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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

How would you write this letter to ex regarding contact?

21 replies

Mom2K · 10/07/2019 02:32

Hi all...my ex is trying to get the kids to fly out and see him where he lives. They don't want to get on the plane alone but he can't afford to fly with them. I ended up asking a lawyer and was told that actually given his mental health issues, lack of contact, and safety concerns that they shouldn't be going at all. I have never before put in writing to him the concerns (it's mostly been verbal) so I am thinking of sending the following letter the next time he emails. It is long though - does anyone have any suggestions for a rewrite to get the points across but make it more concise? I have a problem with keeping things short :(

Any help is greatly appreciated!

Hi X,

When we spoke on the phone on June 11th and you mentioned wanting to bring the kids to _ this summer, I told you that I would speak to the kids regarding going…but I also voiced concern about them going at all, due to several safety incidents that have occurred within the past 5 years while the children have been in your care (and incidents prior to that as well).

These include but are not limited to:
-Tethering yourself to the kids before looking over the edge of a cliff in _ last summer, and continuing to do so even when they told you that wasn’t safe.
-Taking the kids bike riding at the park and both of them falling down a steep hill and getting injured. You told me the kids got hurt, but you didn’t share the extent. The kids told me after that they were both crying but that you didn’t help DS because you were carrying DD because you thought she “might have internal bleeding.”

  • Taking them outside to play in – 40 weather and blaming their feet hurting on their footwear rather than the irresponsibility of taking them outside in those weather conditions, and also when you had been informed prior to the visit that the kids were sick.
-The kids telling me that your uncle made them feel uncomfortable because he kept teasing them and trying to open bedroom and bathroom doors while the kids were privately occupying these spaces. I sent you an email sharing this with you and asking you not to let the children be alone with him (which you ignored) and then the kids told me the following summer that you allowed them to ride on a motorcycle alone with that uncle.
  • Texting me last summer that if I couldn’t bring the kids to you in (place he used to live) that you would “send an Uber to get them”. There have been multiple cases of people being assaulted in Ubers and yet you would be willing to let the children go in one alone.

When voicing my concerns to you – you said that if they were to come to you this summer that you wouldn’t force them to do anything they are uncomfortable with…yet here you are showing that this isn’t true since you are pushing them to get on a plane without you.

There is also the fact that in the past 5 years, you have cancelled more than 50% of all the access you claimed to want to have – frequently stating that you were “too sick” to come, and even after you moved (without giving me any advance notice that you were leaving) – you had one conversation with the children at the beginning of October – and then you didn’t make any direct contact with them again until the end of January. We just went through another 6 week period between April 11th – June 30th where you did not phone the kids because you were sick (and again last week on July 2nd you did not call on what you insist is the designated time. You called Wednesday evening while we were at church – the kids called you back and left a message, and again you didn’t return their call). There have been times the kids have phoned and/or left messages for you and you have refused to take their calls or give them a call back. On Monday March 11th at 4:30 p.m. when the kids called you we could hear your mom telling you that the kids were on the phone and even offering to bring the phone down to the basement to you so you could talk to them but you refused because you were sick/sleeping.
You have now confirmed to both me and the children that you have clinical depression. You have been living with your parents for several months and you do not yet have a job. I also asked you on the phone whether or not you were receiving any help/treatment for your sexual addiction and you said “that’s irrelevant.” I feel that it is very relevant. Your sex addiction causes you to stay up all night and sleep all day – it has caused you on multiple occasions within our relationship where you would disappear for several days without me knowing where you were or if you were ok, and has caused you to make very poor calls in judgement where you have behaved in ways that are risky/borderline illegal such as sitting outside of the hospital High Risk building to video pregnant women (as outlined in your journal entries). I feel it contributes to your depression, impacts your overall judgement and ability to provide proper care for the kids.
So given all of the above and that your move to your parents does not appear to have improved your situation – I’m not sure that it is in the children’s best interest to be going until there is some level of improvement and you can actually share what is going on with your treatment/progress. I find it very concerning that you don’t think your sex addiction and the type of behaviour that has resulted in, is something that needs to be addressed.

OP posts:
Tavannach · 10/07/2019 02:51

The lawyer should be writing the letter. Yours is way too long and far too detailed.
If it was me I'd say something like

"Hi ex

Thanks for your email.

I'm sorry to disappoint you but given your health issues, lack of contact, and safety concerns the children will not be holidaying with you.

I am sure you unstand that I must put the children's welfare first.

Best wishes

Mom

Tavannach · 10/07/2019 02:53

understand

DPotter · 10/07/2019 02:57

I agree way, way too long.
Keep it short and too the point - Tavannach's suggestion is good.
Also would change the 'Hi' and 'best wishes"- too informal, too chatty, nicey nicey. Either Dear Ex, or just Ex, and just sign off Mom2k, no best wishes, kind regards

Mom2K · 10/07/2019 03:05

The lawyer isn't sending the letter for me because I haven't retained him...i have only paid to consult with him a few times but will need to get legal aid to get his representation if we actually go to court at any point.

I figured it was way too detailed but wasn't sure what I should say. I have multiple emails from him demanding contact (even though he never follows through) but no responses from me (just a detailed log that I keep) because responding to him causes me anxiety

OP posts:
Mom2K · 10/07/2019 03:12

Also not to drip feed but I had already sent him an email (before speaking to the lawyer) that said the kids would go if he was going to fly with them. So now I'm a bit concerned about it looking like I am now making excuses

OP posts:
AcrossthePond55 · 10/07/2019 03:12

I think you're just giving him a huge load of ammo to argue with you about why your concerns are meaningless and they they should go and/or accuse you of attacking him. If you have already told him these things verbally and he doesn't take them to heart, putting them in writing isn't going to make him accept them and agree with you. In fact, a good general rule is "never put anything in writing".

