Happyish home, heavy heart

[AlwaysAboob]

Very quick background, partner and I together for 14+ years and have 2 DDs (9 and 8). DP is fantastic father and supportive to me, and being completely honest probably does the lions share in many respects. He is funny, genuine, honest and caring and genuinely wants to provide for us all. His negatives include being controlling of situations, and a desire to be alpha male in social situations or around family. To add, we live many miles from our respective parents so have no immediate support in terms of childcare/babysitting etc which means our time together is purely at home/with kids. Add to equation that we worked together at home for 6 years, although i have recently changed jobs and gone back out to work (before C-19!). He has no interests outside the home, a couple of close friends who he meets for a drink once a week. I have an active and full life, with many interests and sports, and many friends and i like to socialise. He has admitted he resents this and there is an element of jealousy as he feels he has nothing.

The short version is that i no longer feel any emotional attachment to him - and its the old cliche of loving him, but not being in love with him. I desperately do not want to tear apart my family, but i also dont feel i can go through the motions for the rest of my life.

I told him i wanted to seperate in Jan and we had a hideous few days, (although kept it from the kids) he was absolutely broken and i felt ill that i had caused so much hurt. Slowly things returned to normal and it seemed to be 'forgotten'.

So, a few months on - things are ok at home, we get on, have a laugh, kids happy, nice house, comfortable financially....but still the feeling is not there. I have told him again...he is devastated again and wants to fight for everything, which i understand...but my heart is not in it! He is now on a mission to make me happy and prove we can work. I would describe it as love bombing! Smothering me with cuddles, stroking, staring etc.

Sexually there is nothing there for me, cannot bear to even kiss although occasionally it does happen as its easier to say yes and get it over with.... despite this, i dont feel this area of my life should be over yet! (I am 41, he is 43)

I am aware i sound completely cold, but thats how i feel. Cold. I honestly feel

Am i off my head to consider seperating with what many would consider to be an amazing man?! I am young although he constantly reminds me i am 41, and a mother...

My first time posting after lurking for a lifetime, please be kind. And thank you.

Things are not ok deep down at home are they, you feel cold.

What do you get out of this relationship now?. From what you write about him as well he does not sound all that amazing and the bad here well outweighs any good qualities he has. Those that you cite are really indicative of your relationship bar needing to be urgently raised, your standards are really quite low here.

Women in poor relationships often write the good dad comment or versions thereof when they can think of nothing else positive to write about their man. He also has some red flags about him (he being controlling of situations, and a desire to be alpha male in social situations or around family, yet another is you having a full social life. BTW does he whinge or otherwise moan about the kids and or what time you will get back when you go out?. If he does that is another red flag here) and these cannot be further minimised or even ignored now.

The love bombing you're getting now is another red flag. His love bombing won't last, and as soon as you show a hint of caring about anything else other than him, he will get furious with you and label you as selfish (that is probably what he thinks when you go out for the evening somewhere whilst you leave him with the kids). Their mask slips, and you see someone mean, belittling, and unreasonable underneath.

And he did not leave either when you told him it was over in January.
What is he hanging on for?.

You're not off your head at all to consider separating from such an individual and besides which you only need to give your own self permission to leave. You do not need his.

What do you want to teach your children about relationships and what are they learning here? Would you want them as adults to be in a relationship with someone just like this individual, no you would not.
I would also think they are aware on some level that things are not good between you and their dad. You may well have tried to keep it from the kids but they are not stupid and they pick up on all the vibes, both spoken and unspoken here. Also sound travels; they could well have heard raised voices and angry words even if they are not in the same room.

In a very similar situation to you! Strikingly so. I'm 40. 3 DCs and in full time work. Married for 19 years.
Had a horrible case of Covid pneumonia but mostly realised over the last few months (years if I'm honest with myself) that this marriage is wrong for me.
I told H a few weeks ago and he had the same reaction as yours. We are confined together so he wants to prove until lockdown ends that he is the perfect husband. It's draining. I know my emotions won't change. It's really very hard but I will need to set the wheels in motion now. He's threatened to quit his job and just leave us in the lurch if I go ahead. I know I can't give in to blackmail.
I'm not sure how my post can help you but I guess I wanted you to know that you're not alone.
Oh, and of course I got the old 'you're 40 and no one will seriously want a single mum' bullshit. I know it's BS. Don't listen to that.

Well done for being honest.

