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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

SIL is sending my elderly mother upsetting messages. Do I do something?

52 replies

largeprintagathachristie · 16/02/2021 18:26

My SIL has been married to my brother for approx. 20 years. The rest of us immediately saw less and less of him, as she controlled his access to friends and family. (My brother pretty much let this happen and devolved all 'family administration' to her. )

There are incidents after incidents of him not turning up at long planned gatherings - think family flying in for a wedding from all over the world, the one time in, say, five years that my mother would have all her adult children in the same place. SIL would always have an emergency that would scupper plans at the last minute. There is always drama. I can't keep up with who she's not speaking to - she's gone years without speaking to her mother. Then her mother will be back "in" and it's her father that's out. Or a sister.

SIL has been explicit that her nuclear family is all that matters. (Ahem, particularly after the children were older and she didn't need babysitting services.) There's been crazy incidents that I won't use the space here to detail.

At no point, and this actually seems strange to me, has anyone from my brother's side of the family actually say to him, WTF?! On our side I'd say we're quiet, a bit (quite a bit) dysfunctional in our own way; we're not a close family, which is sad, but I think the roots of that go back a long way and we can't change now. We do care about each other. We're also very geographically dispersed.

I've watched cautiously, held my tongue during very occasional visits with my brother and SIL, etc. Visits usually painful with SIL exploding very dramatically, particularly obvious if the attention is not on her. Really difficult to get my brother alone for an actual conversation. He is naturally quiet anyway, and they've also done that thing where they have joint email addresses/messenger accounts.

Two years ago my brother developed a serious health problem. Potentially life limiting, though luckily it has turned out that this is not the case.

Last time I saw SIL alone, a year ago, she was was particularly angry and vitriolic about my mother, who is in her late 80's. That my mother had been a bad parent. Now, my mother is NOT perfect, I'm the first to admit. She wasn't very interested in being a mother and yes, I've visited the Stately Homes thread. Nothing terrible but disinterested in being a mother and stayed in an abusive marriage which affected us as kids and into our adult lives. SIL went on and on with a level of anger that was unnerving, ending with saying that my mother would die, "but nothing will kill her off, she'll last forever."

To not cause a row - hmmm, I see a pattern here - I kind of just took it all, said my mother had little self awareness and in her late 80s, she's realistically unlikely to change. That I had made my peace with it, that it was nothing personal towards SIL. Was pleased to make my escape, also from the very right-wing, anti-vaccer and racist comments.

Since then my mother's had a very hurtful email message from SIL and just recently a weird text. My mum has asked me not to tell anyone else because she fears a blow up where she'll see and hear her son even less.

The main charge against my DM seems to be that she is not sufficiently interested in SIL and is insensitive. The later is true, my DM is TOTALLY INSENSITIVE but she has been since time immemorial - there are standing family jokes about it - and is that a reason to harass a woman who's heading towards 90!?

Reasons to do something:

  • this is OUR mother, not hers, FFS, back off
  • DM is late 80s and has had cancer this year. The messages are upsetting her. She can't sleep. I suspect there have been more messages than she's letting on.

Reasons to do nothing

  • DM doesn't want me to
  • brother is ill. Whatever the marriage is like on the inside, my brother has been with SIL a long time and will be in the future. I assume he doesn't know about the messaging. My mum doesn't want to get him involved.
  • SIL will explode. Go nuclear. I imagine I would never be allowed in her home again and she will restrict access to my brother and access to her children to my mother. My mother will be upset. My other siblings (who have their own SIL stories) will be drawn in. I know this sounds dramatic, but it's got really dark. I suspect there a personality disorder at play here.

Sorry, I imagine this is long!

OP posts:
HappySonHappyMum · 16/02/2021 23:34

Set up email forwarding to you and get text divert to you from that number to you. SIL will never know and you can monitor contact.

Ahmnotacat · 16/02/2021 23:57

Stay out of it, it's none of your business.

Your SIL knows your DB much better than you do, and probably knows more about the damage that a mother who 'wasn't interested' has had on him.

You just focus on your own relationship with her.

ktp100 · 16/02/2021 23:58

Can you not just block SILs number on your Mum's phone?

Hont1986 · 17/02/2021 00:03

Just block her number and filter her emails. By the way, I don't agree that your DM gets a pass for being a bigot just because she's old.

Bythemillpond · 17/02/2021 00:09

largeprintagathachristie and Lochmorlich
I was trying to point out the similarity in SIL and largeprintagathachristie’s mother

Sil isn’t interested in extended family and the mother wasn’t interested in her own family.
I was trying to say (rather clumsily) that maybe the brother at a subconscious level is choosing to be with sil because that is what he is used to. Maybe there are other similarities.
Like people who choose a certain type of partner again and again.
Whilst what the sil is doing needs addressing if your brother really thought about the impact on his mother and the rest of the family I do believe he would try to distance himself from the actions of his wife.
No one knows what goes on in a marriage and if it was as bad as you say then after 20 years I think there would have been a glimmer of some sort of protest at some point from him.

