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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Setting boundaries with my stepmother (long, I'm sorry)

18 replies

JustGettingStarted · 08/04/2019 19:17

Regarding Stepmother: she and my father got together when I was in my 30's, shortly after my mother's death, and shortly before I got married and moved to England (they're in the US). Over the years, she has been rather nasty to me on a few occasions via emails, but I haven't seen her in person since my wedding 13 years ago.

I was away on a business trip last week. Just after midnight, my husband called me to say that I needed to call my Stepmother because she had called and woken him and asked for me but wouldn't tell him why. Just refused to say anything other than that I needed to call. So, of course I called her (even though this costs about eleventy pounds per minute on my mobile phone). She answered and said, "Mutton, I'm sorry but your father is declining fast."

I thought she meant, like, he was on life support and his vitals were getting lower or something like that so I asked what was going on and she said, "I don't know how to tell you this.... sigh... but your father needs to come live with you in England so you can take care of him."

I asked her what was going on and she said that he's been having issues driving and had had a couple of falls. Then she said "and of course your bother is useless and I have arthritis and I'm old so you have to take care of him." (My brother has addiction and mental health issues.)

I did NOT freak out on her for waking my husband up and scaring the shit out of him, waking me up and scaring the shit out of me, calling my brother useless. I was perfectly calm and I swear I kept my tone kind and reasonable. I did say that I didn't think he could legally come live in the UK but that I would talk to my husband and get back to them. I called husband and we both googled and, yeah, it's incredibly unlikely that he can legally move to the UK. I called back and my dad answered. I asked him to call me back on the hotel landline number. We were going over the long international phone number, reading it back to one another to make sure he got it right and she was in the background crabbing "she just said 287 and last time she said 827" so we went over it again and I said, "yeah, OK - you got it right." And she went "Well, that's not what she said the first time" and he said something like "...could you not..." and I said, "yeah could she not? Because that sort of shit isn't helpful at 12:30am."

OK, I was wrong to do that. I wasn't really aware that she could hear me but duh - she heard me say the phone number the first time so of course she could. Anyway, when we reconnected I was trying to explain to him that, unfortunately, he would be unlikely to satisfy the visa requirements for a dependent parent - you have to prove that A) you can financially support them and B) you can't afford to get them care in their home county. (For this reason, it is extremely rare for these visas to be granted.)

I wanted to understand what the fuck was going on. Why did she want him to go live in England rather than, say, an assisted living facility. Was everything OK between them? He assured me all was well. Then he said, "Listen, could you apologise to Stepmother? You really hurt her feelings?"

I handled it wrong, I said, "Honestly, not at this moment, no. She calls in the middle of the night, makes me think you're dying, calls my brother useless, and I'm not feeling contrite at the moment. Probably, later, I will but I'm not feeling apologetic in this moment."

I tried to continue to talk to him about what was going on - I pointed out that, from the UK government's POV, he could afford care. He conceded that he would probably need to move into a facility. I said, "You know, it doesn't mean some place that smells of pee where they just wheel you out to stare at the wall every afternoon." He agreed that his pension was adequate enough to cover something nice. I wanted to keep talking to him because I am worried about him but he seemed sort of eager to get off the phone. I said, "Am I on speaker phone?" "No, not now." "Are you able to talk to me privately, without her listening?" "Sometimes."

Then she started ranting at him in the background and telling him that he never stands up for her, etc etc and I was reminded of the time she was ranting about how I couldn't come visit in October, not even to stay in a hotel because she wanted him to be available to drive her around. And not at a later date either because she didn't know how long she would need him. He was crying that time. At the time, I told myself that she was just in physical pain and she probably wasn't simply trying to obstruct things. But tonight I started to worry that maybe she's some kind of abusive harridan and WHY WAS SHE SAYING HE HAD TO MOVE OUT?! So, I realised that being high-handed and not-in-an-apologetic-mood was having a negative impact on him in that moment so I told him that I wanted to apologise to her. He put her on the phone and in my sweetest, most contrite voice possible I ate about a dozen slices of humble pie. I apologised for my tone and told her that my tiredness and worry were no excuse for my disrespectful words. "Well, you've never really liked me and I don't know why. And, also, you should cut out all the f-words and cursing on your Facebook page because you don't represent yourself very well and it's bad for your children if they see it." I promised her I would. The whole time I was flipping off the phone with both hands but I said whatever that cow wanted to hear. Ugh.

