When do you admit defeat? Have you ever managed to dramatically improve a relationship?

[Jenny9876]

Hello,

Thank you for reading.

Has anyone ever managed to dramatically improve their relationship or to turn things round for the better?

How do you know when to give up and when to keep trying?

My partner and I (same sex) are still in love with eachother, but we just keep arguing and we can't seem to communicate with eachother.

We've been caught in an endless cycle of fights and "reconciliations" followed by promises to change behaviors (which then don't get changed and result in more hurt and disappointment) for over 2.5 years now. We've tried everything saying "next time, we will try harder or do xyz" but we just seem to get sucked back into the same patterns where we both get hurt really badly over and over again.

What I could use is some support from people who have been in similar situations who are further down the road to healing than I am right now. It seems so wrong. It seems like the opposite of what to do. To walk away from someone who loves me and whom I love so so much, but I just don't see any hope of our situation getting better.

The issues that stand in between us seem to be mainly about misunderstanding and empathy. I am drained from having to explain my hurt over and over and seeing no changes being made.

I am so disappointed and devastated that something that is a matter of just "getting it" and being supportive is standing in the way.

I have lost hope and I feel similar to someone in mourning.

In break ups I have been able to heal because an obvious reason and wrong was committed. Or someone just didn't love me. But this is so hard. I love her and she loves me. And we've always supported each other. But perhaps love and compatibility aren't the same.

We had a long in depth discussion last night (happy new year LOL) and both agreed that we just can't seem to make it work, and even though we have the best intentions we end up arguing or communicating badly. She says she feels like she can't live me, yet can't leave without me, but even though we have talked of splitting so many times, we never actually have. I just feel like there is so much built up resentment and disappointment now which is toxic in itself.

I feel exhausted to even try couples therapy because I feel hopeless it would even work. I just feel like I am clearly not making her happy - so why are we holding on so hard?

Will time apart help? I know that sometimes it takes losing something to truly make changes.

Walking away from the love of my life because it just isn't working right now. And it seems wrong but right and confusing as hell. I don't know if this is right or wrong.

She has gone out early this morning whilst I was still sleeping to meet a friend for a dog walk. She said to me that in the cold light of day, everything we had said the night before feels so overly dramatic and OTT. And I agree, in the cold light of day it does all seem ridiculous that we fell out, when we love eachother... but I know it will happen again. It happens everytime:(

Take a break from each other if you can.
But TBH it’s not going to work. You need to think about where you want to be in 5 years time, do you still want to be going round and round in this cycle ?

It won’t get better by the sounds of it.

@FippertyGibbett

Take a break from each other if you can. But TBH it’s not going to work. You need to think about where you want to be in 5 years time, do you still want to be going round and round in this cycle ?

Absolutely not :( I can't bare another single round of it :( I don't understand though, if we love eachother why can't we make it work :(

I don't understand though, if we love eachother why can't we make it work

Because love is necessary but not sufficient. Love doesn't conquer all. You need love AND compatibility, and the ability to live and work as a team and resolve conflicts productively. It doesn't seem like you have the other things, unfortunately.

Feelings aren't destiny and they do change. If it just doesn't work with your partner, sometimes you have to act with your head.

So when you have these 'we'll try harder' conversations, do you talk about HOW you'll try harder? Because if not, and you're agreeing to try harder without actually knowing what it is that you need to try harder to do, then you're sort of setting traps for yourselves.

I wouldn't rule out couples therapy. We all fall into patterns of relating that are stem from our childhoods, much of which are unconscious. A good therapist will be able to help you both to understand the dynamics between you and why and how you get stuck in these destructive ways of communicating. Even if the relationship is unsalvageable, it can help bring clarity around why it won't work.

Do you know what your triggers are that starts the feeling of being pissed off with each other ?
If you can work that out , perhaps you could stop the argument before it happens.
If it is an action - i.e you get pissed because she always leaves washing up for you, then having a Rota would stop that etc.
It's all about communication, if you can't work it out and move foward , I'm afraid your doomed .

