I've run out of hope ...

[LostInTheEther]

For around 18 months I felt that there has been something missing in my relationship with my DW of 4 years. We are late 30s and but met when a lot younger. I guess it started when a friend I knew starting subtly expressing feelings beyond friendship. I knew there were cracks in the relationship but I (we both are) avoidant types and we never discussed or resolved them. I've completely stepped away from the friendship and decided that I had to overcome my avoidance. I guess the main crack was that whilst we are still relatively young, we never had much of a physical relationship. I'm not an overly touchy person, but we were having sex less than once a year. Life, work everything was prioritized over it.

Last year ago I bit the bullet and said that I wanted things to change. At first it was about slowing down, and scaling back on all the other things we do outside of our relationship. Then later on I started talking about the lack of sex and intimacy. I feel a failure because I allowed it to get to a point where it had gone on too long and I have put my hands up and said that I am at fault.

We have progressed into counselling, and I have used the opportunity to try and express how I feel rather than hiding. I admitted that over the past year I have a lack of sexual desire, and that I can't work out whether its a dip or permanent. She is the more dominant in the relationship.. I'm a yes man, and yes I do my fair share around the house. We both work exceptionally hard, we have come from poor backgrounds and worked hard to create a comfortable life together.

I think its not great that we are both avoidant. She would love a family, but when I ask she just said that one day she hoped it would change and that we would have something more physical.

I'm just empty at the moment - there is nothing wrong in the relationship, no abuse or mistreatment. Yes there are times when we probably are both stubborn, rude to each other or take each other for granted. She says that she wants children with me, wants to have a family but I'm worried - that we will be bringing children into something with some unresolved issues. The counsellor has said its clear that my wife is committed to the relationship whereas I am ambivalent. I guess I am less optimistic because I'm thinking the best case scenario is getting to the point that we were at a few years back, which was happy but still pretty much sexless. I don't think I can live the rest of my life like that. And that the relationship will go round in circles for as long as I am ambivalent.

I love her, I hate seeing her upset knowing that its me that is upsetting her. I cant bare it anymore and part of me wants to say to her lets just quit the counselling and go back to the way it was before. Maybe I can cope being in a sexless marriage for the rest of my life.

Any advice would be welcome. Something to give me hope I guess

Do you fancy her?

No, there is no sexual desire at the moment. I've been honest and told her. I don't know whether its a dip or can be restored. She was understandably upset. She says that she is attracted to me, but doesn't want sex as she doesn't feel I romanticize her. I know I've failed her

Well for me the line that stands out us that you've "never had much of a physical relationship" with your wife. Can I ask why you got married to someone you've never had a proper physical relationship with when it obviously matters to you? No judgement on that btw. Just curious...

Are you ambivalent becausee you want to move on but you don't want to be seen as the bad one in the relationship?

It started with the friend and therefore I think inside you do have feelings that are just waiting to be stirred.Sadly, however, not by your wife.
I think the relationship is over and I think you need to tell your dw asap so she can move on and perhaps start again and have a family.

Regarding the never having much of a physical relationship - we just never put much emphasis on it. Be are both very driven, it was about getting the job and qualifications and working our ar$es off. Travelling, learning, experiencing culture etc. On reflection, looking back I think I probably knew that the physical side was missing a bit, but I felt this was a person who I could spend the rest of my life with and that is what was important.

She has said that she sees me as the father of her children and at our age that opportunity will pass if I leave. I cant stomach it..

I think its less about wanting to be seen as the bad one, but more about hurting someone I love. I do love her, but often it feels like she is a sibling say.

Why dont you start again. Date each other or have date nights when its just about the two of you. See if there is anything to rekindle

You sound so sad in your post.

Do you feel any attraction towards other women? Even if you wouldn’t ever act on it it would be helpful to know if you do have those urges, just not towards your wife?

You can’t stay with her like this. The only option is to let her go and find someone to have a family with, you both deserve more than this and you can’t stay with her because you don’t want to hurt her. It wouldn’t be right or fair to bring children in to this.

This is the bit that stuck out like a sore thumb to me:

I guess the main crack was that whilst we are still relatively young, we never had much of a physical relationship. I'm not an overly touchy person, but we were having sex less than once a year. Life, work everything was prioritized over it.

Sex is the cornerstone of a happy marriage. If you love and fancy each other and are compatible you have sex. Not having sex for such long periods is a worry in itself for the future of your marriage but to be more specific, what's even more telling is the point you make about long dry spells even when you were both young.

Sorry to say this but it won't work. Do you really envision living the rest of your life in a sexless marriage? Where's the affection? Then, I continued reading your post and got to this bit:

...........but I'm worried - that we will be bringing children into something with some unresolved issues.

