hit a wall with OLD but really want to meet someone

[yellowhighheels]

Hi everyone,

Just a moan if you don't mind!

I've posted about dating on here before but after a string of shitty experiences plus a LOT of completely lacklustre online dates, I just can't do this anymore. I am done.

I have tried to keep chatting to people online through lockdown but now deleted my apps.

I have had to block one man who told me, a propos of nothing, all about his ex's contraception and all the occasions he experienced condoms breaking, and one who kept sending memes to the tune of 'all women drink prosecco uncontrollably' and told me he was thinking of trying to do nude cam work. I didn't even know that was a thing for 44 year old men.

I would really like any advice on how to meet someone especially now as I would love a family but am mid 30s and lockdown is making it so hard.

in 3 years of OLD I have had a number of short flings and 'situationships' however only felt a spark with maybe 2 or 3. One ghosted. One broke things off due to distance (tbh I'm glad with hindsight) and one pretty much sexually assaulted me.

That is after a number of seemingly nice men who were sex obsessed and several who tried to push me into sex or did weird things- one ejaculated on himself during a date, one sat there insulting me until I walked out, plus the gropers. These are men with proper jobs who can hold a conversation and behave when they need to, not flashers who hang around parks.

One I saw for a while but it was totally on his terms, I could not go to his house or meet his friends due to his culture. Definitely not married.

I just feel completely devalued by the whole thing. I try and pick men who seem nice and have their lives in order and am a good judge of character so don't actually get into relationships with men who aren't nice, I just seem to meet so many unsuitable ones.

One who did love me and I considered as he was kind etc ruined it because he refused to improve his dress or hygiene and constantly smelled and wore worn out, scruffy clothes (he had enough money and it was not in an outdoorsy sort of way, just simply filthy. I don't think he was depressed). It felt so disrespectful that a man would pursue me and not bother to not smell of old sweat and pee.

There have also been many dates that were just not quite right.

I am applying to retrain in a new career which would make having a child alone extremely difficult however a family is a priority too.

Sorry to moan but I have always had nice longterm boyfriends until 3 years ago, I never imagined I would maybe never meet the right man for a family.

Does anyone have any ideas? I have one i have been chatting with since lockdown who feels like he might be on a wavelength and got to know as penfriends but just not had chance to meet, maybe I could look to meet him when I can.

I've used a variety of unpaid sites, is there really a difference with paid ones? the men I meet all claim they want a relationship when I ask prior to meeting, not just sex, so I just don't know what I am doing wrong.

I know lockdown makes it harder but I don't have forever. I work, study, have interests and a decent number of friends.

I do sometimes wonder about the ghoster. We seemed to really get on and he seemed lovely. He was going through a very hard time. We planned a 3rd date but it sort of fizzled but in hindsight maybe i should have been more proactive. Has anyone ever got back in touch successfully in this sort of situation? I know ghosting was a dick move but I can't quite forget that one. Last heard a year ago. I know it's ridiculous.

is this what it's like for men?

This is why I have always hated the lazy cliché that women are unreliable because of their hormones - I have seen so much testosterone-fuelled nonsense from men over the years!

Eckhart thats a really interesting way to see it! I was feeling more as though I was beneath even good manners

Tosscoin I wouldn't say alpha behaviour or bad boy excitement does it for me so I am quite strict on being messed around or anything that doesn't seem right before I meet a man.

It's more just that I've met so many where there just isn't much common ground or wavelength even though the chat has been ok before meeting. Then, one or two where we have got on brilliantly but no attraction who have become friends. I just can't seem to find the right guy with both. Even the weird ones have seemed ok generally until meeting

@Hollybutnoivy that is 100% spot on.

Good lord @rosabug that is an insightful post. Thank you.

I too think its a numbers game. I went on dozens of dates, mostly through bumble, much the best of the apps. Met a nice FWB kind of guy eventually, I realised instantly he was normal and decent as well as attractive, unlike many I'd met.

@yellowhighheels

Eckhart thats a really interesting way to see it! I was feeling more as though I was beneath even good manners

If you met one of these men and he suddenly produced an amazing painting or cooked a spectacular gourmet meal, would you take credit for that? If not, why are you taking credit for the crap things?

@rosabug

Some thoughts on men in general from my dating days.

In most of my normal life the men seemed balanced and relatively good chaps. I then started dating relatively late in life.

I came to the following conclusions:

Men really are different. The sex drive is so pervasive (not all men - this goes without saying) that it literally drives then towards inhumane behaviour. There are those who are completely un-self-aware and push ahead with their distorted and morbid agenda on women, who are barely people to them. Then there are those who have some self-awareness and manage to keep a lid on the morbidity to some extent - but have a secret double life. This generally turns them into porn freaks, sneaks and liars.

Then of course there are men with well integrated sexualities and others whose sexuality is subordinate to other needs (Good: affection, friendship / Bad: Control, power, etc).

