Toxic Parent Terminally Ill

[duke748]

Hi all,

I know many of you have experience of a 'toxic parent' and as I do too, I have appreciated reading other people's experiences and how they have coped with them. At the very least, I know I am not alone.

I won't bore you with all the details, but I have not been in contact with my mother for about 3 years, through my own choice.

I got a phone call last night from my aunt telling me that my mother has pancreatic cancer and will be seeing the doctor today to get a prognosis.

What would you do given this news? Would you contact the parent? Would you offer to see then? Would you go and help nurse them?

I'd love to hear what you would do.

Thanks,

Duke.

Hi

This is a tricky one!

I think if this were my mother (highly toxic and not spoken or seen for 7 years and very happy as a result of it) I would be still afraid of her nasty mouth, the control, the temper and fear any confrontation or rejection.

But, being the nice person that I am I think I would write to her, telling her how sorry I am to hear the news and I would ask her to contact me if she needed my help.

Personally, I don't feel after all this time and knowing that I am happier not seeing her, that I could just go running because she is ill. It would feel hypocritical.

What is your heart telling you to do?

Do you feel that you want to contact her? Could you regret it in the future if you don't? If you think you could then I would say definitely contact her.

Must have been a shock?

If you go back, what do you go back too? Will being ill make her a different person. You left for good reasons I'm guessing. Have those changed by your mother being ill? I think its natural to feel sorry? Empathetic? Worrying that things could go unsaid that you want to still say? Why do you want to go back. Is it for her, or for yourself?

Try digging a bit deeper for your reasons for possibly going back to her. Just get a nice big sheet of paper and start randomly writing down thoughts or type them out or whatever works best for you and see what comes out.

Did you work through all your emotions when you split from her? Or do you feel there is more work to do there? Don't have to answer that one, bit personal but something to think about.

xxxx

Would it be different if it was your toxic father who was ill? I ask because daughters are caught up in this whole 'caring mother/daughter' thing, where the daughter becomes the mother and is responsible ofr the caring. My father left us 25 years ago, made it very clear he blamed me for it (he had an affair, hello!) and I have barely spoken to him since. If he was terminally ill, it wouldn't bother me too much. Sounds hard, but he's no more preciuos to me than any another guy I knew 2 decades ago.

Thanks for your answers so far.

Yes I would feel differentaly if it was my father who was ill. He is a bad person, my mother is just a misguided person. I think so anyway. And yes, I do feel its my role to care for her, isn't it every child's role to care for their parents when they are old?

But then, isn't it every parent's job to look after their children when they are young? But, in the same way that two wrongs don't make a right, I don't think I can not fulfill my obligations just becasue she didn't. If that makes any sense.

I actually spoke to my mother very briefly on the phone and she seemed very subdued and even said sorry!

My reasons for wanting to help her are, I think, simply to help her out as I know noone else will (except my aunty, who has enough on her plate). I long ago gave up on any kind of fairy tale ending where it was all resolved and sorted. I don't even want to rake up any of the past with her. It would be very painful for me.

I am so very scared of being sucked back into doing whatever she says and ending up moving back (200 miles) to be near her in the end.

I feel very selfish as it will only be for a few months, but I don't know if I could simply move my life that far away.

I would do it in a second for one of the few close friends I have in life, but am not sure I would do it for her. But then, do I consign her to living her last days alone and in pain with no one to help her?

Its all just so horrible. And a big big shock.

Follow your heart. You may regret it if you do not contact her but then again you may not, only you can answer that.

If it were me in your situation I would contact her and also probably go to see her but I don't think I would offer nursing and care.

Bear in mind though that terminal illness will not have changed who she is and what has happened in the past. She may feel some remorse but then may not. Also, the knowledge that they have cancer and some treatments (especially steroids) can magnify any nasty tendencies a person has and make them quite difficult to deal with. I know this from experience with my Mother - she became completely irrational.

Hope that helps a bit, good luck with your decision x

I have relatives that I do not have any contact with. I would not change that if I got a call to say they were terminal because my reason for not having them in my life would not have changed. The fact that they may be dying changes nothing.