I think definitely try counselling if you want to make it work. I would say both have some separately first, then maybe couples counselling once you’ve both had some space to talk to someone separately. I had counselling last year - my relationship was falling apart at the time. It helped enormously. Not overnight but over a few months. I thought we would have couples counselling as well but I found things improved quite a lot and we didn’t have it in the end. You obviously both have communication issues and different ways of seeing things and this probably stems from childhood and your different life experiences. Sometimes talking these things through with a counsellor can really open your eyes to why you behave certain ways and how you might want to do things differently. I think it’s totally worth doing but like I say I’d do it separately first so you can each gain some clarity and understanding of yourselves before trying to understand each other.

Hope that makes sense. Even if your relationship doesn’t work out it will help you going forward in life.

Dramatic and OTT were my first impression of your post, to be honest. Don’t know - something in the way you write made it sound this way.
And with knowing only little bits from what you said - I don’t think it’s impossible for the two of you to figure things out.
But I think it’s difficult. Mostly because it would require you both to look at your own ways of communicating and expression of your needs vs neediness.
I can’t say much about your partner, as there is just no information about her, but you seem to sound very emotional and not easy to be around. There seems to be a lot of drama and focus on yourself. And expectation for the partner to make you feel better somehow.
I think people with high neediness often see others as not expressing empathy, but it’s not always fair. Your partner is there not as a therapist but as a life companion. It’s not their job to be walking on eggshells and trying to make you feel better on a daily basis. It always has to be a balance of give and take.

Sorry if this isn’t what you want to hear right now. But if you both do love each other as much as you say you do. And if there wasn’t some major issues of breaking trust or some other abusive situation - I think before giving up you both (probably), but certainly you specifically would benefit from some self reflection. And possibly better with a professional.

@Gliblet

So when you have these 'we'll try harder' conversations, do you talk about HOW you'll try harder? Because if not, and you're agreeing to try harder without actually knowing what it is that you need to try harder to do, then you're sort of setting traps for yourselves.

I guess we don't specifically. I feel like we are so exhausted by the end of the fight, and so relieved that we have "made up" that most the time we don't talk about what we will do next time, we don't want to talk about anything challenging because we just want to feel happy and lighthearted again, which I know it shooting ourselves in the foot!

I feel like last night was the first time we spoke about conflict in a healthy way, and she even said "if you handled it like this all the time we wouldn't have a problem" probably because I was so exhausted and burnt out that I didn't have the energy to get upset or annoyed... and also I felt so defeated that I was just accepting what she was saying, rather than resisting it or trying to defend myself.

We normally just promise vague statements to eachother like I will say "I will try not to push you away" and she will say "I will try to be more empathetic"

@TreacleHart

Do you know what your triggers are that starts the feeling of being pissed off with each other ? If you can work that out , perhaps you could stop the argument before it happens. If it is an action - i.e you get pissed because she always leaves washing up for you, then having a Rota would stop that etc. It's all about communication, if you can't work it out and move foward , I'm afraid your doomed .

Our personalities are just very different. I am very sensitive and emotional, and she says she struggles to feel in tune with her emotions, and she can be quite direct. So we clash. And the more emotional I am, the more she wants to not deal with the situation. She said she has run out of empathy for me.

I have had several months of counselling this year to talk about some things from my childhood and other events in my life. Which definitely helped me, and I did talk about our relationship and communication but it doesnt seem to have made a lasting difference. Perhaps I didnt try hard enough

@MMmomDD

Dramatic and OTT were my first impression of your post, to be honest. Don’t know - something in the way you write made it sound this way. And with knowing only little bits from what you said - I don’t think it’s impossible for the two of you to figure things out. But I think it’s difficult. Mostly because it would require you both to look at your own ways of communicating and expression of your needs vs neediness. I can’t say much about your partner, as there is just no information about her, but you seem to sound very emotional and not easy to be around. There seems to be a lot of drama and focus on yourself. And expectation for the partner to make you feel better somehow. I think people with high neediness often see others as not expressing empathy, but it’s not always fair. Your partner is there not as a therapist but as a life companion. It’s not their job to be walking on eggshells and trying to make you feel better on a daily basis. It always has to be a balance of give and take.

