Is this narcissistic behaviour?

[Pimplemouseish]

I’ve read a lot about narcissism and I think I have been in a dynamic with my boyfriend of 2 years now which is caused by his narcissism. As it says (from what I’ve read) you occasionally start to believe - when they’re being nice - that you have misunderstood them, but then you get thrown back into torture and uncertainty again and you realise you were wrong to trust and it goes round in circles.

So take into account this is a two year relationship, seeing each other 3-4 times a week, met each other’s wider family and DC from first marriages, very much a public relationship. We don’t live together.

Three days ago he told me I was the love of his life, we were making plans for the future, talking about Christmas with the DC, when we could next go away.

I have a surgery tomorrow which is worrying me a lot. I spoke to my boyfriend this evening at 5pm and he said. “Can you tell me where my stuff is and your safe pin code in case something happens to you tomorrow?” (He means some valuables he is storing at my house.) I say yes sure. He says “ok great. Good luck then.” I say “thanks.” He said “have a great weekend.”

To me this implies he is not planning on speaking to me tomorrow or before the surgery or even over the weekend? Considering he is my boyfriend and was talking about picking me up from the hospital three days ago, don’t you think this is rather strange and isolating and hurtful.

He does this all the time. He will swing from declaring me wonderful, bombarding me with calls and texts and wanting to know everything I’m doing from what I ate for breakfast to what I am thinking every minute. Then this - “have a good weekend.”

If I point out the discrepancy between what he says when he is hot and what he says when he is cold (which is actually quite rapid cycling between the two) he’ll say “sorry I don’t remember, I was drunk when we spoke!” Or, “yes but you know me, I forget.” Or “I can’t remember the actual conversation but I suspect I over promised a bit when I was excited.”

So the next time (literally on a three day cycle) when he goes into one of his lovebombing tidal waves about how I am wonderful and everything is going to be amazing, I will say “hold on, hold on, let’s just have a realistic, mutual conversation because you remember what happened last time? You promised x,y and z and then said you didn’t remember, or were drunk, so I’d rather just a real conversation.”

In response to this he gets angry and moody. Asks me what’s wrong with me that I have so much doubt and I am so cynical? Where does this come from? He can’t believe I am looking a gift horse in the mouth and won’t let him love and adore me like he wants to.

I then tell myself - surely - now I have pointed it out so obviously and reminded him how he is - surely - he will not do it again. Sometimes I film him saying it, or get him to email or WhatsApp me with everything he is saying which he willingly does - but lo and behold, three days later he has “no idea” what I am “talking about.” And when I say but what about the trip we planned or the thing we were going to do (he offered to pick me up from the hospital tomorrow) he’ll make a sheepish face and say something like “you know what I’m like. I just can’t remember. I make promises I can’t keep” It’s almost as if he enjoys watching my visibly disappointed, shocked and emotional reaction. It’s like he enjoys or needs to see the investment I have in him and the strong emotions he causes in me, but for me it’s a rollercoaster. This comment around the surgery was especially hurtful. “Have a good weekend.” How can he say that?

Obviously I would not be sticking around if this was the case all the time. He occasionally comes through on things, and they are always wonderful, better than expectations And he can be “the perfect boyfriend.” So this intermittent reinforcement has me hooked to the hope that this will happen every time.

My question is as above - is this a specifically narcissistic behaviour? I see lots of responses to posters on here saying “you don’t need to diagnose someone as a narcissist, they’re just an asshole” and I do see where that is coming from, but beg to differ. Understanding narcissism I think is very important when it comes to getting out of relationships with narcissists. If you think you are in a relationship with an arsehole you imagine an arsehole can change - but a pattern of narcissistic behaviour is quite unique and I think identifying it And recognising their pattern helps in putting the relationship to bed.

So tell me do you think this is narcissistic behaviour?

Sorry your going through this .. just wanted to say I am in a similar situation but on and off for 4 years .. I did my own thread a few days ago ‘is this emotional abuse’ I’m currently being ignored or ‘stonewalled’ even though he’s in the wrong.. mine does the same very hot and cold one day can’t get enough of me next day acts like I don’t exist. Also makes plans then says he forgot or just won’t even mention them at all and act like it was never discussed. All I can say is I’m two years further in than you and it’s got worse and worse he did not start off like this. I also do what you do and when he’s all nice again try and discuss what was said when he wasn’t being nice and he gets angry calls me negative etc and brushes it off and won’t discuss.

I’m not sure if it’s narc behaviour although I suspect more and more it is.. yesterday he resorted to recording a phone call we had ( argument ) where I was crying etc and showed the recording to my friend and said I am crazy.. I obviously confronted him about this and he has not responded to a single msg

@Pimplemouseish - you've researched narcissistic behaviour and are obviously an intelligent woman; he's following the pattern / template. Please don't give him any further access to your property by revealing Safe Code; wtf is he storing there that is so valuable - Is it dodgy paperwork or other? Has he let you see? Could it make you liable e.g hiding stuff from HMRC, Creditors etc.?

