have them over if you weren't around to facilitate it.

I used to do a lot and still do lots but obviously with 2 young babies I can no longer do as much. Which has led to me now being told I don't care since my own children have come along which of course isn't true. But when you 99% of the care for a 4 month and 20 month there's little capacity for much else.

I contacted the doctor last month and have been given ADs which have taken the edge of but I'm still struggling to know what to do...

@Lolapusht you could be right. And to be honest I don't have the energy to work it out. I've gone though years of hell with her, she's been nasty to me about me through the children since day 1. So I could well have been fed lies vy DH but I have had a bad experience and I can honestly say I've done nothing to warrant that. Have always been civil and treated her children as I hope mine would be treated by any future step-parent.

She alleges he is physically rough with DSC. I have lived with him and DSC longer than his ex did (they split when she was 2) and he has never, ever been rough with her. I also know there's other things in there not true asI was on the scene then and it's not how events occured. So really I have no idea who's telling the truth but I just don't want to be involved with either of them anymore.

I saw a solicitor right at the beginning as I was making plans, to know where I stood on custody and a range of other issues. In my case, I was at the time the primary carer for our 2yo DD (I worked 3 days, he 5) and would be the primary caregiver for the newborn going forward as I would be breastfeeding, but also generally the primary carer anyway.

I told him this, and proposed re our 2 yo DD over night stays on a Tuesday night and Friday night and all day Saturday, and with the newborn, he could visit for 2-3 hour visits as and when he wanted, but she had to be with me as I was breastfeeding. Initially he said he would go NC with both daughters, I think a strategy to upset me, by hurting them, but then got on board with the proposal, and it’s been workable. But the separating / handover was very distressing for our 2 yo for a long time.

I have been fortunate, he has actually been exceedingly decent re paying child maintenance, and negotiating shared parenting. But that’s the thing, you never now how a partner will be until once the dust is settled, no matter how well you think you might know them. In your case, I suppose you have observed his conduct with his ex, and so probably have some insight.

I really encourage you to read Lundy Bancrofts book. Once your eyes have been opened to a person / man’s ‘choice’ in being emotionally abusive, you really can’t look back.

@Lessthanaballpark

OP have you thought about contacting his ex directly. She might clarify some things for you.

I was wondering if this might be a possibility.

Thanks everyone I will definitely look at the books you've suggested. I just know I'm stuck here for at least another 6 months what with covid and the babies ages I can't see a way out. But at least I know what's happening isn't right and I can't start to form a plan.

Hi @Lostmyway86 just wanted to say it definitely sounds like abuse to me! You dont deserve to be treated that way! Contact www.nationaldahelpline.org.uk/ for support and advice for your particular circumstances. xx

Raising a fist is threatening violence, so yes, it's abuse. Your relationship is toxic. He is the toxin.

I'm sorry you're having to go through this. You can't raise children with a man who threatens violence and puts you down, it will set them a terrible example of what a relationship should look like.

You could contact Women's Aid, maybe? They've seen lots of people in similar situations to yours, and will be able to offer you some support, emotionally, and with your planning.

I don't want to sound harsh, but this is how I think.
You are your daughters role model. You are setting the bar for them. If you continue in this relationship, accepting this treatment, they will grow up thinking that's normal. What would you tell them to do in this situation?

You can't change him, this isn't your fault, the only thing you can do is refuse to accept it and leave. You can cope on your own, and not only will you cope, but you will be happier without the constant put downs.

If you can't leave for a few months then just make sure you're preparing, seeking support and making a plan to leave.

Not harsh at all. I get it and would probably say the same to another poster and definitely family or friends in this situation. But in reality it's so much harder to do. It would literally be ripping my family apart, leaving my home. Financially I can't afford to continue paying a mortgage and rent on another property as well as two lots of childcare when I go back to work. I just can't see how I could do it unless we divorce and sell up but that all takes years.

I swear these men must have a sixth sense as he's run me a bath tonight and is sorting the babies as I'm not feeling well despite him being at work all day. It's like he knows what I'm thinking even though there's no way of him seeing this thread.

Covid wouldn’t stop you moving out. You could, if you wanted, move in with a family member or friend.

Also - Custody arrangements are different with young babies I understand - it wouldn’t be 50/50 until they are older.

It’s certainly possible that ex wife can be awful and your husband abusive.

One thing you can do now: make sure your contraception is good so you don’t get pregnant again (maybe the coil?). That would be the last thing you need while you decide what to do.