Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Think I am being done over...

44 replies

Whathewhatnow · 05/09/2019 16:39

Please can I have a sense check from people removed from my situation? I've name-changed but I am a long-time poster.

It’s the age-old thorny issue of splits of assets on separation ….Ex is proposing something that I feel is unfair. We are in the SE and for various reasons need to stay in the same area – the numbers below are big, but they are relative to where we live.

To outline the situation:

Together for 14 years. I instigated split. Two children who we are agreed we will share residency of exactly equally.
House in the SE that we cannot afford to keep, which we both agree should be sold to enable us to buy our own places – neither can afford to buy out the other’s equity, and neither wants one of us to rent a place, deferring the sale until later.
House has considerable equity if it sells for around its current value – around £500,000 of equity before fees.

Both employed full time now, although for around 2/3 of our relationship I’ve either been on a career break/ working part-time/ on maternity leave to enable me to care for children.
He has been FT employed throughout - his salary has therefore increased at a faster rate than mine, and he has also been paying into pension whereas my payments have been reduced. He had savings predating the relationship of around £170,000. 7 years ago we bought our first house. Shortly before the purchase, I inherited £100,000 and we both put exactly £100,000 in as house deposit, rest being made up by a joint mortgage. Legally, we are joint tenants. The sol’s agreement at the time was clear that if we sold during the relationship we would split the house proceeds equally. Some of his remaining £70,000 of savings have gone on monthly overspends, general household expenditure whilst I wasn’t earning at full whack, childcare costs, etc, during the course of the relationship. A large chunk has gone on home improvements. There is some cash left (not a great deal) in savings, and some sunk into a newish car (on which there is also a loan outstanding).

My proposal is for him to take the remaining savings and the car, and split the proceeds of the house sale, with me making some sort of adjustment in light of the fact that I have effectively used up some of his savings over the course of our relationship. I also thought he had agreed to make an adjustment in light of the fact that my pension has tanked but I know legally he does not have to do this at all, and now I am less sure that he will…

He is arguing that we should split our total assets after the house has sold, in direct proportion to the amount we both brought into the relationship. I.e., he had 63% of our total savings and I had 37%, therefore he should get the same proportion from the proceeds of the house sale and from the remaining savings.

This would leave him around £130,000 better off than me. We were explicit when buying the house that we were putting in the same amount as a deposit, and that is why we went for joint tenancy rather than tenants in common.

His position is that he “could claim that all his savings went into the house” and that we have been lucky because the house has gone up in value. It does not account for the fact that the savings were spent for our mutual, joint benefit.

I haven’t spoken to a lawyer yet, as I was hoping we could sort this all out amicably but we seem to have very different ideas of what is fair in this situation.

If you got to the end of that, thank you – and I will read and respond to all views even if they don’t gel with my own.

Even when it’s amicable, it’s not straightforward is it?

OP posts:
AcrossthePond55 · 06/09/2019 00:08

The thing is, and I'm in the US so not an expert in UK law by any means, I don't think a solicitor is going to be able to do much since you aren't married. But do see one, if only to clarify what UK law is and what a solicitor can or cannot do. I strongly believe in good legal advice and educating oneself on one's legal position. Even if that position is that you don't have one!

From what I understand, UK law doesn't grant any rights to a co-habitating partner, unlike here where there are 'palimony' laws. So I assume the division of joint assets is up to the partners to work out on their own. But if an asset is in a sole name, that asset is untouchable by the other person, period. The house excepted of course, because you are joint owners so that's 50/50.

I think it's lovely of you to want to take the moral high ground, I admire you. But that high ground doesn't put food in the belly or clothes on the back. You have children and your future to think of. And although he may have been in the better financial situation when you first started living together, you have made significant 'in kind' contributions like 'home-keeping' and all that entails, childcare, and I'm sure other things. He advanced in his career because you made it possible for him to do so. If you had not put your career on hold, even for a few years, he would have had to pay for those things. So don't think that your time as a SAHM has no value, it does. And I say this as a woman who has always worked full time, so I don't have a bias here.

He's already behaving like a shit, trying to get you to agree to less than your fair share and saying that he 'could claim all his savings went into the house' so he could try and claim more. (He can't since you aren't married, but him saying that IS a good reason to confirm it with a solicitor) But obviously he's willing to lie to get more than his fair share. So why should you sacrifice when it's so obvious that he is only thinking of himself?

I'm not saying to screw him over. Not at all. Just that I don't see why you should take less than 50% of joint assets. I certainly would.

But if you'd feel better giving him the car and then dividing the rest 50/50, fine. He gets the car AND the car payment. But the rest should be 50/50. Don't short yourself. And don't trust him one inch. You are no longer a couple, no longer 'partners'. Your, and his, loyalty is only to yourselves now. And to the children, of course.

