When to give up with a friend with depression?

[plipplopploddy]

Sorry, this is going to be a bit of a moan really. I just need to get this off my chest.

I have a 'close' friend who has ongoing anxiety and depression, which she has treatment for but she is still up and down a lot of the time. When she is reasonably up she can be quite self-centred. She also seems to have no ability to say sorry so she'll forget to do something or cancel plans and there is never an apology.

When she is down, sometimes it's difficult at first to work out if she is just being self-centred or if she is actually really depressed. Then I try to be supportive and feel bad about not noticing more quickly that she was down, even though I know it's not my job to fix her and that I am not a mind reader. I know that she has suicidal thoughts sometimes, although I don't think she has ever planned to carry it through, and she also has few other friends, so when she is down I try to check in on her regularly and be a friendly listening ear.

I guess that i am a bit resentful of her because she is not a great friend to me even when she is having good days, and I'm tired of the amount of my headspace she takes up when she is down because I worry about her being ok. I want to be kind to her but I don't think if the situations were reversed she would be as kind to me. So my question is, when is it ok to step away from a friend with depression?

Has she always been like this? How did you become friends in the first place?

We became friends when we worked together but we don't work together anymore. She has always been quite self-absorbed, which I have put down to the anxiety but until about 6 months ago I was able to let the friendship drift occasionally when it got too much. Then she started to get really depressed (couldn't get out of bed, suicidal thoughts) and so I don't want to leave her unsupported. She is on ADs and sees a counsellor through her work so she is trying to help herself.

No advice OP but following with interest as I have a similar issue. I reflected the other day that we have been friends for 15 years and for a full decade of that 15 years the friendship has been totally one sided. She’s missed my engagement, my wedding, my hens, the births of both of my children etc with either depression or a toxic family situation she won’t remove herself from, or simply not feeling up to being able to celebrate someone else’s happiness when she is feeling low. I haven’t been able to talk to her about any of my relatively minor but still important issues. She has ruined numerous dinners, parties by getting drunk and causing a scene and I have to bundle her out into a taxi and home. At what point do you say enough is enough?

The short answer is to never give up on someone with depression.
Unless you've had it you can never understand how all consuming it is. And even then, it affects us all differently. There's no quick fix, it took me years to find my new normal.

The more nuanced answer is that if you feel you can't handle it, just gradually alter your friendship to someone in a shape you can handle. You can be the coffee friend, you don't have to be the friend that's always on the end of the phone.

Does that help?

anotherypassword it kind of helps but I'm not sure how I would get myself into the 'coffee friend position because I would feel guilty about not being more supportive. At the moment it kind of feels like it's an all or nothing situation. Also , bit of a drip feed maybe. I have been depressed in the past, which is why I've tried to be as supportive as possible. But a good friend cut me off completely during that time. It definitely didn't help my mental health when she did it but now I can completely understand why she did it as I was a nightmare to be around for a while.

So difficult...and I would expect to feel guilt regardless of what you do. You're not responsible for her, you can't lift her out of depression (even if it seems that way temporarily when you are together) and you need to look after yourself first. Always. Friendship is a two way street and if you start feeling like you are not being treated well then you need to back off.

Can I ask what you mean when you say give up?

You are not responsible for her well-being, so if you feel her situation is getting too much for you, you need to withdraw. Maybe not completely, but sufficient for you to be happy again.

You give up when it affects tour mental health. You draw back either completely or with boundaries.

Her self absorption isn't necessarily caused by her depression, it may be who she is. If it's affecting you then pull back.

And i appreciate that sounds heavy, I've been there myself and been ghosted. That's not pleasant, it does hurt but i get why it happened. You must look after yourself.

Be honest 'hi friend, I'm going to be offline and away for a while. I have to concentrate on my emotional and mental well being which isn't fantastic right now.'

Are you the only friend she has? What about her family?

It's not right that she is so dependent on your good nature like this. Her mental health is not your responsibility.

My dad is like this. I don’t know If it was the depression that changed him or he was like this anyway. Depression can make the person feel like they are the only one suffering and every thing is purposely against them.

Is she really a friend or is she someone you care for?

I disagree with people saying you can “never give up”. Rubbish. You can end a friendship for any reason you like, you arent obliged to be anyone’s therapist and friendship has to be a two way street. If it’s not, then you aren’t friends- you’re basically her carer.