But that's just me in my situation. Some people feel like they need answers, or something (Americans call it 'closure').

Sorry Duke, x-posted with you.

I think 200 miles is a long way to move and you are not selfish at all not to want to go that far. For starters, do you have DCs who you would have to move with you? Other family? A job?

I am glad she said sorry to you, it sounds as though visiting her may do you both some good.

It is a hard one and I feel sorry for you to be in this situation.

I am not sure I would go, as she had not phoned you to tell her yourself, somebody else did. That shows to me that she has not changed.

The fact that she only have said sorry now that she has been diagnosed with pancreatic cancer does not impress me that much either. It could be the whole fear of what is after life. Do you go somewhere nice if you have been/are a good person etc. that she is probably pondering on now that it is becoming more of a reality.

I don't know what the story between you and your mum is though, and I am probably just sounding so bitter because it has only been 1 1/2 years since I last spoke with my parents and I know that I could get that phonecall any day because my dad has a heart condition, and has already passed out twice maybe even three times during that time.

Whatever you chose I wish you all the strength to handle it and hope you will get some closure if you have not already achieved this.

XX

My father split from my mother about 5 years ago, you don't need to hear details but I haven't spoke to him since then.

About a year after we had stopped speaking my mum rang and said she had been told he had acute myeloid leukemia and was in ICU for treatment. She was told (by my sister who was talking to him) he might not last the next few weeks.

I drove to London and stayed with SIL planning to see him the next day.
I didn't go to hospital.
I stayed up all night thinking about why I wanted to see him and what I wanted to achieve from it. I decided not to go as I realised I wanted an apology and happy reunion from him and for us to 'make up' before he died but I realised that I know my father, and that is never going to happen.

He is still alive but I know nothing about his health, adn I have realised I am happier not knowing. If i met him again it would not make me feel better, too much happened in ym childhood for me to ever forgive him unless he was totally penitent and he denies eveyrthing so as far as I am concerned I only have a mother.

I hope that helps you somehow, just try and picture what you want from a meeting and if it is realistic to expect that.

Hi all. Thanks for your support.

I am not sure I really want anything from our meeting. If she wasn't ill it would be very different and I would expect an apology and not an all encompassing one, but somehow one that showed understanding of what happened and how it affected me. Even then it would never be a 'normal' mother daughter reationship (whatever that is) and would be on my terms.

But, as she is ill I think I just don't want her to die alone. I made a choice to take her out of my life to look after myself, but that doesn't mean I think she is so bad that she deserves to die alone and without some kind of knowledge that I care about her on some level.

I could be not being realistic about my feelings, but I honestly think that I just couldn't live with myself if I ignored her.

I think she asked my aunt to call me as she does not know my contact details but my aunt does. She knew that to phone me out of the blue would be overstepping boudaries (plus I don't think my aunt would have given her my number!).

I was very frightened to speak to her as I did not know what to say other than offer my suport. Raking over old ground is the last thing I want. I worry that if I open up to those feelings they will take over and then I would be back to a very dark place that I don't want to be in.

I do understand that when some people are ill and/or on certain medication they get very aggressive and that does worry me. I also know that my mother takes up a lot of time and energy when well and is very draining so worry about what an ill version of her would be like.

So I think I have decided to be in contact and visit (but stay at a friends house) but am really not sure how much care and ongoing support to offer her if any. Its so tough.

You are a lovely person! your mother is very lucky to have you as a daughter.

Would your aunt visit with you? Would that make you feel better?

I wish you every bit of strength and I hope you have a wonderful visit with a chance to build some nice memories (albeit in sad circumstances) xx

what a difficult situation for you, I just wanted to say that there will be lots of help for her via the NHS is the form of Macmillan nurses, Marie Curie nurses, district nurses. Do not feel you have to move to look after her. You have your own life and family to think of. If you can go and visit her to let her make peace with you and it will give you some closure on the situation. Perhaps a trip sooner rather than later should be advised, if you want to go,as the prognosis for this is poor and no real treatment other than palliative care - ie to make her as comfortable as possible.
Whatever decision you make needs to be right for you. Best of luck with it.

