Stuck in the middle of Sis/BIL break up

[Tatat]

Wow how painful this all is- and a lot more complicated than this post but I would could write an essay!

Sis is my best friend (or so I thought) and I also love to pieces my now-ex BIL, with whom I also work. As families we have done lots together and we would have said that they were our best "couple" friends.

Sis left BIL after 8 years/2 kids, things just not working for her - no nastiness in relationship but she was desperately unhappy.

DH (who has become very good friends with BIL over the last 8 years too) and I have maintained from the start that we will try and keep out of it for as long as we can but have known that eventually there might come a deciding point where we have to make a choice about where our loyalties lie. I have been able to remain fairly close to both (less so to my dear sis, more through her distancing herself though than anything)
although DH hasn't really seen much of her but lots of BIL.

The rapidly souring situation between sis/bil is starting to come between dh and I now, if forced to choose between the two my loyalties will always lie with my sister no matter what I think of her situation or behaviour (within reason of course, no illegal/highly immoral activity going on though!)

I've tried to remain as unjudgemental as possible of either individual (I'm sure that both of them get enough of that from their other family and friends) but DH, being one of these "It's just not logical Jim" Mr. Spock sorts of men who only see things in black or white is totally siding with BIL. (Plus dh has had a rough time himself over the last year and so has really appreciated BIL's friendship)

We agreed a while ago that in matters of each others family, he would have the final say in how we dealt with his and I would have the final say for mine. (If there was a strong difference of opinion.) I guess I am really hurt that DH hasn't followed through with this, I fundamentally disagree with the way he has determined we should deal with a family matter in his close family but stepped back, and now he won't do the same for mine. I am shocked at how much I feel let down by him. Grrr! I suppose he just feels more strongly about this situation than I did about the previous one, but can't see how this is going to get resolved well.

Help!

Ok, stop take a step back and think that if you were in this situation and it was a friend and not your sister, how would you deal with it.
Whilst I do think that your dh is wrong to go back on his word with you, the fact that by standing by his friend means so much to him I am afraid this means that you are going to have redifine this and think things through again.
Good luck, I have got to say I would be devestated if I was in your situation, it must of been hard to see your sister leave her kids.

Lojomojo thats such a good point I suppose I'd been doing the black and white thinking I normally accuse dh of! i.e. I put my feelings aside about your family now you have to do it for me, full stop no discussion doesn't matter what the surrounding circumstances are.
Just panicking a bit about the hurt that this will cause my lovely sis

Yes it was hard seeing sis leave but they agreed she would take the children too (7 and 2) so they are fairly happily ensconced in a new house with their mum.

Sorry, I got the wrong end of the stick and thought your sis had left the kids. [eek]

Would it help to take a step back, focus on your relationship with your sister and let your dh have his friendship with BIL?
When you say that the two of you agreed that you would have the final say on your family, fair enough. But strictly speaking the BIL isn't your family any more, is he. He's ex your family.
I think with a bit of give and take that you can both maintain these relationships. Also, what would it say about your dh if he just turned his back on his friend? He sounds like a good, loyal person.
I would definitely avoid turning this into a power struggle in your marriage, neither of you is in the wrong here.
I wonder if you are pissed off about his family matter and that's spilling over?

Chocchip (mmmm! Ace name) maybe I'm naievely assuming we could have a relationship as a couple with either sis or BIL, and a bit more thought would reveal that this just isn't practical. Which makes me terribly sad as BIL is a really good friend and I would cry heaps!

I suppose I am a bit hurt about DH's lack of support in other areas over the last few years and this could be clouding my jusdgement a bit on this one- not specifically over his family gubbins but stuff more to do with just the two of us. Eg when I found it desperately hard going back to work ft after having ds, it made me really truly and honestly miserable, I had thought that I would be able to count on him to help resolve it ?don?t worry we?ll sort it out whatever. Even if I have to sell one of the 4 cars I own for fun.? that was the sort of response I would have bet on. But he didn?t, he just effectively said ?well we knew you?d have to work full time before ds was born. Stop moaning and get on with it.? Which was a slap in the face. But I?m 4 days a week now so I must have finally persuaded him although I can?t recall how!

Just off to get some chocolate chip biccies now

Oh My God I am in EXACTLY the same position. All the childcare is my responsibility, I work in the evenings, he knows this and still comes home late blah blah. Sounds like you want some bloody support and the BIL issue is all about that as well.
Presumably you will still see BIL at childrens birthdays etc.
I'm thinknig of getting that Babyproof your marriage book.

Yes its definitely all tangled up in the area of "support"- maybe when we have babies our brains get so focused on giving support (everyone wants a piece of my ass! DS, DH, cat, boss,) that the habit of receiving it for ourselves, not just in relation to childcare etc just gets fallen out of.