Next you need to be strong - make your plan to leave, get good legal advice and make it happen.

If your OP is how you genuinely feel then it's not fair on anyone, including yourself, to stay in the marriage.

I had a similar dip or 2 in many years with my DP. All long term relationships have them. He was a lovely person, great father and all that, like yours. They are much much rarer than you might imagine. In retrospect both of us went through periods of mild depression, where everything lost its shine. Working and bringing up kids is tough, esp with little other support. At your age I was so unhappy I went off on a holiday on my own for my 40th. It gave me the distance to see things more clearly. I stayed, focused on strengths, love grew richer and deeper.

Sounds like your husband is the home body and you're the outgoing one. If you don't want to stay with him then don't, the resentment may build. Find yourself somewhere to stay and leave him with the kids. You can enjoy your social life and agree on access. Would you want 50/50 or every other weekend and a night during the week, or some other arrangement (something for you to agree).

If you don't want to stay with him then don't! I'm talking from the other side. My ex decided he didn't want to be with me then gave me months of agony of trying to be uber wife. It would have been kinder to just leave. It hurt at the time but will be better in the long run.

There are clearly identifiable controlling behaviours going on with this guy but somehow you are left with unnecessary high levels of obligation, guilt and sole responsibility for the failure of this relationship.

Most likely this is because there is covert manipulation going on as well.

He is not being kind and respectful to you when he says he is resentful of your social life, becomes controlling in certain situations and acts the alpha male with your family.

However he wraps it up in the nice Daddy, cracking on with housework etc. - he is happy and cheerful when he has you isolated at home with him and kicks off when social situations (your friends and hobbies, family) intrude and threaten his control.

I would look a bit closer at subtle manipulative behaviours and repeated lower level of control tactics, over the course of your relationship and you may well see the insidious pattern over the years.

He is not authentic - so you are left with an “off” “detached” feeling because your relationship isn’t authentic - you just haven’t been able to put your finger on it specifically.

However you don’t have to look to find blame if you don’t want to - because at the very least you are not compatible socially, sexually, emotionally. That’s enough.

A loving person would give you space in the hope that you would find your way back to him not suffocate and guilt trip you for his own needs.

Thank you all for your responses, been delayed replying as it's been an intense 24 hours!

So much of what has been said rings so true - I've had every tactic overnight- crying, begging, blame, shouting, a letter, etc... he says I'm giving nothing back and showing no fire in my belly to make it work. I guess that's how I'm feeling but heart broken when i think about tearing apart 3 lives gor the sake of my own.

@sessell it is encouraging things havr worked out well, and i dont want to just give up - but can you get the love back??

@Songsofexperience have you worked out what you will do once lockdown does lift???

Yes. It's very hard but I will have to send him a legal letter to show him I'm deadly serious about this, at which point I think he will leave. I may struggle financially if he quits his job to spite me (or because he's genuinely too hurt to work). In any case i am seeking advice from a solicitor now. They are deemed an essential service so most are open (and by the time we sort things out I think courts will have reopened).
The problem with such people is that they use brinkmanship to make you back down. Once you're sure it's not what you want though, you can press on that red button. I know I've given him enough warning. Many years in fact.

@AlwaysAboob

Hmm, I'd just like to step in and perhaps kindly suggest a more measured approach than seems to have been suggested by others.

In your original post there are certainly some possible red flags for worryingly controlling behaviour, but it's not entirely clear to me whether this behaviour is abusively controlling, or simply that he shows dominance in certain aspects of life - other parts of your post emphasise he's a good man.

Anyway, my point is that some responses have immediately jumped to assassinate your DH (and very colourfully flesh out his dastardly character), when that might not be justified based on the information available. If it is justified, then I'll happily back those responses.

Reading your post, things don't sound good for the relationship, I'll admit that. But really, has NO ONE thought to suggest marriage counselling/therapy?!!

I really would suggest giving this a go. Even if it doesn't save the marriage, it may help you separate on amicable terms, and you can both at least call it a day knowing that you made reasonable efforts to make it work - particularly given that there are kids involved. If there are "controlling" issues, a good therapist should pick up on that, which may either address them (if they are minor), or help you realise that they are serious cause for concern (if they are major).

The tantrums last night aren't great, but bear in mind that your DH stands to lose everything he holds dear - that's certainly not to say you shouldn't leave, but I would cut him some slack for falling to pieces and (last night) raging against the machine.

