Do I overreact or is this normal DM behaviour?

[Blahblahblah299]

DM and I have a wonderful relationship to the outside world, behind closed doors I would consider us to be close in the physical sense that I see her daily and enjoy spending time with her but emotionally not at all. We are like chalk and cheese in personality (I'm mentioning this incase people think it's a case of personalities clashing etc) but just interested to see what people think or what their experiences are.
We clash immensely over parenting styles, she is a pushover basically, as a child I didn't particularly push the boundaries but if I did she was the type of parent who would take away a privilege then an hour later give it back because she felt bad. I'm not the complete opposite but I don't see how that helps a child learn from what they've done wrong!?
She has heavily been involved with my DS who is now 12 and I no longer can discipline him infront of her as she will undermine me, tell me I'm being unfair or whisper in his ear mum doesn't mean it, I'll get you the item she's taking away etc etc.
Most recently with my DD who is 6 months I feel like she thinks I'm stupid sometimes, she will regularly call me in the morning to say it's going to be hot/cold outside so please dress her in this/that like I'm not capable of seeing what the weather is like myself and making an informed choice on clothing 😂 I'd truly understand if I was the type of parent who dresses their child in a summer dress on a cold winters day like you do often see. But I'm always aware of how hot or cold it is and of course I bring layers or other clothing out with me incase things change. If I meet up with her I feel like she gives DD the once over and will correct something she doesn't like, ask why she isn't wearing a hat or taking a hat off and saying ooh it's too hot for that.
I know grandparents are softer with their grandchildren and I do try to make allowances for that but surely some of that behaviour is ott? She's said before that she thinks i should parent more like her. Do I sound like I'm just be oversensitive to her suggestions or is she overstepping the mark a little?

My mother is a bit like this - will tell me to give DS a drink just after I’ve given him one (8 months) she is coming from a loving place so I just let it go - I know she means well.

Overstepping the mark

I couldn't let it go if it were me. It's treating you like a child again. My mum does it sometimes although not in the same way and I hate it. It contributes to us not being close

I would be reducing the time I spend with her and I would also ask her directly if she thinks you're an idiot, every time she interferes. I would make it clear that her criticism and "advice" is not wanted and will not be entertained. If she won't treat you like an adult, she won't be seeing much of you. Time to create boundaries, op, for the sake of your sanity. I had to with my mother so I know exactly what bullshit you're dealing with.

She is overstepping massively. I think she is too involved in your life. You should be able to discipline your child however you wish and not have her comment.

As for the comments on how to dress the baby, I would point out to her every single time that you are capable of sorting that yourself and don't need to her to call.

No it's not normal. I think you need to start defending your choices.

Not normal and I think you need to stop living in each others' pockets. Why do you see someone daily who criticises you and undermines you?

I completely agree we spend too much time together, however it's become the norm so if I start spending less time with her it will be noticed and she'll want to know why.
Anytime I mention the above reasons as an explanation she denies it and normally refuses to engage in the conversation or will physically walk away until I give up. If she does listen she'll agree with what I say then continue to act in the same way so clearly just agreeing to shut me up.

See that mark there? >>>

She has stepped over it. She is treating you as though you are some sort of wilful adolescent who needs to be brought back into line. Time to get firm methinks.

I think its normal to a point. My mum and grandma both tell me im too strict, they also tell me that their mum told them exactly the same.
My mum was actually quite strict with us when i was little and now with my kids shes a total push over. My grandma is even worse 😂
I usually just ignore them and stick to my plan.
For example, the other day i took my mum grocery shopping with both my kids. They asked in the car if they can go to my mums afterwards and stay there for the morning. My mum said yes, so it was fine for me. In the car on the way home my older kid smacked the little one across the face for no reason at all. I told him he will come home with me. My mum was quite upset with me and kept telling DC not to worry because she wants him to come over and she kept telling me im punishing her too (they spend at least 2 half days per week with her).
I refused to back down and tool DC home. I dont care that my mum thinks its too strict and mean or whatever else she said. My child, my rules.
My mum did admit eventually that she probably would have done the same if it was me and my siblings in that situation.

Just try to stick to your parenting and values. I try to listen to my mums advice and then decide whether she might be right. Sometimes she gives me a better perspective and sometimes i just ignore it.

if I start spending less time with her it will be noticed and she'll want to know why.

So tell her why.

I'm a gran and I say she's vastly overstepping the mark.

@jeleste that's exactly the types of situations I have to deal with DM only I would give in instead of sticking to my guns just for a peaceful life.
I've many examples but one that sticks in my mind is one time I treated DS to Mcdonalds and we'd been arguing beforehand (something petty I can't remember) and because he was in a mood over it he refused to eat his meal and let it go cold and threw it away. I simply told him as punishment he wouldn't be having any takeaways for a week which he accepted.
Later on we went to visit DM and DS informed her of the whole situation. She reacted with oh don't worry we're getting takeaway tonight and told DS he could have some. When I reiterated that he wasn't allowed any for a week she huffed off to the kitchen. A few mins later, I overheard DM 'whispering' to DS that she would buy him Mcdonalds for lunch a couple days later (she looks after him while I work) consequently he had it for lunch while I was at work and therefore my discipline had no effect whatsoever.
It's just exhausting trying to discipline him when I get nowhere.

