What happens to turn marriages sour?

newcurtainsNo9 · 2021-02-14T06:31:30+00:00

I read so many threads on here from women with men who sound awful. Hateful, spiteful, vindictive, mean and unkind. At some point, these couples were (presumably) in love and wanted to be together forever. I'm single after 20 years with my childhood sweetheart, and I'm wary of meeting someone new in the future. Why does this seem to happen (I know not often, or usually but it does happen). I'm not talking about classic abuse, I know about abusers and controlling behaviour and how it can evolve and manifest. I'm talking about clearly very unhappy marriages. Why does the love go? Is it when the attraction goes?

Ducksurprise · 14/02/2021 06:48

'If someone shows you who they are believe them'

I think many women believe they can change a person, that things will improve. I also believe that we don't teach boundaries to our children (maybe people do now) I think eventually it all catches up and people realise that they don't want to put up with it anymore.

Sally2791 · 14/02/2021 06:54

I agree with Ducksurprise. It’s like death by a thousand cuts, each little thing you have brushed under the carpet eventually becomes too much. Also when there aren’t enough good times to outweigh the bad.
And yes, finally you realise that it won’t get better, he won’t change because he doesn’t care enough how you feel, and the only way to be happy is to leave.

user1483387154 · 14/02/2021 06:55

taking each other for granted and not prioritising each other

Pluas · 14/02/2021 06:57

Well, what happened in your case?

Original poster

newcurtainsNo9 · 14/02/2021 07:00

So you think all that stuff is there in the first place? It's just ignored/downplayed by the woman, hoping it's not a big deal? Ignoring red flags?

Why do these traits escalate? Because he stops making the effort to hide them I guess. Also, these men seem like such bad, horrible people. They're clearly deeply unhappy at best. Presumably they're not like this with friends/colleagues/family members. Why? Due to not being as close to them?

The boundaries thing is so hard. Mine seem so flexible! Sorry for all the questions, I want to try to understand this from experienced people.

OP posts:

FluffyLamkins · 14/02/2021 07:00

I think sometimes you ignore the signs, and also that people who are dating are on their best behaviour. Plus once you have a family or the normal stresses of life, then there’s more pressure and you have to work together. For example, when I was dating my husband he used to ask me to note down where I was going when I was out running because he said he was so worried about me when I was out alone. Harmless yeah? Concerned about my safety? But that was a warning of the fact he’s rather controlling about lots of other things. However now I’m older I just need to assert my boundaries with him if he’s overstepping the mark. Like when he criticised my friend I say it’s none of his business because they are my friend not his. If I let him or listened to everything he’d be a nightmare. I also thought his late rising was because he worked so hard and he was tired. But it wears thin when you’ve been up through the night with the baby and up since 6am and the lazy bugger still thinks he’s doing well to be up at 9am to go to work. He is probably the “garden” version of his faults though which makes him bearable on those fronts. People that are more determined about being controlling or lazy would be a nightmare and I’d get rid I guess.
I thought the book “so you will marry the wrong person” is enlightening (basically that you marry the version of the person not the reality and also that you are in denial yourself about your own character “I’m easy to live with” but in recognition of that you can move to improve your marriage.

Original poster

newcurtainsNo9 · 14/02/2021 07:01

@Pluas

Well, what happened in your case?

Nothing like this. We just fell out of love. He was never like that, which I guess is why when I read about it, I want to understand what and why. I don't want to be naive

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poblwcymru · 14/02/2021 07:02

Same thing that happened to you relationship with added stress of solicitors, custody and divorce.

In my experience most marriages collapse after infidelity.

Original poster

newcurtainsNo9 · 14/02/2021 07:02

@user1483387154

taking each other for granted and not prioritising each other

That's reassuring

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DisgruntledPelican · 14/02/2021 07:06

I think there are two different situations at play here. Sometimes people’s true natures are revealed over time and incompatibility becomes clear - possibly more likely if someone marries quickly, in the honeymoon period, and have never experienced the ups and downs of life within the partnership. Incompatibility wasn’t recognised because of getting carried away with romance.

But then there are the situations like @user1483387154 describes where people start to take each other for granted. It can happen so slowly, over years, and then all of a sudden you realise how unhappy you are but you’ve got a mortgage and maybe a few children and unravelling your whole life because of vague unhappiness can seem too difficult or overwhelming. In some cases there may have been red flags at the start, but the societal pressure to couple up and/or have children can make a lot of people suppress any doubts they have.

Original poster

newcurtainsNo9 · 14/02/2021 07:21

That's makes sense. So it's not (necessarily) that the man is a bad/abusive person. He's expressing a deep unhappiness he feels he can't change, and it manifests in behaving like an arsehole.

So get to know someone well before committing. Test your relationship

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MessAllOver · 14/02/2021 07:28

In a lot of cases... one partner doesn't pull their weight prior to DC but it is not very noticeable since there's not that much to do when you're both adults and both partners lead quite independent lives.

Then... baby arrives, both partners need to step up, only one does. The one who steps up becomes more financially dependent on the other one since they're doing all the childcare and housework and it's hard to combine that with a stressful, full-time job if your partner doesn't help. So they feel trapped. The other partner takes advantage of that to help even less and treat them like shit because they're financially dependent and would find it difficult to leave. Many in this situation decide to wait it out until their children are at school because it's easier to leave then than in the exhausting early days where you'd have to pay a fortune for full-time childcare. So they silently resent their selfish partners and bide their time.