Regarding the comment by a previous poster that "A loving person would give you space in the hope that you would find your way back to him not suffocate and guilt trip you for his own needs.", this reminds me of the quote "If you love someone, set them free. If they come back, they’re yours; if they don’t, they never were."

Sounds lovely, doesn't it? But it's not real life, in which if you love someone, you fight for your relationship with them, and setting them free suggests you don't love them at all. So again, I wouldn't judge him too harshly for doing everything in his power to keep you - even if in practice those things are pushing you away.

If he's not abusive, and you genuinely feel the way you expressed in your original post, a good description for his situation is "fucked", and people in such a situation tend to flail around doing the wrong thing, because there isn't actually a right thing - nothing will make a difference.

Anyway, I wish you luck with whatever you decide.

@AllwaysAboob yes you can get the love back. I did and was never happier than in our last few years. He died, in his early 50s, and I miss him so much. Nobody else compares. He sounded like the best of your DP and yes had a few faults too - but not deal breakers, just irritations that seem worse when life is stressful. When I went away I reflected and saw his really amazingly good points more clearly. I decided to make an effort and work on our relationship. They are all cliches, but you do need to work at relationships. Like I was, maybe you are used to him making most of the effort. You know he'll never leave you. When you don't need to work at something, you start to value it less.

I really wonder if everyone else saying to leave him has ever been with someone who is a"fantastic father and supportive to me, and being completely honest probably does the lions share in many respects. He is funny, genuine, honest and caring and genuinely wants to provide for us all." That doesn't sound remotely alpha, so I'm wondering how big an issue that is. I look at my friends' partners and none of them match up to that description.

You also say that you love him, but are not in love. Tbh in love is exhausting and no relationship can maintain it for years and years! The fact that you do love him is huge. And 'in love' can definitely return for stretches.

From what you say in your update and earlier - I think you do also need some space. He needs to back off with the love bombing and take the pressure off. Get some couples counselling, or even just counselling on your own - I've had counselling online and prefer it. It is a massive decision and you do need to find a way of untangling your thoughts and getting to the bottom of why you feel this way and how you can move forward in the best way for you all.

I really wonder if everyone else saying to leave him has ever been with someone who is a"fantastic father and supportive to me, and being completely honest probably does the lions share in many respects. He is funny, genuine, honest and caring and genuinely wants to provide for us all."

To be fair, mine is really not like that. He is not supportive enough. He appreciates my career now that I've built it and that the financial value to us is undeniable but he didn't before. He doesn't do the lion's share of housework and child rearing.
So there are differences here.

If you don’t fancy him anymore and don’t have feelings then maybe a trial separation would be best? It doesn’t have to be traumatic. Look at Bruce Willis and Demi Moore. Your kids will be fine as long as you’re fine and you do the whole thing with respect. In your shoes I wouldn’t do counselling. You’re just stringing it out and giving him false hope? You sound like you’ve made your mind up. Can I ask are you interested in somebody else? If you’ve had your head turned then that’s an indicator that things aren’t right.

@Getlostu

Why not counselling? You are effectively "counselling" her (as am I and everyone else) with your post, and we are all only doing it based only on one half of the story, and with no professional qualifications in the field.

Surely a counsellor, working with both of them, would be 1,000 times better?

When I read threads like these it's striking that it's always about the feelings - not feeling the same way any more, feeling care but not in love. And I don't know that you can easily manufacture feelings, but you always hear from posters who have been at that same point in their own relationship and thought about things, and made decisions to act differently; to put effort in, to actively nourish a relationship that seems to be escaping, and have brought it back again.

It just make me think that, as central as feelings are, they're not the be all and end all of love. Love can be a decision, behaviour, action, commitment when the feelings are a bit lost and sometimes these can help bring back the feels as well. But, I don't know that this works for everyone, I think for many it's hard to see beyond the feelings, or they have been so turned that there is confidence they can not be found or experienced again.

He's probably going about things the wrong way if he wants to hold onto the relationship - I imagine you find it a bit nauseating, his attempts to hold on. Perhaps if he worked on his own life, becoming more independent of you with his own interests and friends he would seem more attractive to you?

