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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Can alcoholics claim custody?

13 replies

Smillar2020 · 10/08/2020 11:14

I have a baby with my stbxh. Divorced on grounds of his alcohol abuse and emotional abusive behaviour. Filed a police report against him, investigation is ongoing but no charges yet (emotional abuse being hard to prove). Ex now demanding 50/50 custody even though he has never done anything for our baby. Never done a bedtime, watched him unsupervised, hasn’t changed a nappy in months. I have a serious issue with his parents too as they dismissed me when I threw him out after finding bags of empty cans and bottles. They said I should find a way to resolve “our” issues. MIL also used to go through our joint bank account without my knowledge or consent and exh would lie to my face and say I was crazy for making up lies. I’m so worried I’ll have to see my baby handed over to them. Does anyone have any advice? I’ve got a solicitor involved but still early days.

OP posts:
tiktok · 10/08/2020 11:29

I am not a lawyer, but I know something about family cases like this.

If your ex has explored child arrangements, then you may be required to seek mediation - though where there has been documented abuse you may be exempt.

If/when it goes to the family court, investigations will take place with your baby's needs at the heart of any arrangement discussed.

Highly unlikely if things are as you say that the court would support 50/50 contact or care.

Your solicitor will explain the details or you can explore what's likely to happen at rightsofwomen.org.uk/

If your ex has no experience of giving good care to your baby, then he will not be permitted to care for him 50/50....a typical scenario would be supervised contact at limited times, at least at first.

Sometimes, the non-resident parent uses this whole scenario as a threat to intimidate the other parent - courts do not look kindly on this, so the fact he is being belligerent does him no favours. The grandparents have no automatic right to have any contact with your baby, btw. You might be able to insist they don't.

Smillar2020 · 10/08/2020 11:58

Thank you so much for your reply. I feel much better after reading that. My concern is ex in laws being counted as “supervisors” as well. Given their behaviour towards me and their undermining of their son’s alcoholism around my baby I feel sick at the thought of them getting to play grandparents to my baby, who she has no relationship with.

OP posts:
heartache590 · 10/08/2020 12:00

The courts are seeking for amicable parenting relationships. They are jaded to DV claims, as almost every family court case cites abuse.

Baby has an automatic right to a meaningful relationship with both parents, unless welfare can be proven as an issue.

The decision you need to make is what steps he needs to take in order for you to feel safe with baby around him. The courts are harder than you think.

There are heroin drug addicts with supervised contact with children because it is made safe by the use of social workers for context. Emotional abuse will be minor on the scale, so you wouldnt be looked at kindly if you dont offer him EOW as a minimum (supervised initially)

keepingbees · 10/08/2020 12:10

Sounds like a stressful situation I feel for you.
The issues with your MIL aren't really a consideration to the courts, she won't have any legal rights over your baby and her snooping on your finances won't be relevant.
Emotional abuse is very hard to prove, and the courts are evidence based so you would need to back up any claims you make of this.
Proving your ex has alcohol issues is going to be tricky unless he admits it or there is evidence such as medical notes, which the court could request. I'm not sure if they can request some kind of toxicology test on him?
Your best bet would be to offer supervised access on the basis that you have welfare concerns because of his drinking and his lack of previous care. Don't try and refuse all contact. Show that you're willing to be reasonable but have genuine concerns.
If he's doing this to get at you then supervised access without you present won't be an attractive option and he might lose interest anyway.

Smillar2020 · 10/08/2020 12:12

My ex is free to come to my house to see our baby as often as he likes, when it’s mutually convenient. Supervised by me. He has never been told he cannot come. He has been coming on average once or twice per week. He has also not turned up, been hours late without reason etc.

OP posts:
Smillar2020 · 10/08/2020 12:13

I have neveR restricted access. I just don’t want him taking my baby unsupervised without me under any circumstances.

OP posts:
Smillar2020 · 10/08/2020 12:14

I have photos of his alcohol abuse including pictures of bags and bags of empty cans and bottles.

OP posts:
tiktok · 10/08/2020 12:14

The in-laws have no automatic right to be contact supervisers. The court normally strives for both parents to be happy with the superviser/s. Sometimes the contact is, at least initially, at a contact centre, especially when there are concerns about the parent's competence and safety. Other times might be at a public place with you there, or if not you someone you and he are happy with.

It's true, as heartache says, addiction is not a bar to contact unless there is a safety element (if he turned up clearly drunk for contact, for instance, or could not be trusted, in the eyes of the court/CAFCASS, to not be drunk).

tiktok · 10/08/2020 12:17

Keep a diary record of broken arrangements, and of text messages. Not turning up or changing arrangements at the last minute is not good - especially beyond babyhood, when children understand they're being let down.

Coffeesnob11 · 10/08/2020 12:26

I just wanted to say i am in a similar position apart from the in laws, they are supportive and great. He has passed out and failed to pick our child up from nursery, i am worried about him drink driving. I am happy for him to see our child but supervised.
Does your ex have his own place?

Thingsdogetbetter · 10/08/2020 12:38

You may need to be flexible on insisting that you are always present to supervise. He could easily argue that he can't build a relationship with dc if you are always there. First you neex to prove he'd be a danger to dc if not supervised and your 'feelings' or unfounded fears will not be enough. If you can persuade the courts he's not safe, could it be a member of your family or a contact centre? Offer a realistic alternative or his patents supervising may be seen as an acceptable compromise. Agree with pp that your issues with pil will not affect their ability to supervise in the courts eyes. But if you get in first with an alternative then you'll look to be offering reasonable suggestions rather than barriers.

Random photos of empty bottles are not proof of his drinking. They could be anyone's. Or a set up. Etc etc. Unless the alcoholic is putting the dc in danger then courts will allow access. Witness statements about his inability to safely parent would be much better than photos or you 'opinion' if that is actually the case. As would a detailed diary of his lack of engagement when you were together (who went to dc doctor's appointments etc) and a detailed record of each and every time he didn't turn up for access or turned up late.

As far as the court is concerned his emotional abuse of you is not a factor in his relationship with his dc (bizarre and unjust as that seems) and if he has never put dc in danger then neither is his alcholism.

50/50 or one resident parent is for the benefit of the dc, not the parents. The more you can prove that you have been the primary carer and it is in your dc's best interest for this to continue the better. Rather than basing it on him being an emotionally abusive drunk fuckwit whose parents are in denial.

Thingsdogetbetter · 10/08/2020 12:43

And as a pp said email or text for all arrangements as proof, particularly if he's going to be late etc. Even if it's just you asking where he is if he's late. No phonecalls as they can't be used as proof. Document everything in writing.

heartache590 · 10/08/2020 12:49

Whilst taking evidence is good, i think you need to be mindful of your outcome.

Solicitors need to earn money. They can do that by making things prolonged. An adversarial court battle is expensive, stressful and detrimental to children (harmful conflict).

Your line of attack is to offer supervised contact as you are doing, document him, and send a legal letter explaining your concerns and why you are doing it.

Do not get into the courts if you can avoid it. Nobody wins. You need to lay a sensible path to unsupervised contact in your legal letter (e.g. alcohol treatment) by then showing the photos. A judge would then just say 'well just go to the treatment then...?' if he challenges you.

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