Now, that said, of course if you love your friend you will make allowances for her and do your best to support her. However, you aren’t her emotional punching bag and if you find being friends with her has got to the point that it’s dragging you down and you literally dread spending time with her then it’s time to create some distance and boundaries. You can still be there for her, but limit the time you spend with her and challenge the constant negativity. Self pitying “poor you” conversation never ever helps people with chronic depression- it just emphasises their role as victim in their own cognition. Be supportive, kind, reflective and help her help herself. Empower her, rather than offer her constant pity which just reinforces helplessness. Have strict boundaries and limit the time you spend with her. Your mental health is JUST as important as hers and there may well be times when you are struggling with stuff and don’t have the emotional resources to give to her anymore. We are all human and we can only ever be responsible for our own mental health. Friendship should enrich your life, not drag you down into a place of further emotional turmoil.

I don't agree with the notion of 'never giving up' on someone with mental health problems. Of course its a noble, amazing thing to do, to be there unconditionally for someone. But not being able to be that altruistic doesn't mean you are a bad friend. You have only so much of yourself to give, as well as your own mental health to consider. It seems like the first person in a friendship to declare/make their MH problems known, always seems to be the one who is treated with kid gloves. The other person's tribulations and MH issues don't seem to matter as much because they aren't as vocal, or their problems don't disrupt the friendship as much.
It's often said on Mumsnet, to go 'no contact' with those friendships and relationships that are toxic (especially with perceived NPD.) NPD is a mental health problem, but for some reason it's a disorder that is perfectly okay to walk away from, whereas when someone is being flaky from anxiety, or snappy because of depression we as a society have to be available as good friends, our own mental wellbeing be damned.

I think if your friend is on AD and still having suicidal thoughts. You should be advising her to go back to the doctors. Medication obv needs changed. They should be giving her counselling.

Nobody can do this alone and I mean either going through it, or supporting them.

So ideally, rather than trying to support her by being there for her to talk to, you need to get her to the doctors or speak to her family.

Anyone having suicidal thoughts of feeling so low (regardless if you think she won't go through with it) needs professional help.

I have a friend who goes through depression and anxiety and when she's down, she can be hard to be with. But when she's fine, she's a loving, bubbly and fun person.

Your friend doesn't sound like a friend at all. She sounds like a drain and it isn't your responsibility to look after her. The relationship is completely one sided. You sound like a lovely and empathetic person but there comes a time when you have to look after yourself. You being anxious about her won't help your mental health.

So you can absolutely slowly pull away from this person until she is no longer your concern.

I would give up on her. Depression and anxiety or not, friendship should always be two-sided. There is no excuse for being self-absorbed and careless about others. Otherwise, it's not a friendship, it's a patient-carer relationship. If she wants that sort of relationship, there are therapists for that. It's not your responsibility to endure someone's selfishness just because they are mentally ill.

OP here. just came back to say thanks for all the comments. Yesterday I think I was just so tired of the whole situation but the replies have helped me put things into perspective.

When my friends or I are having depression, we tend to cut conversation down to just something very simple. So we'll decide on an emoji or a word, something that is personal to us and reflects our friendship and then we will just send one word or emoji to each other, to say I'm thinking of you. And the other person can just send the same back. Then it's like a little connection, but nothing complicated. It can be absolutely impossible sometimes with major depression to reply to the question, how are you, or face getting into a conversation.

I have a pretty non-existent relationship with one of my sisters for this reason.

It might sound selfish but I just couldn’t listen to her anymore! Especially when she essentially said her depression was worse than my cancer. 🙄

I just thought I can’t play illness top trumps with someone.

I don’t even know how much she suffers. She wears it as a badge of honour, to be frank. Tells all and sundry about it constantly...

She’s just exhausting. I used to leave conversations with her either completely drained or hurt at her lack of care toward me, my kids, what I was going through...

Depression is a selfish disease, yes. But some people are also just selfish!

And to be honest - I don’t think you have to stick by someone no matter what.

I think anyone can leave a situation for ANY reason. It doesn’t have to be a “good” one. It just has to be something you decide.

I have panic disorder and I'm more there for my friends then they are for me half the time. I saw my friend through a suicide watch as she has no family and a son and a few friends. It nearly knocked me over but I couldn't leave her. She had a breakdown.

My point is having mental health doesn't make you act like an arsehole. Being depressed doesn't naturally make you selfish or self absorbed.

Rather I think this is who your friend is and her personality. Some people are life sponges. If you want to help your friend, maybe point her in the direction of some services that might be able to help. I agree we can't fix everyone but I wouldn't drop my friend for mental health. But if they are just an arsehole then they might have depression on top of that. You don't have to help an arsehole xx