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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Is my mother neurodivergent?

37 replies

Raemie · 20/02/2021 21:50

For the longest time I have been ashamed of mother.

Let me explain before I make myself sound like a total b. My mother had 6 children including me, all of whom suffered some form of mild physical and emotional neglect which sometimes crossed over to mild abuse( being left unattended, not bathed for weeks, told we shouldn’t have been born etc.) To set the scene, I’m the oldest, two of my siblings are biological and the other three are half siblings. My dad left us when I was about 5 and my mum met another man who is the father of my half siblings. we grew up in a three bedroom house, my mother claimed benefits most of her life (she did work briefly when I was a teen) and basically we were viewed as ‘hillbilly’s’ by our neighbours. We were hardly washed, our house was filthy inside and out, my mum hoards everything, cleans but doesn’t clean properly so you’d find crisp packets down the back of the sofa, dishes piled up with food left on them overnight. If anyone stepped in to clean she would get defensive and call us snobs, my stepdad did a lot of the housework but he worked full time and I’m sure he eventually gave up because my mum would never keep it clean.

Anyway to get to the point, I moved away and lived in Canada and now live in the UK. I had so much resentment towards her for years but still kept in touch with her and visit the family home in Ireland a couple of times a year (pre Covid). It’s only in recent years I have started to be slightly more understanding towards her as I am now training to be a psychologist so I understand a lot about behaviour a lot more than I did when I was younger. I am honestly starting to wonder if she has some sort of ‘special need’ or mental health problem that was never diagnosed.

These are some examples that make me think she might be neurodivergent

Firstly she used to do strange things when we were small like hide in various parts of the house to see if we’d go look for her. We used to panic of course, we would call out to her and then find her hiding in a wardrobe. I copped on at about age 8 to what she was doing so didn’t look for her anymore but saw her do it to my younger siblings.

She used to masturbate in front of the tv even if we were in the room

She never closed the door in the bathroom so I used to think it was normal to leave the door wide open while going to the toilet. She would do this when I had friends over too.

She is unable to clean, hoards things, keeps laundry on the table, old broken items out in the garden. We even had rats in the house as kids.

She has never really had friends, isolates herself away from family, gossips about people and judges them in a very obsessive way.

She is extremely chatty and appears friendly and gentle to people who wouldn’t know her but she doesn’t know when to stop talking and talks about silly things. For example, when I lived in Canada and phone her once every three months she would ask questions like, ‘do they have frozen pizza over there?’ She still checks the weather for Canada and texts me sometimes to tell me what the weather is like there even though I’ve lived in the UK for 5 years now. She knows this obviously but still thinks this is interesting information to me.

She acts like a child, will blubber at the drop of a hat. When she worked in retail briefly, the manager asked her to work Christmas eve once and she said she just burst out crying straight away instead of handling it like an adult. She also cried before because I told my younger sister (who was 12 at the time) that Santa didn’t exist, this was because she asked me. My mother cried like a baby and asked me shy I was so evil to tell my sister such a thing.

She doesn’t have great personal hygiene, rarely showers and can be smelly but when she really needs to appear clean she can do so. She seems to be very socially aware in that sense but just lazy.

She is morbidly obese and can barely walk
or find clothes to fit her. Myself and siblings have encouraged her to lose weight, she always says she will but never does.

She apparently struggled in school but did ok in English as she likes reading. In fact she can read long novels, nothing too difficult but a good long story.
She told me she walked out of most of her leaving cert exams (equivalent to A-levels) and couldn’t grasp maths at all. She did grow up in rural Ireland where she said she was constantly out down by teachers and told she was stupid. One of her sisters (whom I’m close to, had a similar experience with teachers but did ok in life).

The list could honestly go on, she’s basically very uneducated and is socially awkward and I’m beginning to think it’s something more. The thing is nobody else in her family are like that, her sisters all did ok in life, some became teachers or nurses others married ‘well’ and became house wives who raised children that excelled in life. we all struggled and all of my siblings have mental health or addiction problems, never even completed education or got jobs. I think my sister could have the same problems that my mother has as she is quite vacant compared to my other family members and reminds me of my mother a lot.

