Repairing breakdowns

[ukdad1980]

First off I'm really wary of how strong some reactions are to posts, please go easy if you can.
I think my family is about to dissolve. Myself and my wife have had testing times like I'm sure you all have during lockdown. I don't think we would have been in this situation otherwise. We've had 4 counselling sessions and my wife wants no more, instead talking of solicitors for a divorce.

We have grievances towards each other and although I think we have made progress in trying to understand each others needs I think the sadness that both of us experience has become too much for my wife. I love her, she hopefully loves me, and our baby really is the happiest little bundle of joy.

As a dad I feel incredibly isolated and to be honest wish I had people to speak to. I think both of us have legitimate grievances, but what ways to people on here successfully convey them?

Appreciate thoughts

Change....real change is the only way to get past breakdowns. My husband and I came very close to divorce and it was only with both of us making actual changes in the way we were living our lives and communicating that we were able to stay together.

You don't say what your areas of difficulty are but having a small baby places massive pressures on a couple. What have been your issues?

This forum is so good if you need support.
It sounds like you have both tried to resolve things and it hasn’t worked. It also sounds like you want to stay together but she doesn’t? As hard as it is you might have to accept this and start thinking of what you need to do to plan a life for yourself obviously including your baby and get some legal advice yourself. Feel for you x

Disclaimer: whatever I say I'm sure could be disputed, but here goes.

I had a difficult job which I planned to (and did) leave on birth of baby. I had made substantial savings (which I still have) to see through this period but wife was not happy about me leaving the position.
To be honest, I don't think I could have been a new parent given the timing of our son's birth: He was born peak Coronavirus at a stressful time and set in motion plenty of fears about health. We're in a small 1 bed flat and I have always done the night shift - trying to manage a team like I was doing I just don't think was possible given the attention our son needed and his early bouts of crying. Now our son is 5months old I am looking for employment, but of course still wary of how it will be. This dispute about work is one big area for us.

Another big area is the intensity of 3 of us in the flat together. Socially I think we have been quite isolated. My wife hasn't been able to see her parents (they're abroad), and mine have visited just twice. We have seen friends on occasion but I really feel it would do me the world of good to be able to meet friends maybe once a week/fortnight and for my wife to have the opportunity to do the same. Discussing this often brings conflict regarding safety during covid and in theory the idea of prioritising friends over family. My opinion is that this is resulting in an unnatural amount of time together that invariably will bring conflict.

And lastly, Covid: The sheer amount of conversation and difference about this damn pandemic has caused numerous spats. The sillier side of it is the discussions about areas of the disease that I would say are completely out of our control (e.g. why it is spreading, what should be closed, what the government is doing wrong etc). The other side is things that do affect us, for example disagreements about whether we should be cleaning our groceries, whether we should meet with people, whether we should ever sit indoors somewhere.

The top and bottom of it is there is unhappiness too much of the time. I'm sure we both wake up bracing ourselves for when an argument will arise. And the irony is our son is the smiliest, best sleeping, beautiful guy we could have hoped for. Breaks my heart.

I'm not surprised she was unhappy at you quitting your job with nothing to go to on the birth of your child. Did you discuss and agree that with her beforehand? If not, why were you so highhanded and what were you thinking to threaten your joint security like that, savings notwithstanding ?

It sounds like she's done with the relationship. I think it's possible that you could get through this together, as it sounds like some of it could be the stresses of lockdown and first year of a new baby. But if she's done, she's done, aim for amicable co-parenting.

I agree that I would have been very unhappy if my husband had quit his job on the birth of a new baby....you say you planned to leave on the birth of the baby...but why did you time it like that?

Would it not have made more sense for you to find a new job and then leave?

So the main value a man brings to a relationship is his job and income and not hands on co-parenting and other types of support? I must remember that one.

@5pForAPlasticBag

So the main value a man brings to a relationship is his job and income and not hands on co-parenting and other types of support? I must remember that one.

No one has said that, but the main bread winner quitting their job right as their wife bought a baby into the world, and amidst Covid, was actually quite foolish.

Women feel uncertain enough when bringing a new life into this world, without having to worry money issues, with covid thrown in.

The employment market is so uncertain right now.

He has stated that he has savings. He has stated that he described his job as “difficult”, whatever that means - stressful maybe, time away, unsocial hours? He has stated that he had planned to leave anyway. He has stated that he has tried to manage a team from a 1 bed flat with his wife and new baby at home.
How is it that none of you focus on her stated dissatisfaction with social isolation and living on top of each other in lockdown might be the real reason? It’s all about money isn’t it.

I'm been a contractor for 10yrs so going between jobs is the nature of that business. In the previous year I had worked different jobs that meant I'd saved 40% more than my regular salary (an amount that will pay the bills for at least 6months still), but it had had an impact on me. Last summer I really needed time out as I nearly hit break point, but an offer came in and I took it for the money.