Hi duke,

I think you've got the right idea - given the not close relationship between you and your mum, and the fact you haven't spoken for three years, I think visiting and showing support is about as much as could be expected of you under the circumstances. I'm estranged from my dad but if I found out he was terminally ill I'd feel I had to see him at least. He'd have to do something unbelievably awful - not that he hasn't tried! - for me to just write him off completely, and it sounds like you feel the same, more or less.

Ultimately what matters is how you will look back on your mum's final months - as you say, you don't want to be wracked with guilt, you want to know you did what you could. So I definitely think you're doing the right thing in going and seeing her, offering support (of the visiting/talking on the phone kind), and seeing how that plays out for now.

personally i would not contact
unless it is purely for YOU

personally i would not contact
unless it is purely for YOU

Its interesting reading how people have such differing views.

TimeforYou - thanks for calling me lovely. Its the last thing I feel to be honest. I feel guilty for not dropping everything at once and having any kind of doubts at all. But then guilt is a constant part of my life and my best friend would tell you.

I will try my best to make her last months as easy as possible. I guess I will have to worry about the care aspect as and when it comes to it.

In some ways I think I have to be happy (that is so not the right word, but I can't think of the right one) that at least i get this time to make her feel better rather than finding out she had already gone and there was nothing I could do.

I think I could contact her and visit her (but not nurse her) if Id</span> <span class="italic">finished</span> <span class="italic">all</span> <span class="italic">the </span>necessary<span class="italic"> </span>work<span class="italic"> </span>on<span class="italic"> </span>myself^. THis means, the whole shebang of confrontation (see that long thread), working on my anger and everything, working through the anger, accepting that shell NEVER EVER change, and that shell continue to try to hurt me etc etc etc If I managed to work through all that and take a detached attitude to her, I might stomach visiting her, leading onto regular visits, but probably not more than an hour or so. At the end of the day you CANT take care of anyone (including her) unless you take care of yourself. Those are the truest words I`Ve ever heard.

I probably would. But that doesn't mean you should.

I feel fairly confident after meeting my mother last week (for the first time in 18 months) that I have separated from her sufficiently to feel pity for her in a reasonably detached way and not to get drawn into responding to her guilt-peddling and anger, etc.

But I agree with others that when you have taken the momentous decision to stay away from a toxic parent you have done it because you needed (for once) to start putting yourself first, and I truly believe that this should be the case now and always. You HAVE to look after yourself and your mother HAS to come second to that, simply because of the nature of the relationship between toxic parent and child and that we as children have always been forced to put our needs second to our mothers.

As Sakura says, if you feel strong enough to do so and are sure that there will be no harmful effect to you then see her, but do NOT beat yourself up if you choose not to. She probably doesn't deserve you anyway.

hello

my dad (not toxic all his life, but an alcoholic for the last few years and very difficult and hard on me, my mum etc)died nearly a year ago, suddenly but not entirely unexpectedly - his health was generally deteriorating for a while. not sure if it will help, but here's my experience...

i had prepared for it mentally (as much as you can) talking it over with a counsellor: it is easy to take on so much guilt, much unnecessary. I realised as others on this thread have that the big showdown and telling it how it is, apology etc wouldn't happen. I realised it was necessary to cope by taking care of myself and protecting my DS too - how would it be for your children if you moved/got too involved. Agree also that undertaking the caring role might not be for you - quite a specialist job with pain relief etc. With my dad, I visited as long/briefly as I could cope with, kept in contact sending cards, photos of DS etc and I achieved a real peace.

there was an article in the guardian family pages recently which really made me think that the way i played it was ok - keep options open and light contact, it is their role too to communicate back to you. they are on quite a journey - knowing the end is fairly near - I can't imagine how that is. also, if I was in my last days, not sure I would want to be with someone with whom I'd had a difficult relationship...

can you discuss all this with your aunt? she might have insights. my mum helped a lot with seeing my dad's point of view (he didn't see a need to have some big heartsearch, he knew I wished him well)as well as hearing and understanding my point

I wish you well - this is a sad situation to be in.. imagine you were advising your best friend, treat yourself as your best friend.