@AlwaysAboob
No great advice here just another one checking in feeling the same way and a very similar picture
I've been stuck in this for at least two years now and twice trying to separate but been persuaded to try again
Nothing is better in fact worse
We rub along fine no arguing and an easy life but no passion from him about anything
To PP talking about counselling I worry that I would just be giving lip service
I know my marriage is over and counselling won't help
I have the ick the intimacy in my relationship has gone and in reality I don't want it back
I just want to protect my kids, cause as little hurt as possible to everyone including him cos I actually do care deeply for my husband
I read threads on here women's only regrets is not leaving these kind of relationships earlier
I feel paralysed by fear
I wonder if it's an age thing too we are similar ages and I know so many women in the same boat around there 40s
Sorry not much help just know you are not alone
Xx

@Takethegirloutofscotland thank you for your message and sorry I'm slow to respond. Yes - everything you have said is exactly what i am feeling. Rubbing along fine generally, have a good laugh, genuinely care for him...but the 'ick' Can you ever go back from that?? I've even told him that has gone for me, but he still wants to try. I feel i need intimacy, just not with him.

My further worry on this is that we are getting older anyway, will i still crave that intimacy in 5 or 10 years. And I've ruined lives in the meantime.

I know it will destroy him if i go, and also the affect on the children one is which is currently under diagnosis for ASD. How damaging could a separation be? And is it better now, or waiting until they're older.

I sound weak but i just want to run away from it all.

I hope you find your own peace xx

@suggestionsplease1 thank you - this is where we are at the moment, he is asking me, and i know i owe it to him, to put that effort in more. But as it is i cannot bear to kiss, and reaching out to him does not feel comfortable. Cliche i know, but he feels like a best mate/brother.

We have agreed to get through lockdown, then start going out etc...something he was never really bothered about. He admits a lot of his faults (controlling, bossy, micro managing, taking things for granted, lack of interest in me - until now!) and i am more than aware of all of mine (many ).

Please can you try to overcome the ‘ick’. Your husband does sound like a good one despite the alpha male bit. The reason I say this is my partner walked out 5 years ago and although I am now in a relationship it took 4 years to find. There aren’t many men out there that would do the lions share of work, have banter and laughs with and generally get on with. Me looking in from the outside it just looks like a steady marriage going through a blip. Sometimes these blips can last a long time. Have you had your head turned at all or is this perhaps just a dry patch you are going through? Please don’t give up just yet. It’s a pretty cold place on the outside being a single parent. Be careful, think clearly and I would suggest no major changes until we are through this terrible and unreal situation that we all need to stick together to get through.

Can I just add to the 'this is me' voices. Married 13 years, together 18. Back in September I spoke to DH to tell him we needed help, I tried to talk to him several times until March this year when we started counselling... But for me it just confirmed I didn't want to try.

He's a good man, but emotionally he's shut down, he's never shown empathy or really engaged fully with me for several years and for large chunks of time when our children were very young, I did everything. Even before kids, I cleaned up after him, took responsibility for everything. So I guess it's been 10 years or more of respect and love bring worn away at. I too have the ick. He did try for a while, doing loads round the house, being romantic, kissing me etc.. Even thinking about that makes me shudder, but it just made it worse. We started sleeping separately at the start of lockdown, the relief was massive. I'd told him in counselling that I didn't want sex anymore, so that was a relief too.
I don't think there's any coming back from it, I think if there's no real discernable reason, then it could be hormonal, or stress or depression related... I ruled out all of that and it came down to resentment and then me having my head turned, which showed me the possibilities of a really loving relationship..... Not proud of it but it is now what it is, I can only make the best of the situation. He's gradually accepted it, although he's very sad he too agreed he hadn't been happy for around 5 years, which correlates with when I first started to feel that things weren't right. Telling is that he never once said anything about being unhappy. Once he'd got over the initial panic and 'trying' he started to understand that he'd been unhappy but could never put his finger on it. I know he loves me but when that realisation M as kes you feel suffocated or annoyed, then it's really bad.

