In Laws

[Lilly1980]

Morning everyone.

Just looking for opinions really. My husbands has an older brother, and his mother treats them very differently. If his older brother does something for her, she splashes it all over social media. If it is his birthday she is putting pictures together and splashing that all over social media too. They even played the same sport in their 20's, every Saturday of every summer. His mum and dad went to every game his brother played but never went to see him ( at all )
My husbands dad passed last year, they were very close and it has had a big impact on him and his mental health, and i think now just having the one parent the way she treats his differently has started to affect him more. I want him to speak with his mother and raise his issues in a non aggressive way and hopefully they can move on. But every time in the past when he has raised things, she starts to shout him down and tells him to stop being stupid.

Now I know this may come across to some as sounding quite petty, i appreciate it may not read very well. But it is really obvious that even my family have started to mention to me, that they see how she treats my husband. I just don't know what to do about it?

Thank you

Morning everyone.

Just looking for opinions really. My husbands has an older brother, and his mother treats them very differently. If his older brother does something for her, she splashes it all over social media. If it is his birthday she is putting pictures together and splashing that all over social media too. They even played the same sport in their 20's, every Saturday of every summer. His mum and dad went to every game his brother played but never went to see him ( at all )
My husbands dad passed last year, they were very close and it has had a big impact on him and his mental health, and i think now just having the one parent the way she treats his differently has started to affect him more. I want him to speak with his mother and raise his issues in a non aggressive way and hopefully they can move on. But every time in the past when he has raised things, she starts to shout him down and tells him to stop being stupid.

Now I know this may come across to some as sounding quite petty, i appreciate it may not read very well. But it is really obvious that even my family have started to mention to me, that they see how she treats my husband. I just don't know what to do about it?

Thank you

How does your H feel about his brother, mother and for that matter his late father these days?. Instead of talking to his mother (an action which will not get him at all far particularly given her past behaviour) would he be amenable to seek therapy re his childhood?.

It is not his fault his parents acted as they did (and in his mother's case still does) and he did not make them that way. His late father likely went along with his wife's excesses of behaviour out of self preservation and want of a quiet life. Women like this cannot do relationships at all and always need a willing enabler to help them, that person was his dad.

Your H grew up as the scapegoat in a dysfunctional abusive family unit. People from dysfunctional families end up playing roles; his brother is the golden child and your H is the scapegoat. This sort of dynamic that you describe is scarily commonplace in narcissistic family structures. How do you get on with his mother; I would think you act very carefully around her.

Re your comment:-
"I want him to speak with his mother and raise his issues in a non aggressive way and hopefully they can move on. But every time in the past when he has raised things, she starts to shout him down and tells him to stop being stupid".

You likely think this because you have come from a functional and importantly too an emotionally healthy family. Your DH was clearly not so fortunate and the rule book really does go out the window when it comes to such dysfunctional families. So its not as straight forward as your comment because that is how emotionally healthy families behave. Your second sentence here belies the first; that same scenario will happen to your DH again and he is probably very fearful of his mother or thinks that the sky will fall in if she gets "upset". Your H is likely to be dealing with FOG re his mother (fear, obligation and guilt) and that needs to be dealt with as well in therapy. Neither parent were not good parents to him when he was growing up and their now surviving parent has not changed. This is who she is and this is who she has always been.

I would suggest that you both stay well away from his mother and brother along with you fully continuing to support your H. They have not changed fundamentally in all these years and will not do so either. Your DH may want to read "Toxic Parents" by Susan Forward here as a starting point and you could read her book about toxic inlaws.

Hi Lilly1980

I understand the family dynamics you describe, whilst your father in law was alive perhaps he was able to reassure your husband and help to calm any resentment.

However with no supportive reassurance and other extended family members noticing - it’s understandable you are concerned. I’m sure in his lifetime you father in law went a long way not to just reassure your husband but also attempt to curb your mother in law’s behaviour.