I had a period where I was on testosterone to see if it had any affect on my migraines many years back. it didn't, but boy my sex drive went up and my orgasms tripled in power - christ! is this what it's like for men? I thought. I also became argumentative and got in trouble at work which I do blame partly on this treatment - which I stopped obvs.

The second factor is the maternal projection thing. That mother son thing is a weird and complex story. Many mothers who, out of love, do everything for their sons and ask nothing for themselves inadvertently create selfish men who default expect utter tolerance from every woman they get involved with. They don't see, or never come to realise, that their mother is actually a separate autonomous human being and therefore do not fully emotionally comprehend this with women in general.

I actually think we should have a more complex and humane dialogue about men and the way they are wired instead of just calling them creeps and expecting 'self control'. Mainly because it doesn't change anything.

But it's true a lot of them are fuck ups. I don't bother with OLD anymore.

Am liking this post

@yellowhighheels

and timing is the problem really, I'd be happy to take a longer break but simply don't have the time now. ice joined a paid site. usefully it lets me see what their preferences are too

From experience I do think this feeling is worth checking carefully. As I result I did really rush into something I convinced myself was perfect through OLD, and made a big mistake as a result. I knew time was getting late and it was 'now or never' but ended up finding myself a real loser. I'm not daft but I do think the feeling of 'not enough time' led me to making a bad decision. My (now) ex seemed more than good enough then, but looking back, the feeling of needing to rush led me to overlook some aspects of his behaviours that I shouldn't have at the time.

😒 I've had a look on Match and tbh there's simply nobody I am that bothered about talking to. Just completely jaded by the whole thing.

Rosabug thank you for your insightful post, just thinking about that one and unpacking it a bit

OP I think you should give it a break until late spring when hopefully lockdown has lifted.

I found internet dating hopeless and my experiences mirror yours and others on the dating posts. Ghosting, lies, inconsistent behaviour, sex pests. And that was only 6 weeks! I had such a low opinion of men I had to give up. I thought being in their 40s & 50s they would have grown up. It seems not.

What worked for me were hobbies. Although the match date nights looked good.

It can work as I have a number of friends who are in long term relationships with guys they met online.

Good luck and have faith!

Rosabug -

Men really are different. The sex drive is so pervasive (not all men - this goes without saying) that it literally drives then towards inhumane behaviour. There are those who are completely un-self-aware and push ahead with their distorted and morbid agenda on women, who are barely people to them. Then there are those who have some self-awareness and manage to keep a lid on the morbidity to some extent - but have a secret double life. This generally turns them into porn freaks, sneaks and liars.

Then of course there are men with well integrated sexualities and others whose sexuality is subordinate to other needs (Good: affection, friendship / Bad: Control, power, etc).

I'm a man and I can confirm this is 100% true.

Often when I read these boards I find myself wishing that I could get into womens' heads and just for one moment make them understand just how different sex and sexual desire is for men than it is for women. Not for my own sake, but just to put people out of the misery that comes from going round and round and round and round in circles trying to understand people by assuming their experience is broadly the same as your own.

I don't know what the outcome of that would be, and I certainly don't mean to absolve the kind of behaviour reported on this and similar threads, which is simply anti-social and frankly bizarre. (Cumming on yourself during a date? Seriously?). But it couldn't be worse than this constantly recurring tale of disappointment born of fundamental misunderstanding.

Thanks fifteen totally see what you're saying, I think what I've been ruminating on with regards this point is this:

I don't know what the outcome of that would be, and I certainly don't mean to absolve the kind of behaviour...

I believe most women do understand men to have a different outlook and attitude towards sex, driven by their physiology.

however, being pushed for sex, harassed in the street etc is deeply unpleasant for women and unwanted and feels as though many men still don't understand or accept this difference, coupled with the fact that a lot of females are physically smaller and weaker than a lot of males which makes this behaviour threatening.

I'm not a very small woman but ejaculater guy was well over 6ft and an ex professional sportsman, making that really quite a threatening experience (not saying it would have been better coming ahem from a smaller man, and I know this seems an extreme example but he's far from the only man I have experienced behaving to this extent or much worse).

I think it is useful for women to have that insight and understanding which would lead to a clearer view of why men act as they do, but I do believe men have to also be aware of the differences, how this behaviour impacts women and take steps to mitigate it, otherwise what would be the outcome, women responsible for men's behaviour.

I'm not saying you or Rosabug suggested this being the solution, and not all men are sexually pushy but I think to some extent women do have this understanding from a young age which is where a lot of quite deeply held views about not dressing too sexily, not going out alone at night etc come from. I personally think more education is needed for boys to make them see what this behaviour is in terms of the female experience.

thanks katie a break is sounding more tempting!! I'll have to think of a new hobby to try i think. I'm not really keen to go back to anything indoor in a hurry and not particularly sporty.

yellowhighheels I certainly agree with all that, and didn't mean to suggest that women should be tolerant of abusive men.