Or maybe dh's and dp's are just blimmin inconsiderate narrow minded selfish and thoughtless. As well as being lovely creatures whom we could not live without of course

That's mean of your dh, if he knows you need to get to work coming home late is most inconsiderate. Have you had to put your job on the back burner to arrange round childcare? If so it makes me mad that chaps can still get away with making our jobs seem less important. Ok so blimmin what if I am part time (well 34 hrs) and I am coasting along as I haven't got the energy or the wherewithall to be a go getting career gal?

Unlike my dh, I also wouldn't consider jacking it all in to go contracting knowing that my OH would have to take responisbility for all the pick ups/ drop offs/ bedtimes/wouldn't be able to ever work late and would basically need to be a clockwatcher. Because I don't think his job is any more/less important than mine.

Oooh it makes me mad mad mad!

Why can't you be friends with both of them?

Surely if your dh has a friend who just happens to be your sisters ex, that is OK?

I have told me sisters that if anything happens to their marriages I will always love my BIL's. I am the youngest of a large family & 2 of my BIL have been there since I was about 6!! Totally family!

I'm sorry for you, what a difficult situation you are in.

Has you sister specifically asked you to drop your relationship with BIL?

Faerie you're right, we've been trying terribly hard to maintain a relationship with both as a couple, but I suppose this isn't going to work when my loyalties lie with my sis (although my sympathy lies with ex BIL) and DH's lie with ex BIL.

Maybe I'm struggling with the idea of there not being a "them" and "us" any more, its now "us", "dh and BIL" and "sis and me" which is so sad. I also hope that my sis isn't too hurt by my dh's apparent betrayal (for want of a better word) and doesn't take it too personally- it's not about her, it's more about BIL.

And other posters are right I am quite proud of dh being such a loyal friend, it's just hard when it seems that he's making a judgement about my sister when being so loyal.

So do you propose to not speak to BIL anymore?

It seems such a waste of a friendship, especially when BIL will be missing his children

What happened?

Don't want to hijack your thread Tatat but since we are on the subject of inconsiderate men it's as if my DH just doesn't register that there's a baby in the house and I can't work and look after her at the same time. I work from home and need to start by seven in the evening to get my work done which I hardly ever do because he's late then he has to have his shower! Then he says it's 'only' fifteen minutes but that's not the point, it's all the time and it's the attitude it shows that my work isn't important even though we need both our incomes. Plus I think a lot of the time he's standing around gassing...

34 hours is not part time in my book!!!!

Can you both agree to your husband being friends with ex-bil, but the socialising can't happen in your house in case your sister pops over?

This way your husband could respect your family's feelings.

If he thinks just for a wee while about this he has to realise how you feel and why you have to take your sister's side.

Would he "side" with his sibling's ex if they suddenly broke up for whatever reason?

Faerie sorry I only get a chance to log on at work (dh loves his net nerding time at home so I don't get a chance!) so only just seen your message.
Sis hasn't asked me to stop being friends with BIL (blimey we could be teenagers talking like this ) but has said that she's really hurt by the fact we spend more time with him than her. This is partly to do with the fact that she is now involved in a new relationship and we'd both feel a bit uncomfortable about getting involved with them as a couple when things are still so raw, and partly to do with the fact that BIL has invited us over/suggested we meet up etc when she hasn't, so basically made it clear he still wants to maintain the friendship.

This bit about missing the children is a big one too, a couple of times when we've met up it's to take the children out somewhere/get them together to have play and I would really miss this too.

What happened is that there was another man, but sis maintains he was not the reason for the split just a symptom of her unhappiness. And I do believe her there, I know she'd felt very unhappy for a while and although she's still seeing him she isn't sure whether it's the right thing to do.

I'm not sure if I can be friends to both without my loyalties being torn, I feel a bit guilty about us seeing BIL a lot/being quite involved in his life when my sister is feeling poo about their break up. I feel like I'm judging her if I do continue the relationship - like "well you were the one to leave for no apparent reason other than you were bored of living with the man who you still maintain is the best friend you've ever had so I don't see why I should take your feelings into account, I'm just carrying on with what makes me happy" and that doesn't seem very nice of me as a sister.

Tatat, I think you're instinct is right on this. If it hurts your sister that you and DH are spending time with her ex then you probably should step back from exBIL for a while. She's your sister and obviously you are close, so yeah you owe her more than most people.

I think given the infidelity issue that it would be really, really unfair to ask your DH to discontinue his contact with exBIL. They are friends, your DH doesn't owe your sister what you do, and he is the one who was left for someone else and had his kids taken away from him.

I think the only thing you can ask of your DH is that he stop judging your sister. She's his family now and although what she did was destructive and hurtful, she's just a person doing her best and needs her family behind her. He has to find a way to support his friend without judging her.

That's what I would try and do. I feel for you. When marriages split it hurts a lot of people beyong the couple and their children. I'm sure if you just try to keep your head and steer a fair path through this in a few years things will look a lot simpler and hopefully you will still have relationships with all the people you care about.