Soozikinzii · 06/09/2019 00:14

As others have said see a solicitor- now

timeisnotaline · 06/09/2019 00:17

50/50. He didn’t contribute more. If he thinks it was a financial transaction I’d suggest he back pays me for x years of full time 24 hour nanny, and the house project management (or actual Reno work). At a discount for the children’s sake id ignore the night nanny bit, ask for 40k per year at home plus 10-20 for the renovating? Sounds like minimum 90k. As a gesture of goodwill could he transfer before you approve house sale, thanks bye.

Whathewhatnow · 06/09/2019 01:13

Acrossthepond55 thank you for your post. The law is different here as you say: no palimony.

Off to find a solicitor. I also agree good legal advice is worth paying for. I was just so, so hoping to avoid it. But I guess if we were both completely reasonable we would provablt not be separating in the first place!

Anyhow. I made the poijt that I would not be giving up the 50% interest in the house and pointed out that legally half the assets were mine. I needed him to know I wont just roll over, and that a sol will tell him the same in all probability but will charge him £££. Also made the point about the children ulitmately standing to lose out from living in a 1 bed flat for my half of the week.....whilst he would be able to afford more on his preferred method.
I hope it will sink in, that I am not to be walked all over.
Onwarss and upwards. Will update after lawyer consultation.

OP posts:
Whathewhatnow · 06/09/2019 01:14

Apols for the typos. Myopia and phone keyboard combo not good.

OP posts:
Whathewhatnow · 06/09/2019 01:17

Oh incidentally I mentioned something about posting here and getting unanimous responses. Conclusion: bunch o' man haterrrrrrzzz. Right you are....

OP posts:
EileenAlanna · 06/09/2019 11:41

lol point out to him that many, many of these "man haters" on MN are solicitors & happy to give a bit of free legal opinion to help out a sister.

RolyWatts · 06/09/2019 12:36

If you don't want all of your equity to be eaten up in solicitors fees see an all issues mediator. Much cheaper.

RandomMess · 06/09/2019 12:37

I would put on writing:

The house is legally 50:50 you fully understood that when we bought it as the solicitor was clear with us both at the time.

In the x years together we have both contributed equally. I have forsaken promotion and pension contributions to look after the DC as we agreed. A nanny plus a housekeeper would have cost £40k per year (I think this would only cover a part time housekeeper/cleaner as nanny is so much gross).

We have been together a long time and our DC deserve a good home with both parents.

Whathewhatnow · 06/09/2019 12:51

I know, EileenAlanna... I sense that he sensed he had lost ground when he came out with the haterz comment. I laughed!

Roly, an all-issues mediator sounds like the way to go if he doesn't fold. Will they tell us what to do/ what is fair or will they play the counsellor role and try to guide us to come to our own decision?

RandomMess there have already been emails and I am keeping 'em. He is now trying to imply this was my proposal all along. Which frankly is quite bizarre but in keeping with his previous. H....

Happily I also found the email minuting what we agreed when we bought the house from 2011. I knew my email hoarding would come good at some point.... Wink

OP posts:
RolyWatts · 06/09/2019 12:59

An all issues mediator will have some legal knowledge. It is best to have at least one meeting with a solicitor pre-mediator to get an idea of your legal rights.

They will be able to give some general advice but will remain neutral as to the decisions made. If you are both committed to the process it will work out cheaper and be better for the kids.

RandomMess · 06/09/2019 13:12

Hurrah for emailing hoarding!

Whathewhatnow · 06/09/2019 17:27

Yes hurray. Title deeds are also very clear. I got a copy today.

OP posts:
Whathewhatnow · 09/09/2019 14:39

He's conceded to 50/50 + pension adjudlstment. And continues to maintain that his proposal was actually mine. Bizarre.

OP posts:
RandomMess · 09/09/2019 15:35

😂

If ever you doubted ending it...

AcrossthePond55 · 09/09/2019 16:11

Good! And ignore his comment. He's trying to guilt you by making you think you've reneged on some supposed promise in hopes you'll cave. As if!

EileenAlanna · 09/09/2019 19:31

Good outcome op. Glad you've managed to resolve it now Flowers

Whathewhatnow · 09/09/2019 20:11

@RandomMess, yes, 1000x yes. Even my ultra-traditoonal parents have reached this conclusion now. Amen!
@AcrossthePond55 oh, I am. Absolutely.
@EileenAlanna thank you Flowers

OP posts:
billy1966 · 09/09/2019 21:01

Good for you OP👍👏

New posts on this thread. Refresh page
Swipe left for the next trending thread