I too struggle with feelings of my happiness not being a good enough reason, of thinking back to better times, looking at everything we will lose... But I am gradually, now the decision to split has been made (its been a month ) have started to feel excited about the future. I'm still really struggling with us being under the same roof, we are getting along fine now, because there's no pressure to kiss or cuddle, or to have a conversation. He's still in denial a bit, but getting there. We've discussed some practicalities, like changing the mortgage so I can pay it while he rents etc, but we are doing that gradually due to this lockdown, as nothing much can change yet. I think that is almost a good thing, as he's getting used to it all, but at the same time it's hard not to lose momentum and for things to just slip into this being the new normal.
If your DH is anything like mine, and he sounds a little, I have a huge sense of responsibility for him. He has no friends, doesn't socialise unless I organise it, doesn't talk to anyone. Is all at sea with the kids, struggles to relate to them... So the guilt on my side is massive.
But he deserves more, my kids deserve parents who respect and love each other, who are openly affectionate, not necessarily in love all the time, but loving. They might not get that, but with me being 43 and him 46, we are both young enough to meet someone new and for them to have a good example of a relationship growing up.
All of the peace I feel at my decision though has come after years of turmoil and on off feelings, I've read several books (I love you but I'm not in love with you, too good to leave too bad to stay) and I had 12 weeks of my own counselling and then 7 weeks of relate, with individual sessions within that.. I would say all that helped DH accept it, as after 3 sessions I just felt sure I couldn't keep stringing him along. He was devastated, but after having chance to talk it through with the counsellor, he did seem to understand.
It took me 5 years to get to this point though, my feelings are still mixed, some days I think, OK, I can do this, we can carry on like this... But it's just fear. I know we have a lot more horrible hurdles to get over, telling kids and family, him moving out, sorting contact etc...I'll probably still have doubts. But if we hadn't done the counselling, if I'd not done mine, I think I'd still be flailing about, changing my mind constantly. He's seen that we've tried that too, so hopefully he feels more at peace with it.

If the shoe were on the other foot and your DH felt this way about you and he wanted to leave, do you think he’d be dragging his heels or talking to people about it? Probably not, he’d just get going. You might need to do the same.

At the risk of being provocative, this is not all that different to what men spout during a midlife crisis, is it not?

“She’s a good mother, does the lion’s share of the work, but she’s also a bit of a nag (controlling) and she doesn’t make me think “phwoarr” any more. I don’t feel alive.”

I find it interesting that your roles in the family are somewhat reversed to the traditional set up. You’re the one who goes out and has lots of hobbies. He stays at home and does the chores.

I really do think you should have counselling. Right now it’s all on you. I honestly think marriage counselling will work stuff through and if you should separate your dh will have a good proper idea why it’s the best decision.
You have to coparent forever, see counselling as an important investment in that future. Right now it’s a case of you “walking out” and him being 100% against that. IF you do decide to split then it needs to be a bit more mutual if you’re going to have a positive coparenting relationship going forward.

My situation was the similar to yours. I was married to a lovely man and we had a little girl together. We had a nice, comfortable life and he is a great father. He did lots in the house, was supoortive and kind... Perfect really but i didn't love him and kost the physical attraction. I got so down it made me ill. I couldn't eat and was being sick. I eventually made the decision to leave. He was heart broken and begged me to stay. I stayed for a few more months but i didn't feel any different so after Christmas that year I rented a house nearby and left. I am going to be honest with you, it was horrible. He was so hurt, he became a man I didn't know and was vile to me. The divorce was horrible and even now, 6 years on, I still feel burden abd guilt for what I did. He is still on his own and i feel responsible for that. However, it did get better. Now, we get on well and are xo parenting effectively. We can laugh about things and are almost friends. Also, I am now married again to my soul mate. He is amazing and I am so in love with him. We have a beautiful house and 2 gorgeous sons together. I didn't think it was possible to be this happy and it scares me now to think of the life I would be missing out on had I not made the painful decision to leave.

@TossaCointoYerWitcher, I agree with you.
Sounds midlife crisis.

OP, have you considered counselling.

It's amazing to read this @AlwaysAboob as I'm in an almost identical situation.
I love him, he's a great dad, attentive and kind partner, but after 7 years I realised a couple of years ago I don't fancy him anymore and I'm not in love. 2 years on and I almost had an affair, which would have had dire consequences for everyone.
Luckily it didn't happen but now I'm stuck wondering if something like that eventually will if I don't leave.
I'm getting the lovebombing too after similar conversations. I don't want to hurt him but I worry that not being attracted to him and bored isn't a good enough reason to leave - and in all honesty I'm scared to as well. It's a huge life change.
I feel for you, it's an incredibly tough situation to make.
To help me make the decision I'm keeping a diary of how I feel, just a few notes daily, so after 6 months I can see if I'm mostly thinking about going or mostly thinking about staying and will have to go with that.