Can't escape toxic friend

[Endlessness]

Instead of looking forward to my son starting Reception Class in September, I am worrying about how a friend (frenemy) of mine will cause me grief. Anyone would think that we seem like close friends (as are both of our two children), but over the past year I've realised that her friendship is quite toxic - she competes with me over other friendships and is very controlling.

The Reception Class parents do drop-offs and pick-ups on the other side of the school (not where the other Mums that I know collect), and she is the only Mum I know whose child will be in the class. Our sons are very good friends.

I wanted to put some distance between us, but I know she will make it impossible. She basically becomes friendly with anyone she sees me attempt to befriend, or even talk to. She then starts meeting up on her own with those people, and finds ways to show me that she is 'better' friends with them than I am. It always turns into some weird competitive situation. I get frozen out and not invited to things for a while until she becomes better friends with the other person than I am. Sometimes her actions and words seem calculated to make me feel left out and shit. Yet all the time I'm experiencing a strange -push-pull from her, where she's making out we are great friends.

I know she will be watching my every move in September, and I'm dreading it. I know this sounds unbelievable and High School (it is!), but I've known this Mum long enough to see this pattern happening over again. Anyone experienced anything like this and have advice?

I think gradually through school you get friendly with mums on the basis of your child making friends with theirs. I'd be led by that rather than trying to carve out friendships at the gates.

The other mums wont be aware of having to choose between you and your friend. It's only a competition in your heads. Try not to play.

And maybe start distancing from her.

I've known someone similar, played games with various friends to create an almost competition between them- I'm not explaining it correctly (and can't be bothered) but I brought it up with her twice and gave direct examples that had happened on those particular days. She denied. In the end, I pulled away as it was ridiculous and arose from.her own insecurities. It sounds like your situation might be difficult to put distance between but possibly just concentrate on making other friends and I'm sure other people will notice if she is trying to cut you out- if they're nice and want to be your friend that is. Good luck.

Bern there. Had same uni course and lived with her. Total single white female :/ she did that same thing with my friends. Even started flinging herself at any man I liked. Everything was made into a competition.

She was a covert narcissist.

If I could go back in time I would have advised myself to put as much distance between me and her as possible. Asap.

Could your child go to a different nursery?
Is moving away an option? The later might seem extreme but, there is a person who is obsessed with knocking you down and standing on you to raise herself up. She is a danger to you. I say, take no chances.

Try and extract yourself from the bullshit and do your own thing.

Be pleasant for the sake of your sons friendships but you're under no obligation to be "friends" with this woman.

Whether or not she has some kind of narcissistic personality disorder (which we cannot know from this info) the advice online for how to deal with a narc will still be a help to you. I have 2 covert narcs in my life and so speak from experience. Low/no contact and be as boring as possible in any interaction. Look up "grey rock". Trust your gut and protect your boundaries.

I'd concentrate more on distancing yourself from this friend than making other mum friends.

I'd even go so far as to 'fall out' with her over something. School mum friends tend to come and go so I'd not worry about that at the moment.

It's probably best to assume that the parents you meet at the school gate (any school gate) are not going to turn out to be life long best friends. Yeah I know there are exceptions to the rule. So just be pleasant, bright & breezy and set up play dates according to your DS preferences. Make friends elsewhere

Can you be unavailable at school pick-up? So go in at the last possible moment, headphones on, collect your child and straight out again? If she tries to engage then you can do the whole lovely-to-see-you-can't-stop-I'm-in-a-mad-rush routine.

Be busy talking on your phone as you approach the collection point, even if you're not actually talking to anyone if you know what I mean!

I am struggling with this too. I feel horrible backing away, for various reasons, and I also constantly doubt my perception and wonder how much I am feeding the competition but literally ever question she asks me about my child age will then compare instantly with how amazing her own child is. I just feel exhausted dealing with her, life just feels too hard without needing to pit our children against each other. Maybe I am being naive, because we do live in a competitive world so perhaps I should just suck it up, but I dread seeing her now and my own insecurities are just spiralling in this constant tit for tat. I feel so sad I have allowed it to get to this point as I know my daughter will lose a friend through the actions of two mothers.

I'd second keeping friends outside of school as your go-to friends for the time being? You really don't have to make friends at school at all.