There does seem to be something about OLD that has let some strange genies out of the bottle. In all my dating life as a young (pre-OLD) man I can honestly say I never once heard of anybody ejaculating on themselves during a date. It's like these men have just been watching some weird fetish porn, got up and moved from their living room to the restaurant where they're meeting their date and not actually noticed that the person sitting opposite the table from them is different from the actress on their screen, or that the social situation requires different behaviour.

Could it be something to do with the unaccountability of being able to go on lots of one-off dates with people you're never going to see again? In the old days when people dated people from their school, work or local community, even if they were weirdos they would have been unlikely to behave like that because of the embarrassment of other people knowing.

This is not making me want to try again.

Hi,
I'm going to share a different take.
Like you, I spent many years OLD and trying to find a longterm partner after a relationship ended in my late 20s.
By my mid 30s I realised after a couple of dalliances that made me realise at that point, I was happier alone rather than being made unhappy by someone else. I'd also had a change of career direction, that you'd have said was incompatible with young children.
Like you, I wanted a child as well and by that point a gynae condition was at least under control, so I decided that I would have a child by sperm donor. This was what I pursued.
I went via a bank though so was as safe as possible, but also so there was no legal ramifications (supposed donors on the Internet legally are viewed as fathers with the same rights/responsibilities as you'd usually expect).
I was lucky. I had my baby. I decided to give up my career. I in fact reviewed my career aspirations and being a mum was far more important, so stayed home until my child started compulsory education. I then had a slight career change, so wfh as it suits our family the best.
Only now, over 10 years later have I dabbled in Old again. The difference this time around is me. My priorities are so different. Anyone who says anything remotely dubious is blocked and tbh there's not much of that because my profile is such that it tells the reader how it is. And really that alone seems to sort a lot of the wheat from the chaff. I have met a few lovely gentlemen. Just not right for me and my situation. One possibly was, but I could see there was potential for too much drama as he was so involved with the ex's family, effectively to the detriment of his life. So I know that was not for us. Another I think didn't truly take on board how differently his life would be if he was with someone with a primary aged child when his were now late 20s early 30s,but I don't Harbour any bad feelings as none of us truly get the implications of a new situation until we dabble in it.
Yes, it would be nice to meet someone, and covid has thrown another curved ball. But I actually feel more confident now than I in my 30s,as I don't have that biological clock ticking and making me consider options that were never going to end well. Now I can truly consider what's right without any impending potential doom hanging over me.

I hope that this helps you yellowhighheels in some way.

OLD bloke here, genuinely try to find someone for a relationship. What strikes me is, yes, there are lots of good looking women, yes, dating is very possible, but..... where does the spark and excitement come into it that you get when you meet someone who you fancy out of the blue?

Yes, you can meet people through OLD, but to me it seems an increasingly sure way to explore some very anodyne relationships.

MotherExtraordinaire thanks for sharing your experience. Sounds like you made really good choices and I'm glad you got the family you wanted. I gave this a good mull over.

Tbh if I wasn't so set on retraining (if I get a place on the course it would be life changing for me, long story- I am doing quite well, work wise, but definitely feel that I have never fulfilled my potential due to some personal issues when younger), then I would strongly consider moving somewhere with jobs for me and a cheaper cost of living and going it alone.

To be honest I am considering this now but know that it would be extremely difficult to train as a single mum (although I am sure it has been done).

There certainly used to be introductions agencies where the owner tried to match you. I tried to register for one back before I met exh - 25 ISH years ago. Like you say pricey and unfortunately by the time I had sussed it out I couldn't afford it so I never really checked out their huge promises. Think somehow people have decided that computer algorithms can replace brains and intuition...

I wonder whether the existing agencies get much use, given that there are so many dating sites now

explore some very anodyne relationships.

Yes, this! Some of the men I have met have (talking about harmless/ nice enough, not block- worthy ones) have persued me and stated they are very interested in me however I have found myself having to ask them, 'why'? As we haven't had anything in common, not a shared outlook or sense of humour or even much to say to each other. So they would have been happy to have a relationship that is as you say, completely anodyne as they've found someone who can make conversation for a date or two and that's good enough.

I'd give online dating a go as soon as lockdown is over. I bet lots of new people will sign up. Don't give up

• Take significant breaks. I'm talking one month on, two months off. Time to replenish yourself and for the app to repopulate
• Pay for the upgrades. Lets you see who likes you which saves you time and sometimes you find a gem you might have overlooked
• Filter fast. Boring - unmatch. Noncommittal - unmatch. Gemini - unmatch
• Meet fast. But make it low investment - a walk/ coffee/ facetime. First meet is an interview for first date
• If you get good vibes ask them out. If they're maintaining a convo with you they'll say yes, worst that will happen is they flake in which case great, you didn't waste your time (only for first meet. Let him instigate the follow up just in case he's not that into you 😉)