MichelleScarn · 17/02/2021 00:15

So your dm wasn't a good parent, was disinterested and has little self awareness, your DB has been really unwell recently and his wife has ended up losing her shit at you....
So is it really the SIL doesn't want to engage in the family lie of 'dm is not very nice or caring but let's not acknowledge that'?

oil0W0lio · 17/02/2021 00:20

Goodness me sister-in-law sounds very toxic, kind of a blunderbuss though....not subtle at all, she's a big ole spanner in the works
I say be quiet and low key, back away slowly no sudden movements, I probably wouldn't mention the vile emails because that would be acknowledging her and that gives her fuel, but is there any way to calm your mother down?
feel like her type will often hang themselves if given enough rope 🤔

Butterymuffin · 17/02/2021 00:40

Blocking is only the nuclear option if your mum tells them. I would block and say nothing. If they then make any reference to messages sent, say she's had phone problems.
Sounds like there have been issues on both sides but I would imagine no or very low contact is the only way to avoid outright hostility.
Incidentally, do you know what your mum's plans are re will and inheritance? I think it would be good for you to be prepared for that, whatever the scenario might be.

Hont1986 · 17/02/2021 00:45

The little detail I noticed in your post was that DM's 'insensitivity' was "nothing personal towards SIL".

Has she been making her own abusive comments to SIL, by any chance?

thefourgp · 17/02/2021 01:01

I agree with everything Sssloou said. Neither she nor your brother are going to say ‘you’re right - we’ll be nicer to your mother in the future’. You would be wasting your time and energy. It would become a massive family fall out and there’s a genuine likelihood you’d never see your brother again. As tempting as it is to say what you think, it will only make things worse especially when your mother doesn’t want anything said. Teach your mother how to block her calls/texts and have her emails go to a junk mailbox.

thefourgp · 17/02/2021 01:02

Just tell your mum to pretend she doesn’t know why she didn’t get the messages.

RantyAnty · 17/02/2021 02:44

How do you know so much detail about your SIL and DB's life?

aweegc · 17/02/2021 03:04

Strikes me that if your DB was a DS who had moved away and had much less contact with family and had an explosive partner and basically only contact was via joint accounts, we'd all be calling this something else. If SIL has a personality disorder or not, it doesn't excuse her behaviour towards anybody.

DB may be conditioned into this relationship, but it doesn't mean it's not abusive. It's true nobody can make him leave, he'd have to want to himself etc. But it's not his fault for staying with her. If tradespeople have walked out and returned money, that's seriously bad!

I'd be inclined to block SIL, not let on and start looking up domestic violence resources for DB, to surreptitiously feed to him.

yvanka · 17/02/2021 03:55

I assume your DM is not replying anyway? Just block SIL and don't tell her.

SausageBeanz · 17/02/2021 07:04

I actually think your 'DEAR' bro needs a sharp word had with him to stop being a selfish twat and burying his head in the sand (going on walks) to ignore and not deal with family issues - particularly when the family issue is his wife bullying his elderly mother.

This woman needs put in her fucking place. And your brother needs to stop allowing his wife to bully the family. The issue is as much with your brother as his wife, for not dealing with the venomous behaviour to his family.

No way any partner of mine but bully family of mine. None of us are perfect; that doesn't mean we deserve to be bullied.

SausageBeanz · 17/02/2021 07:04

*would, not but.

Covidcorvid · 17/02/2021 07:08

Ideally imagine your SIL is itching for a reason to convince her dh to go no contact. Don’t give her one. Don’t message her about it.

LadyTruck · 17/02/2021 07:11

My DFs DM sounds like your Mum. She's very good at playing siblings against each other. Telling each child a different version of the actual story & telling them not to talk about it to other siblings etc
If your mum is insensitive why hasn't she raised it herself? Tread carefully OP as it sounds like she maybe using you as her flying monkey.

Soontobe60 · 17/02/2021 07:24

Have you not considered that she is supporting her dh, your brother? You’ve agreed that your DM wasn’t a great mother but you’ve been able to get over that. maybe your dh hasn’t? Maybe its still having an impact on him? The question is, should age allow people to not be challenged about their actions? It may be the only way your db can move on from what to him may have been an awful childhood. He has the right to speak his mind, even if it is through his wife.

MichelleScarn · 17/02/2021 07:53

This woman needs put in her fucking place. Confused yes, because that's a healthy way to look at trying to maintain the relationship with your brother.

Sssloou · 17/02/2021 09:47

@Covidcorvid

Ideally imagine your SIL is itching for a reason to convince her dh to go no contact. Don’t give her one. Don’t message her about it.
Yes I see it as a provocation - she wants a fight - don’t give it
cheeseismydownfall · 17/02/2021 10:43

Hmmm. I agree that your SIL sounds like a very difficult person, but it also comes across that you are downplaying the fact that your mother is also a difficult person. Just because you have made peace with your childhood doesn't mean your DB has. Perhaps your SIL has spent 20 years listening to your DB telling her about his difficult childhood, and is angry with your DM. Perhaps your DB is partially complicit in creating the distance. I don't know, but from what you have said it sounds like your SIL version of events might be very different to yours.

Mittens030869 · 17/02/2021 14:18

It sounds like the SIL is a difficult person, but so is the OP's DM. So it might be the case that she herself has provoked this hostility. As it's all secondhand, it's impossible to know the actual truth.

Or else they're simply as bad as each other, in which case you're best off staying well out of it.

WeeDangerousSpike · 17/02/2021 14:36

Why would blocking be the nuclear option? Just block and don't say anything, how would SIL know?

MrsBobDylan · 17/02/2021 15:43

I would leave them both to it. I think they are both playing a part in this dispute. Since your Mum was 'disinterested in being a Mother', failed to save her kids from an abusive marriage and is 'insensitive' it is highly likely you are being spun something of a yarn op and your Mum wants you drawn into the drama.

Presumably your Mum has experienced conflict all her life. Is it possible she is something like SIL and your brother married a version of his Mum?

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