OP, it sounds like she sees you as someone that everyone likes and is really insecure. She needs to see that everyone who likes you also likes her, which devalues those relationships she's making with other mums because they are fixated round you.

If you can't get away from her, can you reassure her / kill her with kindness? She is clearly missing something in her life that's she trying to fill. There can't be as many narcs in the world as mumsnet likes us to believe! ( I hope )

I've heard a term on mumnets before about these women being called a Wendy. You are being wendied. Google it and some explanation or past posts should come up about it by mumsnet.

mumsnet* that should be.

The thing is, narcissists are attracted nice people who worry too much about hurting other peoples feelings rather than protecting their own boundaries. Narcissists also erode boundaries bit by bit.

They like people that think 'maybe I am being naive, because we do live in a competitive world'. Rather than thinking 'hang on a minute. This 'friend' makes me feel like shit. I should tell her to fuck off because friends dont treat their friends like competition, frenemies do. And I dont need that horseshit in my life'.

Work on your boundaries guys. Because friends arent dickheads.

I don't underestimate how uncomfortable this can make you feel, OP.

I think you have to try and look at her as someone with issues - however someone you need to be firm with your boundaries with.

Be pleasant, cordial but very, very boundaried in all your dealings with her. Keep it very limited. Just smile. How are you, fine, nice weather, if you really have to speak to her. Don't be in her physical company or accept any invitations. Always remove yourself physically from wherever she is hanging out. It will take a while but she will get the message. I know its an absolute pain though.

I don't know what to say about yours son's friendships though. I think you can try and limit that as much as you can, without making it too obvious? Remember, also, they will most likely grow apart as they make new friendships.

@Bunnymumy 😂 Thank you, I feel like you just gave me a well needed slap. 'Work on your boundaries guys. Because friends aren't dickheads'...I might need this tattooed on my arm. Perhaps I could have it written over 'please walk all over me, and be sure to wipe your shit on me too before you leave'. Ugh. I have a lot of work to do on boundaries. Onwards and upwards guys.

hmmmmmm,

If she really does do this all the time then maybe you could be sneeky. Why not start getting friendly with complete nutters and psychos, that'll teach her right?

Terrible advise, sorry, but i know how you feel, had very similar in the past and it's horrible and heartbreaking.

As well as other good advice you have been given, if you have her on any of your social media then customise and restrict her access to what she can see , included in this you can hide your friends list from her.

I have one of those in my life Endlessness.

It's shit.

Sometimes her actions and words seem calculated to make me feel left out and shit.

What does she say or do?

You have described it very well.

I would have it out with her before your kids start.

Shame her. She will deny it. But it will make it harder for her to deny.

Focus on one to one friendships. She will not allow you to be part of a group.

@Bunnymumy has NAILED IT. This is something that I have had to learn and has not come easily to me. But now I can see it, I can't unsee it and I can't believe how much I have disrespected myself in the past. And I see people (mostly women) doing the same ALL THE TIME

OP, this other women feels threatened by you. You have something or there is something about you that she envies and that she also feels entitled to.

I agree with previous posters. Establish strong boundaries. Being too nice won't work well. Be polite but distant. Are you happy for your sons to play?

I challenged a covert narc a while ago. She upped her nastiness for about 3 months, icing me while lovebombing everybody else. I let her get on with it. I do sense a recalibration now. She is not warm to be but i sense that i put her on notice.

She had an invisible hierarchy in her head. I was supposed to step in to line with that! To toe the line while the covert narc kissed up and kicked down (i was down apparently, and it triggered her when i showed that i didnt buy in to her hierarchy). I defended a tiny boundary, that was it. The people she perceived to be above her would have been allowed to defend a small boundary.

So that was a lesson to me.

Never rise above somebody else's narcissistic belief that it is a given you are beneath them on their hierarchy.

You've still got a couple of months to go before September. Begin backing off from the friendship now before she starts trying to get your DC together for playdates etc.
It's sad if when your DC are friends but really the woman is toxic and she's likely to also interfere in her child's friendships too especially come September when she starts trying to pal up her child with the children of other mum's she fancies befriending - potentially leaving your child out. Just because she can and she knows you'll take it.
You need to nurture friendships away from this woman and start backing away now.