My mother had a difficult upbringing as she was brought up (unknowingly) by her grandmother and only found out at 13 that this was in fact not her mother and her real mother was her sister (who was, and still is quite mean to her). Apparently she told my mother that she would have aborted her if she had the chance. I can only imagine how confused she would have felt growing up. She talks about feelings of abandonment a lot although I think she goes on about it a little too obsessively as she wasn’t left on at some strangers doorstep but brought up and cared for by her birth family.

She also has a ‘feel sorry’ for herself attitude to most things in her life including her divorce with my dad which happened over 25 years ago. She would talk about it for hours and hours if you let her and she has done, it’s almost an obsession.

Anyway I don’t really know what I’m asking for with this long, exhausting post but I just wonder could it be a personality disorder, ASD or is she just uncaring and unbothered? Anyone have family members like this, what do you do?

OP posts:
Lili132 · 21/02/2021 17:33

You really can't compare your mother to her sisters who married well. They would have had relatively easy life, more resources, their husbands would probably provide money for education of their children.
It always goes both ways. Mental health affects life choices but then life circumstances affect mental health. Seems like your mother ended up in a bad loop. She already struggled with her mental health then her life affected her further and she didn't get much opportunity to grow. Sometimes it is like a vicious cycle and really hard to get out of.
I don't think anybody here can give you any definite insight into your mother's condition. It's clear that there was a lot of abuse and neglect in you childhood and hopefully you will be able to channel energy into your own healing and focus on yourself.

BMHM · 21/02/2021 17:36

OP, I'm sorry you and your siblings went through this as children. I know how painful it can be to realise that other parents don't treat children like this as you did when you began nannying.

I understand the desire the label someone which can give the allusion of control, it wraps up behaviour in a box and minuses the ownership of the person vs condition. However, not all divergent behaviours (in line with Western values) can be pathologised and fit into a given set of symptoms which signify a medical condition. It may well be that your Mother has got a mental health disorder, possibly comorbidities, but only she can get that diagnosis. No every abuser is mentally unwell, and not every mentally unwell person is abusive. Psychologists, in my experience, also very rarely like to diagnosis because often people are the way the are because of trauma, and not vice versa.

Misty9 · 21/02/2021 17:47

I would agree with early developmental complex trauma, and possibly a learning disability from what you've said.

For yourself though I would recommend systemic therapy to help you access the emotions you referenced. Or Cognitive Analytic Therapy (CAT) is well regarded for interpersonal issues too. Good luck Flowers

Ohhgreat · 21/02/2021 17:49

My first instinct reading your posts is not autism, but more a trauma response, maybe PTSD? As a result of her upbringing / the revelation her sister was her mother etc.

Kintsuji · 21/02/2021 19:47

EMDR is supposed to be very good for trauma @Raemie. I found CBT helpful for my anxiety and physical chronic illness, but not for childhood trauma or what has happened with my DH. Talking therapy was worse, it made the trauma feel raw and immediate again. I've started ACT (Acceptance and Commitment Therapy) which seems to be helping. But my trauma isn't to the same extent.

Hailtomyteeth · 21/02/2021 20:02

Lol, no, it wasn't bad.
It was a bit autistic.

A six week talking therapy course is a taster. I've had thirteen therapists in twelve years, or something like that. The last two were bloody amazing, but there was years of working up to that point, sometimes feeling there was no progress, but there always was, even if it took years to bed in. I spent five months weekly, one to one, talking about my mother. I think something like that would help you untangle your love and concern from your frustration with an adult who seemingly won't take care of herself and your pain from what you suffered in childhood. It's all mixed up and it takes a while to sort out. But be heartened, because all the different aspects can improve, I know that from my own experience. Your inner child is in great need of love and care.

I've mellowed a bit since this morning, when I was in 'Not all bad people are autistic' mode. Wink

Raemie · 21/02/2021 20:08

Thanks for the therapy recommendations, I will look into it. Assuming I would have to go private for them?