Sadly there is no buffer zone now. I’m afraid there is no easy resolution. The best advice I can offer is to distance yourselves and not get drawn into you mother in law’s behaviour. Sadly some parents choose to behave in an emotionally abusive way - some may be unawares however often the parent deliberately behaves in this abusive way. Stuck in an emotionally abusive pattern of behaviour and they seem to feed off the attention.

Your older brother in law maybe mortified and embarrassed or he may enjoy the attention. The point is - no one in the family has managed to successfully challenge your mother in law’s awful abusive behaviour in all these years - not her husband and not her son.

I know it’s an awful situation but having myself tried to challenge the behaviour of my own awkward and emotionally abusive parents - my best advice is to step back. Honestly raising this issue you will only be shouted down and accused of jealousy. I know because it’s happened in our family. You simply cannot address such an issue when the person or people involved refuse to reflect on their behaviour.

Best advice just distance yourself and also perhaps limit their access to your family in person and also limit their access on social media. Social media is the culprit of many families difficulties. Showing the world a carefully selected narrative is narcissistic and manipulative.

Live your best life and leave her negativity behind - if she doesn’t want to reflect on her behaviour and address the imbalance then it’s best to just enjoy you family life and keep her in the background - if she ever challenges the situation use her behaviour to say - oh we just didn’t think you’d be interested in joining us for ‘xyz’ occasion - we know how busy you are with brother in law etc etc.

Life is what you make it and when you are around the negative behaviours of family members it’s more important than ever - to build your boundaries and “walls” to keep their behaviour from impacting your mental health.

Other people do notice - there are people who probably see your mother in-laws behaviour and do quietly challenge or question it - because they simply think she’s awful. There will be many other family and friends distancing themselves because of the awful behaviour.

No one likes a show off and that’s perhaps who your mum in law is vicariously living her life off the success of her favourite son - who either loves her or loathes her because her love comes at a price and that price is control.

Pay her no attention and limit her access to you on social media there are settings to reinforce this - limited profile etc etc.

Thank you for your response @attilathemeerkat and @katykeene Thank you for your responses. I was worried about being called pathetic for raising this. But I am the one that has to deal with the effect is has on my husband.

His father was actually a really lovely man, I think he just went along with his wife for the easy life. But he had a responsibility in this and he let his son down. I guess to the outside world she looks like a great mother, but in truth she isn't. At times i feel my husband has tried to buy her affection, with gifts and trips. But it's almost like she can sense his desperation and then treats him worse. His brother is lovely and cares for him, however he does things like have Christmas parties and invites his mum, some friends his wife's family, and my husband, myself and our child don't get invited.

It did start to spill over in affecting our child. She asked if she could take our child to school every morning, we didnt need her too, but agreed if she wanted that was fine. Once her other sons children were of school age she informed us she can no longer take our child as she is taking her other son's.

I personally agree that we should step back and let them get on with their lives, but my husband is always trying to fix it. I think he should go to therapy. I don't think he actually sees what his mother has done as not right. He just keeps going back for more and more, and i want to protect him but i can't.

Your own analysis of this is quite accurate.

Your only mistake here re his mother was to at all agree to letting her take your son to school. I knew what was coming (she would go onto refuse this in favour of her other son's children) before I even read the next part and sadly I was correct. Your response should have been a flat no from the get go because she will and indeed has tried to scapegoat your son as well as you as part of your H's family.

You can protect your own self and your child from her. Your H does indeed need therapy as he is mired in FOG. His own inertia also when it comes to his mother also damages him. Her conditioning of him has given him the need to always seek her approval, approval which she will never give him. Your parents seem ok, concentrate your family efforts going forward on them.