MissHemsworth · 14/02/2021 07:38

I think once a couple gets married and have children the woman becomes increasingly financially reliant on the man (not it all cases I know, but it is common) and therefore he becomes complacent and doesn't have to make any effort. He is deemed a hero by society because he's a hardworking dad & husband which in turn bolsters his ego & starts living the narrative that he's doing everyone a big favour by working. He then feels it's justified to treat his wife like shit because why should he have to be nice to her AND work his arse off!

yearinyearout · 14/02/2021 07:40

I definitely think a lot of it is always there, it's just ignored or not noticed because people are busy bringing up kids/working hard etc and it's sometimes easier to brush issues under the carpet.

When the dc grow up and you have more time together, issues become more noticeable. Then you have the menopause that I'm sure makes women less tolerant to bullshit. It's a combination of things I guess.

yearinyearout · 14/02/2021 07:42

Also, don't assume marriages end because all the men are "bad, horrible people". They can be generally nice people who just do lots of annoying things, that their wife just realises she doesn't want to tolerate anymore. Or couples just realise they want different things out of life.

JustAnotherOldMan · 14/02/2021 07:44

Taking each other for granted is probably one of the main reasons

If you asked my exwife she would probably say that about me, but I found her vindictive and controlling
2 people in a relationship and both will probably have a different option of who is at fault

Kroptopbelly · 14/02/2021 07:54

Lockdown for us.

A shift in dynamic.
A hike in stressors.
Our usual pleasures stopping. (Planning holidays, DIY, upkeep of our house, days out of life etc)

His pressures affecting and influencing his behaviour.
My stressors influencing and affecting my behaviour.

I think/hope temporary though. Once life settles and returns to normality then we’ll be ok.

Carandi · 14/02/2021 08:01

I'm mid 50s and married 30 years. If this site had been around when I was dating I probably wouldn't have married him. However, I was a very naive young woman with zero self confidence and low self esteem. I didn't date much due to this so when I started going out with my now husband I ignored all the red flags thinking he was my only chance of finding "love". I thought he would change (how stupid was I!) He didn't, he only got worse. I plan to leave him this year, just trying to find the courage to tell him it's over.

SquirrelFan · 14/02/2021 08:01

Children

mostlydrinkstea · 14/02/2021 08:05

Sometimes it happens suddenly when one partner checked out of the marriage and forgot to tell the wife/husband. It is sometimes called a tsunami divorce cos you really didn't see it coming. With hindsight there were signs but they are subtle and overnight it really does go from ' I love you' to 'I've been unhappy for years and I can't do this anymore.' There is usually an affair partner but not always. Vicki Stark's book Runaway Husbands gives the gory detail.

SlothWithACloth · 14/02/2021 08:06

When you’re in love, and maybe naive, you believe all their excuses for crap behaviour ‘oh I’m sorry, I was so busy at work. I’ll make it up’
So, they get away with all the little upsetting things until you realise that this is who they are and you don’t like them.

pursuedbyablackdog · 14/02/2021 09:15

@MessAllOver

In a lot of cases... one partner doesn't pull their weight prior to DC but it is not very noticeable since there's not that much to do when you're both adults and both partners lead quite independent lives.

Then... baby arrives, both partners need to step up, only one does. The one who steps up becomes more financially dependent on the other one since they're doing all the childcare and housework and it's hard to combine that with a stressful, full-time job if your partner doesn't help. So they feel trapped. The other partner takes advantage of that to help even less and treat them like shit because they're financially dependent and would find it difficult to leave. Many in this situation decide to wait it out until their children are at school because it's easier to leave then than in the exhausting early days where you'd have to pay a fortune for full-time childcare. So they silently resent their selfish partners and bide their time.

I think mess has put it much more succinctly than I could

TossaCoinToYerWitcher · 14/02/2021 09:52

Also ennui and depression. As PPs have said, when young couples get together there’s less stress in life and you get the fun side - it can be all about you. But when kids arrive, you’ve got mortgages and debts and maybe serious health conditions emerge then suddenly it’s no longer Loves Young Dream - and more often than not you’re focusing on others. People think “is that all there is?” So when someone else appears - or the possibility emerges (e.g. online dating) - to go back to your pre-family younger self, to be with someone new and sparkly who makes you feel “alive” than your fellow veteran battling with you in the trenches, some people jump for it. It can often be nothing to do with the partner or the relationship in and of itself. It’s just a way of self-medicating, like turning to drink or taking drugs.

A lot of the crappy behaviour usually appears then as the person gets defensive about their actions. Because, all judgement aside, they are being selfish - in that they are putting “self” above all other considerations. So they will lie and gaslight to avoid consequences. Behave coldly to force their partner to dump them rather than end things themselves. Exaggerate faults in order to find a reason other than “being a grown-up is a drag so I want out.”

More often than not, it’s the put-upon person who ends up actually ending things because this toxic behaviour becomes too much. Like a surgeon cutting off a limb that’s become gangrenous.

PeriM · 14/02/2021 10:02

My thoughts on this are that many aren’t really in love in the first place or they settle.

KarensChoppyBob · 14/02/2021 10:06

I think fundamentally if you are together for a long time people change. We all change as we get older but some grow together and others apart.

I've never been attracted to a man because of what he earns, I don't see how that's connected to the man you love and desire physically, not to mention their soul.

My ex was skint when we met and with me supporting as sahm, while we travelled all over, having his children in my twenties, he became very successful and he 'changed'. Nothing was good enough, everything was criticised and me being aware of and objecting to his affairs (and attempts at affairs) - I knew as he would pass out drunk and leave his laptop open, even leave hotel receipts in view.- Eventually I'd had enough.

This is just my experience I know but I think over a period of say 20 yrs people do change, and it can be a positive or a negative thing.