Can you just simply say "I've given it a great deal of thought and have decided that it would not be in the children's best interests to fly to XX to see you"?

If you feel you must justify your decision you could say "I've given it a great deal of thought and considering past incidences have decided, etc, etc". If you want to 'soften the blow' you could say "to see you at this time".

But I wouldn't send the letter you've drafted at all.

Mom2K · 10/07/2019 03:27

Thanks guys, I am already finding this very helpful.

Would it be a good idea to just maintain the position that the kids aren't comfortable flying alone and that I am not going to force them and leave it there? Let the lawyer deal with the other concerns if he pushes it to court?

OP posts:
Tavannach · 10/07/2019 03:30

Would it be a good idea to just maintain the position that the kids aren't comfortable flying alone and that I am not going to force them and leave it there? Let the lawyer deal with the other concerns if he pushes it to court?

I think so, but I actually think AcrossthePond55's suggestion is even better.

ColdAndSad · 10/07/2019 06:16

Would it be a good idea to just maintain the position that the kids aren't comfortable flying alone and that I am not going to force them and leave it there?

The problem with that approach is that it leaves him room to say that he will come and collect them, so they won't be flying alone. And then you have to tell him the rest of your reasoning.

I'd go with Tavennach's script.

JustmeandtheKIDS2 · 10/07/2019 06:40

Don't be afraid or swayed by the threat of taking you to court. Tbh your conserns sounds very similar to a lot of mine with my ex, he constantly threatens me with court, even though we have already been multiple times and it's not gone well him! How old are the children? Remember the facts , he has money, doesn't keep to seeing the kids etc etc, he's depressed. He probably isn't going to bother taking you to court!
Keep it short and sweet, don't try to reason with him as your then making it too personal. I wonder if I would use the solicitor to write a letter to him and leave it at that that might be enough to stop him asking.

altogirl · 10/07/2019 07:04

Good lord, please don't allow him unsupervised access to your children! He might kill one of them! (The cliff incident). My ex was somewhat like this. He held my four year old's head underwater in her wading pool. If my sister hadn't walked outside to check on the kids, she might have drowned. Do whatever you need to do to keep him away from them. There is something deeply wrong with him.

justilou1 · 10/07/2019 07:09

Don’t make it simply your choice in the letter. “The children and I have given it much thought and WE have decided... etc....”

Mom2K · 10/07/2019 12:01

Kids are 11 and 12 (Dd will be 13 end of this year).

I wonder how long this situation would be like this? I spoke to this lawyer about supervised access before (when ex still lived here) and he had said that if we implemented it, it would only be for a few months. If he had begun to show consistency with his visits it would have gone back to normal. So I'm wondering what the parameters would be before they'd be allowed to go visit him especially since he lives with his mother (when they've gone in the past they spens majority of the time with her)

OP posts:
Mom2K · 10/07/2019 12:03

altogirl does your ex now have supervised access?

OP posts:
Mom2K · 10/07/2019 12:08

Justmeandthekids2 I don't think he would take me to court but it's a little uncertain with him living with his parents. His mom is the one obsessed with trying to have contact and keeps pushing him to do so...so maybe because of her he would. He did actually see a lawyer who emailed me a latetter recently. It just said that ue has asked her to resolve the issues he is having regarding contact but didn't outline what the issues are or specify how they would like to move forward so I haven't responded.

My lawyer said it is just a demand letter to try and bully me. I dont think my ex has actually retained this person to take action at this point.

OP posts:
averythinline · 10/07/2019 12:16

Just send teh msg saying no...
If he does od court then tyou have evidence that it is not in dc best interest... grey rock the rest...I woudl not be sending my dc to anyone so reckless, I'm not sure why you didnt say no in the first place...maybe you shoudl think about getting some suport to be more assertive- maybe have a look at the womans aid freedom programme....

If he takes it to court they will proabably ask the DC - however they would also expect him to make some effort before with contact so it is unlikely to be happen before this summer..
you can say he could come and see them ? why do they have to go to him .

AcrossthePond55 · 10/07/2019 13:12

I don't think I'd say the children had any part of the actual decision. It gives him room to try and coerce them or say you're trying to alienate them. If push comes to shove you may have to say they don't want to go but I wouldn't lead with that.

justilou1 · 10/07/2019 15:26

Aren't the kids old enough to make that choice themselves anyway?

Summertimeatthebeach · 10/07/2019 15:36

Hi ex, unfortunately the dc don't want to travel and I am happy to support their decision.
Regards op
Listing his million faults as a df will just aggravate him unnecessarily imo.
They are old enough to decide and you do need to back them given your details above.
He isn't a parent really. More a reckless associate..

Tavannach · 10/07/2019 23:23

His mom is the one obsessed with trying to have contact and keeps pushing him to do so...so maybe because of her he would.

Couldn't you look into the possibility of offering her some kind of formal contact? Ask your lawyer or women's charities. (I'm guessing you're in the US). She is their grandmother after all. Perhaps if she came to stay nearby and visited over a weekend 3 or 4 times a year. I'd definitely find out the legal position on this first, though.

justilou1 · 10/07/2019 23:27

I probably wouldn’t give her access to the kids, as she may be in denial about how dangerous her son’s behaviour with his kids has been. I would maybe suggest that she is welcome to stay nearby and visit them (with supervision) any time that suits OP, but not send them away and leave them vulnerable.

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