I would purchase the Susan Forward book and encourage him to read it, it could open his eyes more. He cannot fix the unfixable and he will tie his own self and you people up in knots trying

Thank you @attilathemeerkat After she did this to my child, I made sure we were in a position to not need any help from anyone, so that it could not be pulled away at a later date. I would much rather rely on myself, i don't like being indebted at the best of times. I do know that when MIL had my husband, she had a hard time. Her sister had to come around everyday for 6 months to take care of him whilst she took care of herself. I often wonder if it was the difficult start that made this an issue? I will get the book, but i genuinely believe he won't think it is as much of a problem as it is. It is the constant wanting approval that drives me mad, i know he isn't going to get it from her and I hate to see him try. I feel like it is one of those situations where from the outside looking in, you would think she is the perfect caring parent. And if you were to tell people what it is really like they just wouldn't believe it. But i guess that is how most abuse looks from the outside.

@lily1980 -

My mother and father’s excuse for their behaviour / abuse was - I was a sickly child! Premature birth - spent 8 weeks in an incubator and when I did come home I had whooping cough - they struggled to cope and their hatred and the burden they felt has just amplified over the years…

My father once wrote a toxic text message telling me “you’re the stupidest of my children” - after reading it a few times I realised he thinks we are all burdens even his golden children my eldest sister and youngest sister and my two brothers!

I’m the middle child and when I recall my childhood I’m horrified at what I went through. Of course they pretend it was all perfect and they will not entertain my truth against theirs -

Like your husband the compulsion to seek their approval and love is still within me - however I have learn’ t to control the urges and I keep my distance.

My family did a similar awful thing with my children only this was school fees - insisted on sending them to private school and paying the fees and then my brother’s children were of school age. You know what happened next! Incidentally my children were happy to move out of the private school where they were bullied by children and adults.

My children are now 18 and 14 - what we’ve learned together is that my parents - their grandparents are manipulative narcissistic and controlling and the best way to live is keep a healthy distance. We are still called upon to play happy families - they celebrated their 50th wedding anniversary - golden years together we went smiled and left early and their golden children did the same.

What amused me the most was the pretence the acting - they have bickered and fought and hurt each other for 50 years - whilst all their five children were caught in the crossfire. My mother wanted a fuss made of her - to show her friends they had a surprise party.

I loathe spending time with them, however I softened a little in the lockdown doing their shopping etc - however I quickly was reminded to keep my distance after more emotional abuse.

I love my children equally. There are no favourites what I do for one I do for the other. Our awful experience has given us emotional intelligence at the cost of emotional abuse. We are stronger as a family however no one should suffer such an awful life.

My best advice love your husband - and make a life independent and distant away from this abuse. Whilst I do on occasion play happy families with them. I find myself anxious annoyed and upset for days after - I won’t ever escape them completely- however I can control the amount of access I allow them to have to us on the whole.

I just don’t let them in - they don’t need to know our plans they don’t need to know where we went and what we did! Life is what you make it - love your husband support him and have him read a few replies! Don’t let your children get drawn into the awful toxic environment - whilst they are stronger I failed to protect my children from my family - so I failed them!!

His father was actually a really lovely man, I think he just went along with his wife for the easy life. But he had a responsibility in this and he let his son down.

Yes, you're right he let his son down, so he wasn't as nice as you thought. If he'd truly been the nice man, he'd have protected his son.

@KatyKeene I am so sorry for what you have been through with your family. I hope you and your siblings are able to have a better relationship with each other. You did not fail your children, that was your parents. We put trust in people we love, hoping they will do better. And then when they let us down we feel like we should have seen it coming. But we can't. I think because his mother took care of his basic needs and my husband was always up and out of the house, she thinks she has done a good job. I feel like when i say the things she has done individually, they sound silly and petty! but after a lifetime of it, it really does add up. Nothing he does is ever good enough. I want to protect him so badly but i can't. But i will protect my own child from her ways. I wont have him thinking he is second best. She reminds me of a spoilt child. Even when it comes to things like mothers day, she will call my husband and tell him exactly what she expects him to buy her, if he didn't she would not doubt be in a sulk. It is honestly laughable.
@multicolourmophead it isn't as black and white as that unfortunately. But i appreciate what you are saying