Good luck with your op today and hope you wake up with clear brain / take opportunity to reflect i.e "fuck off, loser".

Edit. "good luck with surgery, tomorrow "

Everyone I have ever known who acted like that and said those types of things - verbatim to what you wrote - were clinical grade toxic.

I found it helpful to make the diagnosis in my head - narc or borderline, plus alcoholic - because it did help me deal with it. There is a predictable pattern of behavior and it does help to stay away or go grey rock when you know a "nice period" will absolutely be followed by a "bad period" without a doubt. It's a cycle and intermittent reward is the most powerful, you are right about that.

I don't know much about narcissism but just reading all of this is so draining. It's like a game, and life should not be like this.

OP I have just broken up with someone like this. Yes it’s 100% classic narcisstic behaviour. The fact that you recognise it is the first step to getting out, please keep going. Are there any links between you, children, friends, work? If not, I suggest you cut him off without a second thought. It will be difficult but this rollercoaster of emotions you’re experiencing isn’t what a normal relationship should be like. As you say, he obviously enjoys your disappointment the minute he cools things off, it’s very cruel and spiteful behaviour. So you want to continue living like this?

Life is too short, I spent most of my relationship in tears. Yes there were euphoric highs but the more time went on, they were fewer and far between and had me question my own sanity at times. Just remember when he’s being really nice and loving towards you it’s all a game. When he promises you things just remember that Norma people don’t act that way, and can border on obsessive love which isn’t healthy. He love bombs you and then takes it away when he has your trust, it’s all one big sick game to them. They’ll never change, their brains are wired up wrong. Please consider getting out.

Sorry Norma = normal!!!

Narcissism is a very specific personality disorder. What you describe is not in the clinical description of a narcissist but it is toxic and suggestive of some kind of PD if not just arseholeness.

No, it isn't specific narcissistic behaviour. It sounds like he isnt that into you, which explains his very lacklustre response at times.

It's rare someone is all bad. Most people do the occasional nice thing for a partner, this guy included.

He's unreliable and selfish. That would be enough for me to leave.

'So tell me do you think this is narcissistic behaviour?'

How would that matter? It's just a descriptor for a type of (usually), abusive personality. It's certainly not a descriptor for all of them.

'narcissist' is much over used and is not a blanket synonym for 'abuser'. You can be a cruel dickhead abuser and not be a narcissist, so please don't rely on that term too much. I see the same fixation on these boards on the word 'abuser'. Those women often need permission to leave their bad relationships and they feel like their partner has to be a clean cut, straightforward abuser before doing so. I think it keeps many women in bad, healthy relationships, simply because their partner doesn't neatly slot into certain profiles.

So the next time (literally on a three day cycle) when he goes into one of his lovebombing tidal waves about how I am wonderful and everything is going to be amazing, I will say “hold on, hold on, let’s just have a realistic, mutual conversation because you remember what happened last time? You promised x,y and z and then said you didn’t remember, or were drunk, so I’d rather just a real conversation

In response to this he gets angry and moody. Asks me what’s wrong with me that I have so much doubt and I am so cynical? Where does this come from? He can’t believe I am looking a gift horse in the mouth and won’t let him love and adore me like he wants to.

That right there is trouble. You're on to him. You're smart enough to have pinned down his behaviour, described it, presented it to him and confronted him and he really doesn't like it. He might be unused to someone noticing or calling out his bulkshit in that direct way.

He seems the type to play mindgames and probably gets a childish delight in doing so. There are certainly trust issues here. Ok, so let's say he did forget about your operation....do you really want to be with someone who can forget something THAT important? In another relationship, one might assume this was true and you're with someone very forgetful and easily distracted, but as part of what you've described, I think he did it deliberately in that childish, hehe, cruel way. It's almost like a child going up to his mum and kicking her shins and running off in delight....it would be an ugly thing to watch, except he sounds like he's doing this as a grown man.

I had already typed the above before I even read this from you -

I make promises I can’t keep” It’s almost as if he enjoys watching my visibly disappointed, shocked and emotional reaction. It’s like he enjoys or needs to see the investment I have in him and the strong emotions he causes in me, but for me it’s a rollercoaster

I think I'm right then. He enjoyes the mind games, the kicking you in your emotional shins (so to speak), the dashing of your hopes. There is a type of sadistic joy these people have from doing that, and they absolutely do not know what love is. He's playing a cat & mouse game with you which is why you're so confused. It's been going on for far too long, and yes, I think it's abusive. It sounds like he's a classic manipulator and I don't know how anyone like that can form a true, authentic bond with the person they are with. You are simply a method for him to get a very dark emotional high. There can be no love or respect in a relationship like that. You're far too confused and you even describe it as a rollercoaster.

These type of relationships can lead to very dark places. Is he also the type that makes everyone else suffer if he's suffering? Is he resentful or tries to bring you down if you've had a good day? Does he make sly/snyde little comments when he sees you feeling good or have done something well? How does he respond to other people's success?

