Dh with ptsd has been drinking this weekend and we quarreled

[Flyingfish2019]

Just need to rant. My dh has ptsd. He does not really drink a lot but I am unhappy he drinks at all, because I think we shouldn’t.
This weekend he had his buddy staying here and they stayed awake and drank until the early morning hours. The started joyfully shouting and I woke up. They were in high spirits, but I got mad at them and told them to stop drinking hey were really, really drunk. We quarreled.
Dh told me he sometimes needs to drink in order to relax (because of having ptsd) and his friend even agreed with him.
Next night hubby did not sleep well and as a result I did not sleep well and I have a thousand to-dos this week.
Just learned about some of the to-dos this weekend.

I can't believe how many people think it's absolutely fine that he woke OP in the night by drunkenly shouting. Nobody should have to put up with that kind of selfishness.

@Vasya exactly this!

@MrsKittyFane1
Yes I know from personal experience that people with PTSD have a higher risk of alcohol dependency. I said that in my first post before you decided to quote a rehab page directed towards addicts.

But you are wrong to assume that any alcohol is “lethal to those with MH problems” and that just touching the stuff will result in a drink problem.

Her DH is consuming on average 8-16 units alcohol a week...which is well below the 21 units recommended by NHS for a man. There is zero evidence that he is going to have a drink problem.

Acting like a person with PTSD cannot drink responsibly is infantilising us. We are not all doomed to become drunks.

@vasya
I’m only not concerned with him waking her up because it sounded like a one off or rare occurrence. I think OP was right to ask them to quiet down and stop drinking for the night. To me that is a non-issue.

It’s her other ideas that I do not agree with- banning him from drinking any alcohol, controlling his bed time, lack of acommodation and understanding of PTSD.

I can't believe how many people think it's absolutely fine that he woke OP in the night by drunkenly shouting. This!

No, it is not a rare occurrence that he is waking me up but typically it is not because he is drunkenly shouting.
He often wakes up yelling when he had a nightmare which is not his fault of course.
He often is awake at night and I often wake up because of this. I am a light sleeper.
When he wakes from a nightmare, he often drinks (often not much but he drinks) and I make him go back to bed and help him go to sleep. I am quite stressed by this and worried.

Angelasashes
Am I to assume that your 'personal experience' Top trumps mine?
Think what you like.

OP you need to separate out what your actual issue is here.

A one off getting a bit loud with a mate he hasn’t seen in a while - all right, not ideal, and deserving of asking him to keep it down.

Seeming to disapprove of any drinking at all - this is not something you can police, his drinking levels are well within the NHS recommended for a man.

Forcing him to go to bed as you seem to think it will ‘solve’ his PTSD - utterly bizarre. I don’t have PTSD but when I wake up from a nightmare feeling shit I sometimes get stuck in a spiral of depressive thoughts. The only thing that helps is getting up and occupying my mind with something else to calm down. If someone tried to force me to lie in bed with nothing to distract me from feeling utterly shit that would be the worst thing!

Stop doing what YOU think is the best thing for him and start listening to what HE needs.

I get it’s frustrating when people don’t always do the most healthy thing (not meditating, drinking coffee etc); but you are honestly treating him like a child and that’s not healthy either.

The suggested limit for men is 14 units not 21.

@ghost
Units is 14 for women, and 21 for men.
“It is recommended that women do not exceed 2-3 alcohol units per day or 14 units per week and that men do not exceed 3-4 units per day or 21 units per week. Additionally, everyone should have at least 2 alcohol-free days per week. Regularly exceeding these limits will increase the chance of harm as a result of drinking alcohol.”
NHS
www.nhstayside.scot.nhs.uk/OurServicesA-Z/AlcoholBriefIntervention/PROD_209584/index.htm

Angela May be different in Scotland, but it's 14 for men and women in England and Wales.

" To keep health risks from alcohol to a low level if you drink most weeks:

men and women are advised not to drink more than 14 units a week on a regular basis 
spread your drinking over 3 or more days if you regularly drink as much as 14 units a week
if you want to cut down, try to have several drink-free days each week"

www.nhs.uk/live-well/alcohol-support/calculating-alcohol-units/

Think Scotland have now followed suit:

www.alcoholpolicy.net/2019/03/count-14-nhs-scotland-guideline-campaign-debate-on-the-future-of-risk-communication.html

@MrsKittyFane1
“Am I to assume that your 'personal experience' Top trumps mine?
Think what you like.”
That’s a bit harsh. I was merely saying that many people with PTSD can safely drink alcohol in moderation. This was in response to your posting that alcohol is “lethal” to people with MH issues including PTSD and quoting a rehab page. Which is to me an exaggeration.

I don’t know if your personal experience trumps my personal experience or vice versa. Nor did I imply any such thing. I just said that I have personal experience that is relevant to the OPs DH who has military service related PTSD.

My personal experience consists of 20yrs military service which spanned numerous conflicts (Iraq, Afghanistan, etc). I commanded active duty service members for worldwide contingency & humanitarian operations. Over my career I commanded around a thousand different people. Many of them developed PTSD (myself included). Some of them committed suicide. Some fell into addictions. Some coped well.