Ah that sucks. Luckily i have a very good relationship with my mum and even if she doesnt agree, she does accept my way of parenting and sticks to it mostly. Also she doesnt get upset or anything when i stick to it and she doesnt agree. She just keeps mumbling how mean i am.

Why is she doing child care when you know she undermines you? You need to sort an alternative.
And you need to tell her bluntly that if she undermines you then she doesn't see the children.

She can't undermine you like that, that's ridiculous. I think you'll have to talk to her about it. If she carries on after that, Molly is probably right you might have to do something else for childcare etc.

I think you need a polite word that if undermining continues, you have no option but to look at childminders as your parenting isn't respected and the consequence is your child is not learning respect. As for parenting her way, I'd be blunt and tell her she had her chance with you to do it her way. This is now your chance and you have no intention of doing it her way.

She’s not moved beyond seeing you as her possession. You need to decide what your boundaries are, if she walks away as you describe just let her. If she contradicts you unreasonably then tell her calmly that she’s out of order.
You also need to be as firm with your DS, or he’s going to behave towards you in the same way his GM does.
Be less available, concentrate on your children and husband. Put yourself and your needs to a more prominent position. I’d also find alternative childcare.

I would find alternative childcare as of now because your mother is not an emotionally healthy person to be at all around. If she is too difficult/batshit/cray cray for you to deal with, its the same deal for your son as well. Where are your boundaries with regards to this woman; they seem to be so low here as to be practically non existent. Not entirely your fault though in that respect because she has never really encouraged you to have any. She has basically trained you well to put your own needs and self last.

Would you have tolerated this from a friend?. No and your mother is no different.

I completely agree we spend too much time together, however it's become the norm so if I start spending less time with her it will be noticed and she'll want to know why

So just tell her why!
Tell her that YOU have enabled her to be a bloody interfering busybody in your life and her behavior is unacceptable.
Tell her YOU are no longer tolerating it.
Why on earth would you allow someone like that to look after your kids?
It's no wonder your son has no respect for you - she's been conditioning him.

You seriously need to stop living in her pocket.
If you're picking your son up from her house - it takes 2 minutes. No need to hang around having pointless discussions is there?
You can't really stop your son from going to her house, i think she's done too much damage there, but you CAN make sure she doesn't get to drive a wedge between you and your youngest.

if I start spending less time with her it will be noticed and she'll want to know why
So tell her.
Mum I am reducing the time I spend with you because you seem to think you can undermine my parenting.
I am no longer a child!
You had your DC and parented them as you wanted.
Now I'm doing the same with mine.
You either respect that or we can't spend as much time together any more.
I realise that sounds easy.
But you have to do it OP.
You can't continue like this.
Your poor DC, so many mixed messages!

You're all 100% right about finding alternative childcare for my youngest, which is something I am looking into despite DM protesting she doesn't want anyone else looking after DD.
I have been until recently a single parent, well still technically am to my eldest so I think that gives her extra power over me because I don't have anybody else to defend my parenting choices hence why I give in so easily. Interestingly enough she has never really gotten on with any of my partners...
@hellsbellsmelons you are completely right my poor DS doesn't know whether he's coming or going half the time. My biggest fear is that he'll grow into an adult thinking he can do no wrong as that's how she treats him, I just have to hope the input I have shows him that he has to be accountable for his actions.

Blahblah I’m not sure that you’ve got much self-confidence, your DC’s are important but so are you. Think about what you want.

Were you quite young when you had your first? Maybe you never had a chance to break out of the parent/child role. Probably not helped by you being a single parent, as you said.

You said that she told you to parent more like her - did you tell her that she doesn't need to 'parent' in the same way anymore?

@leghairdontcare yes I was 18 when i had DS, I have always appreciated her input in terms of helping me and advising me on things when he was younger and I adjusted to parenthood but this goes beyond that.
I'm not hard up but I don't have a lot of money to throw around so she gives DS pocket money but instead of sticking to a sum of money she slips him extra money here and there on the sly so that I dont notice but I know about it all. Because she does this he seems to think money grows on trees and I'm unable to make him see how to budget/earn money as a reward and he thinks I'm mean because I don't ply him with money like she does.
The more examples I keep thinking of the more I realise how big of an issue it is and I'm sick of keeping my mouth shut just to keep her happy when it's making me miserable.

Yes it really sounds like she sees your DS as her child and that's not healthy for any of you. I would pick a few areas that bother your the most and get some set phrases ready to combat them. Maybe start small and build your way up. So if she calls you to tell you it's cold and how to dress your daughter - just respond "i know how to dress my daughter appropriately for the weather. It's not your place to worry." Calmly challenge every time.