@Branleuse yes she definitely has bad theory of mind and rejection sensitive dyshoria, she has loads of obsessions too but not typical ones, she’s obsessed with babies and child birth, soap operas and I mean really obsessed, will talk about them constantly. Autism in women is extremely under researched and can present rather different than men. Anyway I’m going off on a tangent, it’s likely more of a trauma response or lack of decent upbringing mixed with a number of other mental health problems. This has helped me put things into perspective. Thanks everyone!

OP posts:
Branleuse · 21/02/2021 20:26

Well its not as if autism is rare. Theres a hell of a lot of undiagnosed/misdiagnosed women out there. I also think sometimes some people are traumatised by things that others take in their stride because of autism

username4214 · 21/02/2021 20:27

OP my mum is similar. She also had a similar background to yours. She kind of dissociates, she's there but not there and she doesn't listen or take in what you're saying. She was very neglectful, just had no idea about basic standards. She had screaming rages but unlike yours, managed to hold down a good job so mine was more in control of her behaviour and more manipulative if you see what I mean as she was very good at masking.

My mum doesn't understand boundaries and asked us what we were doing in the toilet when we were children and we had to tell her. She also had strangely deviant sexual things that she'd do like stare at our crotches and sniff our dirty knickers. She also would go through our things, read diaries, search in our drawers, look under our beds. Once she lifted my dress as she said she'd seen holes in my underwear (I was in my 30s).

She gets obsessed about people and things and picks things out of the bin and off the street. Little plastic figures and buttons, that kind of thing. She doesn't understand anything about modern society as though she's living in a bubble. It's been suggested to me that she is dissociating all the time.

She knows absolutely nothing whatsoever about me. She doesn't know about hobbies, likes or dislikes, friends, anything. If I tell her anything, she immediately forgets, like she asked me what my graduation score was when I did my last Masters and has now asked me 8 or 9 times. Forgetting each time but she wouldn't know what the score meant anyway as she took no interest in our schoolwork. I didn't learn to spell my name properly or tell the time for example until quite late as she didn't teach me anything.

She is sadistic and likes to find out what bothers you and enjoys getting at you (but all her family are like this). She has no patience and finds things very complicated to follow like complicated storylines in films. She likes simple humour and plots like Mr Bean. She treats me like an enemy, and has never taken my side or stuck up for me even when she has no idea about what's gone on. That's just some of it.

I have always suspected that she has a low IQ and it's a result of trauma as well. I'm now estranged from her as there's no point in a relationship with her. Everything revolves around her and her needs, she doesn't really see me. If I don't agree with her or go along with it she'll fly into a rage and can be dangerous.

My advice to you is to grieve. Grieve the mother you should have had and get angry, feel that sadness and process it with the use of therapy and other strategies. Learn about child trauma, CPTSD, dysfunctional roles in families etc etc All that helped me to distance myself from her, learn that she was dangerous and abusive and there was no relationship to salvage as it was all in my head.

I'm sorry you've gone through this and are still going through it. It was never your fault, it sounds as though you've all been very badly let down and abandoned by those meant to care for you. That's hard to deal with.

Hailtomyteeth · 21/02/2021 20:35

All my therapy has been free, nhs/local authority/charity. I was such a sad case ... well, I was, but I was also bloody determined to get better, so I followed every lead and wouldn't let them brush me off. It was hard, painful, but I'm much better now. And my house is almost tidy. Do we have a 'smug grin' emoji?

Raemie · 21/02/2021 21:24

@username4214 you sound like me, you sure we don’t have the same mother? LOL!

@Hailtomyteethim glad you’re healing and I will look into therapy again but don’t think talking therapies are for me. Sorry if you thought I was implying that people with autism are all bad. Of course I wasn’t. However, when neurodivergent people have children they usually have a social worker to make sure the children are being looked after properly. This would obviously be for people who are quite severe in their diagnosis and may not have awareness of bad behaviour.

OP posts:
username4214 · 21/02/2021 22:18

OP I'm not going to tell you my background but it's very similar to yours. My mum is also really gullible and believes anything, she has got herself into some dodgy situations before because of it. She finds it very difficult to deal with anything complicated and used to ask us to turn over the TV for her as she couldn't use her own remote control. She can't handle phoning an electricity company about a bill, she'd always get us to do that kind of thing. She can only drive certain routes as well and frequently gets lost as her mind wanders.

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