Sorry but I think you've answered your own question. I think you know you know the answer and you are just afraid of ending the relationship. Find someone who you're sexually attracted to, and that you're compatible with, and then have your family. Both she and you deserve more than a sexless marriage.

The counsellor has said its clear that my wife is committed to the relationship whereas I am ambivalent
No sex and she expects you to romanticise her - that doesn't say committed to me

Honestly, you remind me of a poster I spoke to a few months ago... Have you posted before? In my opinion ( and it is just my opinion) your marriage is over. Your marriage never really started. You and your wife are friends and always have been. You can't rekindle a flame that never burned.

What happened to your sex life? I understand it's not good now but you said you feel responsible, you don't fancy your wife.... Is she interested in having a sex life, because it sounds like she isn't interested either?

No, there is no sexual desire at the moment. I've been honest and told her. I don't know whether its a dip or can be restored. She was understandably upset.

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Regarding the never having much of a physical relationship - we just never put much emphasis on it. Be are both very driven, it was about getting the job and qualifications and working our ar$es off. Travelling, learning, experiencing culture etc.

I'm sorry but the truth of this is pretty blindingly obvious, as much as you try to avoid it.

You don't have a satisfactory physical relationship, and you're never going to have one, because you fundamentally don't fancy her. When you both love and fancy someone, you don't need to "put emphasis" on it, and earnestly work out how to prioritise it over job qualifications, "travelling, learning, etc." Your bodies are drawn to each other and that's what happens. Yes, sometimes what is a basically natural and innocent impulse gets screwed up by other demands of life, changing values and priorities etc, but that is a completely different thing from the impulse not having been there in the first place. I wish, for their own sakes, more people would realise this and stop trying to talk themselves into having feelings that they really don't have. It doesn't work that way. It's not something that you can just decide to consciously invent because that's what would be convenient for everything else in your life.

If you ever had kids your sex-life would be even less than it is now. Factor that in.

Thanks all for the help so far. Yes I am sad, really sad. We've got our anniversary very soon which I am dreading.

@User166777 So yes I have posted before - just as we were heading into lockdown. Because we were doing nothing, I think it made me start looking at the relationship with a magnifying glass. During that time we weren't doing anything else and the situation didn't improve. I've read a few other posts over the past six months of people in similar situations as well.

I know its not the job of the counsellor to tell us what to do, but I guess I am disappointed that she has said that its my wavering that is the issue and that until that is resolved, then we will just go around in circles. Because every one of you has said pretty much the same thing that there may have always been some issues that weren't addressed etc.

I do have sexual desire for other women yes. I have admitted that, and my wife has said she has desire for other men. But yet she is happy in the relationship - and maybe she is happy on being only partially content. I think I worry that the grass isn't going to be greener as well. I'm scared of being lonely, and don't have a massive amount of friends.

I'm a little bit confused by your OP in that you state the lack of sex and intimacy is a problem in your relationship, yet you go on to say you have no sexual desire.. I think unpicking this is the key here OP. Is it that you have no desire for your wife or just none at all? How did you feel when the friend expressed interest beyond friendship?
Whatever you decide to do, I would stick with the counselling either alone or as part of a couple and for goodness sake don't act on any 'impulses' re other women until you've decided what the way forward is.

@NoBloodyFighting Oh no I do have sexual desire. At the moment I have no desire for my wife, but I do have it for other women yes. When this women expressed interest it just sent me into a spin I guess. Firstly as she was way out of my league looks wise (not that this is everything) and I think it just probably rumbled a lot of sexual feelings that I hadn't been in touch with for a while. Part of me wishes that she'd kept quiet - but I think deep down I know that it would have happened at some point. Like I said, we no longer speak but it was a spark that left me thinking about how things could be. Part of me wants to say that its just lust, and that the grass isn't always greener kinda of thing. But part of me fanaticizes about having sex maybe like once a week!

The easy answer is to say 'well just start having sex with your wife' .. but those feelings aren't forthcoming. I know splitting is the right thing to do, but I cant help feel I've ruined her life. She doesn't want to, she wants to go back to the way things were but I just don't think I can get there. I think I will take that guilt to my grave -

I do think I remember your thread but I'm not going to assume I'm thinking of the same one.

How do children, or trying for children fit in with your plans now. Your wife is late thirties? So.... I have a feeling that is where some of the guilt is coming from?

Okay OP that makes sense. Are you in sex therapy or more general relationship counselling? It's a really horrible situation for all concerned but I can't help but worry that it's difficult enough to reignite a 'spark' that was once there, let alone find one when essentially you're platonic and almost always have been.
How we're things in the very beginning, before experiencing culture/studying etc? Ie first couple of months?
I'm glad to hear you have cut the other person off. It really is a cowards way out and if it went too far, it'd make everything so much worse.