Sorry if this isn’t what you want to hear right now. But if you both do love each other as much as you say you do. And if there wasn’t some major issues of breaking trust or some other abusive situation - I think before giving up you both (probably), but certainly you specifically would benefit from some self reflection. And possibly better with a professional.

Yes, I think you are fair there. I know that I am an emotional person, and can feel very intense emotions. I definitely have put a lot of pressure on her in the past to make me feel better. I have had counselling, and I feel like I have improved, but even though I have improved, her tolerance of me has reduced significantly. I feel there is a lot of contempt there and resentment which is toxic, so now if she even sees so much of my facial expression change to one of upset, she says even if it isn't significant or it is reasonable for me to be upset, she is so triggered by it because of the past that she gets very angry quickly

You are both going to need to agree to having the conversation you've been trying not to have then!

At some point, when you are both happy and lighthearted, tell her you want more of that and so you need to talk about how you're going to get there when things get difficult. You're both going to get a chance to talk, and you're both going to make an effort to listen instead of just waiting for it to be your turn to start talking again. Agreeing some ground rules might seem heavy handed but it helps hugely.

You're both going to use I statements instead of you accusations (I feel backed into a corner when we argue, rather than you make arguments into amateur hour on Jeremy Kyle)

Youre both going to be clear about when/how you get to the point of losing your temper. SAID is a good acronym to keep in mind - what is the Situation, what is the Action or set of actions that that situation sets in motion, what is the Impact that it's having on you, what could you usefully Do to either stop it happening again or change the impact that it has.

And if you can't have that conversation on your own, then counselling is absolutely an option - your counsellor will be able to keep the conversation focused, keep you both honest to what you've agreed to, and push you to agree some real actions you will take to make things better.

I think it would really depend on what sort of issues you are dealing with that your partner has a lack of empathy for.

Can you give an example? ( if too personal obviously do not worry).

You dont include specifics.
What are you/your partner arguing about?
There are no specifics

For example my "fights" w My v sweet mother were a variation on my annoyance about other family members who are users taking advantage of her which led her to get really angry at me for "controlling" her.

This is a clear problem and we identified the crux of it and reached clear solutions.
I was concerned she would be injured. She agreed it would be unwise/unreasonable for me(!?!) to lift +20kg due to potential injury so as a 70yo she should stop.
I accepted she is an adult and her money/time is her business so she can do what she likes but we agreed debt is not cool and people need to reimburse her.
I now politely refuse to engage in "helping" her (this was something has really irritated me) when she agrees to whatever new unreasonable/crazy request.

We are both much happier.

I’d suggest online counselling is the way to go. You want to know you both tried everything you could before calling it a day.

It could be that one if you has unreasonable expectations but firmly believes they are not unreasonable, promises to change, but slips back because deep down they feel they have the right approach and the other is expecting too much.

Or both are just stick in your ways and forget to be/do whatever was agreed.

Or one if you just goes through the motions of ‘yeah I promise I will change’, with no real attempt being made as they feel the other one won’t leave me so I’ll just say this and that to keep the peace but I don’t have to change as we have a flat together and have been together for ages so she’ll never leave so I don’t need to change....

Who knows. There are no examples. It would be better to get counselling as then he/she can dig down to cure beliefs and unsaid things to work out what the truth is and what can be done to get you back on track.

I went through 13 years of this. It ended in complete misery about 18 months ago with both of us extremely depressed. I'm still recovering but feeling much better about my life generally. I haven't even considered another relationship because I'm able to do exactly as I want now with no arguments and misunderstandings all the time. After trying to please someone for so long, it was hard to work out what I like doing. I've actually felt better in lockdown because there is no pressure to socialise. Mine was also a same-sex partnership. We tried counselling, time apart, long serious discussions etc, but in the end had to accept that it just didn't work.