From what you've told us, and if I'm right, he's the type to pull stunts - that means highly impulsive behaviour to get a reaction or to punish you. If he's really off his rocker in a few years' time, expect him to do something like suddenly leaving you without notice, without so much a letter, or threatening to kill himself when he thinks you're going to leave or refuse to come back to him.

Avoid. Avoid. Avoid.

Great post EarthSight

Too many people(myself included in the past) jump into relationships, ignore initial red flags and end up desperately unhappy and vulnerable.

My mantra in recent years was to be very wary of who I gave my heart too. Thankfully it has paid off

OP, this guy is not kind, considerate or thoughtful. Why would anyone settle for that?

Narcisssism is a pattern of behaviour that is prevalent across all relationships. You would need to know about his childhood, other relationships etc to see the longterm pattern.

He could just be an arsehole but that doesn't make him likely to change.

The ability to signficantly change for anyone in adulthood is extremely unlikely and would require therapy so even if he is an arsehole this will be as good as he gets, given you are supposed to be in the honeymoon phase.

Filming him is a sign that you are starting to doubt yourself and should be a massive STOP sign..think about how far from normal that is? Added to the fact he doesn't support you at your vulnerable time then you have sufficient reasons to end this.

It is always worth leaving a toxic person as soon as you start to realise the red flags, it never, ever gets better. Know that walking away now is the right thing.

Be as unemotional and factually as you can about ending it. Don't go into reasons, just have a mantra, "this isn't right for me"

Arrange the return of this things and don't respond to any attempts to suck you back in.

I've been with a man like this and I thought like you, I read up about covert narcissism. The matches to his personality were so similar it was startling. I read and I read and I analysed and I started to work out what he would do next.... It just all led me down a rabbit role of further confusion. But I totally understand why you need to do it. The simple fact is... no relationship should leave you confused. Ever. You can be pissed off, annoyed, angry, sad .... But confused? Why would anyone be confused? This only happens when the other person is giving you mixed signals, playing mind games with you. I heard this is a video about toxic relationships and it stuck.

I'm in a relationship with a man who doesn't confuse me at all now and I'm happier, I don't have the ( rarer and rarer ) highs but I don't have the awful lows. This is a good quality relationship , so much better than what came before. You deserve better than what you are getting in your current relationship.

Good luck today in your operation. I hope it all goes well for you. Focus on yourself just now. Give yourself permission to just put yourself first from this point forward. xxxx.

If he is a true narcissist, he cannot change, so why would ‘understanding’ it/ him help? The over diagnosis of narcissism on MN has usually one reason and that is to distract the OP from doing the one thing they need to do, which is to distance themselves from the ‘narcissist’.

Your energies and research would be better spent, understanding why you are staying in a relationship with someone who is emotionally incompatible with you and the moments of emotional compatibility, are transactional.

At the very least he’s emotionally abusive as he’s seriously gaslighting you. But does it matter? As he will never admit to what he’s doing so there’s no hope that he will get any type of help for his issues.

Just be done with him before he makes you feel like you’re crazy, cause that’s where it’s headed.

Sometimes I think people just want a label. No need to try and diagnose him. It's clear as day he will not make you happy.

He said “have a great weekend.”

He needs to go for saying this alone. This is an absolutely ridiculous thing to say to someone who is going to have surgery tomorrow.
Anything would have been better than that. "I'll ring you before you go in tomorrow" "Is there anything you need me to do?" "Ring me as soon as you come round and are allowed to phone" "How are you getting home?"

So many possibilities and no.... he says "have a great weekend"
This shows a complete lack of empathy and care for your well-being.
And then that business about getting the safe PIN code "in case something happens to you". Totally callous and not a normal way to behave.

It does not matter what he is like the rest of the time. Anyone can be nice and lovely when things are going well. It's when something happens that you see what they are truly like.
He has not shown enough concern for you and only thought about himself and making sure he could get his valuables back.
Please get rid of him so that you have the chance to find a decent guy who will be there for you in bad times as well as good.

And I agree with others - there is no need to diagnose him. I can diagnose him and label him if you want - prize prick.

@Pimplemouseish - hope you're well.

Either he's looked after you or hasn't; if latter, I would seriously consider getting rid of.

Remember that his first thought was of his belongings, kept literally Safe at your property plus the inference you may die and he'd be inconvenienced.

I know, with COVID restrictions, partners may not be allowed to visit but surely Patient has to be discharged to someone willing to get them home plus look after for at least first 24 hours?

He sounds absolutely vile and unhinged. Please, please leave him !!

If you forget about trying to diagnose him with anything, and just look at his behaviour, is it acceptable? If it's not then there's your answer. Do you want to be with someone who behaves like this? It sounds exhausting and I'm fairly certain he's not going to change any time soon.

I can see why you have come to the narcissism conclusion. Some of the things you described... the future faking and then forgetting or rowing back with absolute brazen lies, this was something done to me by an ex who now has a formal diagnosis of NPD. ....I dont know if this guy has a PD, not enough info, but he certainly sounds horrible and like you should get rid of him.

Good luck with the op.