To me, your blanket statement lacked the nuance of reality. It was too extreme.. alcohol is not always a problem for people with PTSD like you were implying. There is higher risk as I have said from the outset. But it’s not “lethal” and a person drinking well below the units recommended by the NHS certainly doesn’t warrant you giving their DP a link to a rehab site for alcohol dependency!

@ghostofharrenhal
Thank you did not know it was changing. The OPs DH is still within that as he drinks between 8-16 per week, so on average would still be below 14 per week. Strange they did not lower the limits for women. With smaller body size alcohol has more effect.

Actually I am not forcing him to go to bed. Sometimes I tell him that it is late at night and he needs to be working the next day. Yes, I make him go to bed, but I am not forcing him. How could I force him to go to bed anyway? More often however I just help him go to bed. I told you he hates feeling drowsy but of course you feel drowsy before you go to sleep. So I am basically telling him that it is okay, that I watch the surrounding and he can go to sleep. Of course I go to sleep too once he is asleep and he knows it but he hates the feeling of having to go to sleep if he is the only one awake. It feels wrong and dangerous to him. Progressive muscle relaxation helps him go to sleep and but it also makes him feel vulnerable so that he can only do it if someone else is awake. I do not do anything special, but I need to be awake.
When he is the only one awake and had a bad dream he feels akarmed and watchful and I think that alcohol makes this feeling go away without making him feel to drowsy.
He needs to get up early in the morning and needs to be fit while working. I am very worried because he gets so little sleep.
I ask him if he wants to talk about his bad dreams or how they make him feel with me but he never wants to. He just says it’s not important, it was just a dream. But what I know is that he often dreams about his loved ones dying because he paid not enough attention. Then he has to get up, check if everybody is okay, check if all the surroundings are safe and he feels quite nuts for having to do this but the feeling that world has suddenly become unsafe stays with him and then he drinks.
He told me that when he has a bad night and he wakes up he often feels like everybody he knows and cares about is going to die that day. He knows that is just a feeling but he cannot shake it off. Than he drinks a lot of coffee, because it makes him feel alert and alert feels safe for him and tries to think of other things and after a while the world feels much safer
This is by the way another reason for him needing to get enough sleep, the world sometimes feels unsafe to him... when he is feeling drowsy... especially when he is not alert. So he needs to get enough sleep.
I actually hate having to baby him but what else should I do?

@ghostofharrenhal: So he typically has several drink free days a week. By typically drinks one or two bottles a week, rarely three. Sometimes he drinks as little as one glas when he had a bad dream, sometimes he drinks a whole bottle, sometimes he doesn’t drink at all.

@AngelasAshes I did not want to say people with ptsd cannot possibility drink alcohol safely. If a person with ptsd drinks a glas of wine because he thinks that specific wine goes well with salmon I am not worried at all. It is because he drinks when he had a bad dream. In order to forget about the dream... and he drinks in order to relax.... and he stays up the whole night.
Maybe I am overly careful but I think that those are bad reasons to drink.

Flyingfish2019 He may not be drinking huge amounts (though three bottles may be a bit much as that's about 28 - 30 units unless it's very low strength wine) but I can see why you might be concerned as it's the way he is using alcohol rather than the amount.

@ghostofharrenhal Exactly this. I hate the way he uses alcohol.
I think it is normal strength wine.

OP, I send you my sympathies, I’ve been where you are and it got to the point I had to let go to save my own mental health.
You cannot help him by babying him, making his choices for him. He has to do that on his own. Even if he gets treatment PTSD is cyclic and he will have relapses.

EMDR therapy via combat stress (amongst other therapies) might be worth looking into, when he is ready.

For what it's worth OP I agree with you. Drinking especially PTSD is a sign of escapism. I understand your concern. Hope he can find other ways to help with his issues.

One key thing to remember... To someone with PTSD, sleep is not their friend. They do not enjoy it or look forward to it.

Sleep was when I relived everything the most so I avoided it as much as poss. I would have to physically exhaust myself either through work, exercise or just not sleeping for a few nights before I could get sleep.

Imagine hating the thing that we all need to stay sane and healthy.

Just recalling this makes me feel so fortunate that I was eventually successfully treated.

Alcohol and PTSD don't mix too well, but the problem is that it is an easily accessible drug which does initially relax and numb the feelings. That's the reason why lots of people turn to it. As someone else said previously, try to persuade him to reach out to Combat Stress if you are in the UK. They can and do turn people's lives around.

Good luck.

RLD.

Thanks everybody. I know he doesn’t enjoy sleeping. I just hoped would find better ways to combat that.
We quarreled again. The background story: Dh bought a lot of Sherry at the beginning of November and I told him “Well okay... but that’s enough“... and we agreed on that... only weeks later he ordered lots of Sherry again in a Black Friday deal. I am really a bit pissed off. Why do we need so much Sherry? I mean it doesn’t turn bad, we can put it in the cellar but why so much of it? (Also I think there must be something wrong with it or they wouldn’t be selling it at a reduced price, they never do with things that can be stored and do not go out of fashion).

Dh has been saying some depressive things lately... basically that he feels like his work is a war... and that it feels like everything is a war... that is how it feels to him. Sometimes. But then he assures me he is fine again and seems to be very happy and content.