Of course I agree my decision in quitting was 'actually quite foolish', as it's meant I'm now in the situation that I'm in. And my wife would very much be on the side of alot of the comments here that cannot understand why a person would think to leave a job, particularly during Covd, particularly when you have a child to bring up.

And I have said to my wife I understand how damaging the decision I made has been. But I still know why I was worried and clearly I am struggling to convey that

I have been a contractor for 22yrs and I know all too well what breaking point looks like and feels like. When you get to that point, you have to walk away from the job for a bit because the option of sticking it out is not really an option. Burn out leaves lasting scars - I know.
Contracting is hard, yes - which is why the rewards tend to be higher. Spouses rarely complain when the cash is coming in faster than you can spend it it so they shouldn’t complain when you have to step back as well.
Covid and certainly legislative changes that have taken effect this and next year, have made contracting even harder in some ways (and less rewarding) but doesn’t that mean it’s harder to justify doing it? New mothers often complain that dads bury themselves in work when a baby comes along, leaving them doing all the work. You’ve done the opposite and you’re suffering for that decision. To say general Covid stress, isolation and lack of personal space has neglible effect is just not credible. It sounds to me like all the things she can’t control (not seeing parents etc) is manifesting as resentment towards the one person she sees every day - you. Does she think that her worries about security would sudden evaporate if you split up. I never heard of a couple getting richer through divorce.

Nobody has said lockdown is negligible

My main question regarding op quitting his job, which he has not clarified, is whether he discussed and agreed it with his wife beforehand. When you're a partnership, allegedly, it's not OK to just chuck in your work without talking it over and agreeing a course of action. Especially when there's a new baby to deal with.

What I’m trying to get you to consider is that humans are not spectacularly good at understanding themselves. We lie to our spouses. We lie to our counsellors. We are especially good at lying to ourselves.
You need to consider the possibility that:

1. Your wife is miserable because of a range of different reasons that feel rather overwhelming and impossible to explain.
2. She is unhappy that you have added to this state of affairs by introducing more uncertainty.
3. Ergo, your actions are the cause of 100% of her misery because that’s easier to pin down in her mind than all the other stuff.

It’s a very common mindset. How often do we hear of people who divorce or have affairs give their reasons for doing so and we think “really, THAT was the reason?! That doesn’t make sense”. That’s because people don’t do the emotional hard work to get to the real answer For their behaviours - it’s exhausting and makes us face our own failings. Far easier to hook on to an easy explanation. You are potentially doing yourself a disservice by accepting that her unhappiness is fully rooted in you quitting your job. That will lead you both down a cul-de-sac in searching for the truth.

Personally, I don't think 6 months worth of savings is anywhere near enough to justify leaving your job, mid-pandemic, with nothing to go to. DH was made redundant in November, jointly, we have several years worth of savings but the stress this has put us under is immense. With all the hormones of a new baby as well, I imagine she is desperately worried about what happens when they run out.

Are you actively looking for work now OP? Is there anything on the horizon?

I appreciate your support. No I don't think she does pin it all on the job. Personally I think we're in a pressure cooker situation, where anyone spending 24/7 with anyone would push relationships to their limits.

I think her concerns are totally legitimate and I need to reassure her, but of course I think I have legitimate concerns too that I don't think will help in the long run if I suppress them.

On the social front, why can't you meet people outdoors? In a park? A nice walk? Bring a picnic blanket that's waterproof on one side so you all know you can sit down somewhere without having to look for benches. Check the rules obviously but it might be a good idea.

It sounds like you’re both in an incredibly difficult situation. You say that the baby was born at the peak of the pandemic (so March/April) and I remember well at that time that no one really had a clue of what was coming then. The idea that anyone on here can judge the OPs work situation based on the limited info he provided and the scale of the impact it’s had on jobs in this country in particular is just plain nonsense. The guy asked for help with what he could do now, not a time machine. The pandemic has turned the world on its head and these boards are full of the damage being inflicted on people’s daily lives. We can’t change any of that, it won’t be going away soon and we are all trying to find our own ways to cope. If my marriage is anything to go by, your way of coping will be completely different to your wife’s and at times it will be impossible to reconcile those coping mechanisms, especially cooped up in a 1 bed flat. The only thing I can suggest is trying to find ways to allow each other to deal with things in your own way even when the other person is adamant that it might be the “wrong” way. You’ll probably still fall out with each other over that - me and my wife seem to argue every time there is another slight change in the rules, but those arguments are getting less heated now as we learn what those coping mechanisms are in each other. Above all else, focus on what it is you need to do to be able to cope and how you can get through each day, and give your wife space to do the same. I hope you can find a way to get through this.