I honestly don't know what the fuck is going on there or what the fuck she was trying to do. I think she just feels overwhelmed and wanted to share the misery so she called me up and frightened me with her dramatic "your father is declining rapidly" in the middle of the night. I think she's frustrated that my brother is of no help and sort of feels like someone ought to do something and she is maybe angry that I can't really do anything. Maybe she brought up assisted living and he wasn't interested so she decided to force me to tell him. I don't fucking know.

I wish I had handled it differently. I wish I had said, "Of course he can come live with us. I'll contact a solicitor in the morning" and then broken the bad news that it's not legally possible AFTER I had clearly demonstrated my desire to help. I'm really annoyed that I fucked that up. So, the next day, I sent an email to both of them (he doesn't seem to answer his own emails or his own facebook messages - for some time all such messages seem to come from her accounts.) I said that I wasn't optimistic but that if he wanted to try, here's the pertinent link to the UK gov website and I would look for a good immigration solicitor. I also said that I thought she sounded overwhelmed and that I wanted to help if at all possible - I can't move back to the US but maybe I could come and give her a couple of week's respite.

He replied (from her email account) to say that he didn't want to live in England and that he hoped to visit sometime soon.

A couple of days later a friend told me about how you can call the US for just a couple of pounds a month via Skype. I called my dad and spoke to him. He acted like nothing happened. He's fine. He's driving "very cautiously." He thinks maybe it was a "mini stroke" but he's feeling fine, now.

Ugh. Whatever.

I tried to get him to talk about the fact that I got a batshit crazy call in the middle of the night but he just didn't get it. The ONLY thing he had to say about the conversation was to very sternly tell me that I must never, ever speak like that to Stepmother again. (I didn't speak to her. She was fucking listening to shit that wasn't even being addressed to her.) He also said "You need to understand that she is the number one person in my life. That doesn't mean that I don't love you, but she comes first." I thought that was a sort of gross thing to say - who frames things like that? I certainly never had. I've genuinely been grateful that my dad has someone and I've never said anything like "choose me or her." I honestly felt like he had been told to tell me that by her.

I think they were having some stupid fight so she called me to punish him (and me). I'm not going to put up with that any more.

So I'm going to have to draw some boundaries. I can't help my dad any more than I can help my brother. At least my brother doesn't call me in the middle of the night demanding to move to England.

The truth is, I have always spoken to her respectfully and politely. She likes to think I'm some horrible person and I'm going to let her. But I'm not going to put any effort into dealing with her. If she had wanted my help and sympathy and asked for it, I'd have given whatever I could - as meager as that might be. But she will never ask me for help and sympathy. So there's no need to speak to her.

I have blocked them both from Facebook. I'm going to tell my dad that I've left Facebook because I'm sick of the fake news and spam or something and they'll never know any different. I've told my Husband that if she calls in the middle of the night again, he can tell her that he'll get a message to me and I'll get it in the morning unless she actually says "Her father is dying right now in the hospital." Frankly, it doesn't matter if he is dying at that moment. I can't save his life. I'm not actually going to be scrambling jets to rush over in hopes of watching him breath his last. I decided a few months ago that I would visit him while he was still alive and that's what I did. I may not even be able to attend his funeral - I'd want to for the sake of my brother and would love to see relatives but whatever.

I have come to feel that as soon as my father is unable to speak on the phone to me, he's lost to me. Like I said, I can't race over to hold his hand in the hospital. I don't want him to feel like I don't care but if he's not able to talk then surely he won't know?

I was feeling guilty all week for being over here and unable to help. But the truth is, my dad was fucking thrilled to see me married off. He was over the moon that someone was "willing" to marry me and my bastard child. LOL. And, they both moved in together in their old age knowing full well that sickness and death was in their future. Hopefully they'll be making sensible plans now - but I can't do anything about it.

I can maintain contact with him via his cell phone number and snail mail. I don't know if I was out of order to block him on Facebook along with her but I don't know if he even logs in anymore - he has messaged me from her account so I suppose she would just message me from his. (In the past, she has sent alarming messages ranting about how I need to stop my brother drinking or upsetting my father, telling me that he's going to end up homeless, and that sort of upsetting stuff. I don't have much of a relationship with my brother and I can't make him do anything.)

Regarding the possibility of a funeral in the next year or two: I said goodbye to him in October - I deliberately visited then because I wanted to see him while we could still enjoy it. A nurse friend of mine told me that congestive heart failure does mean that he's not going to live much longer so I went into debt to go over, and knew that meant I probably couldn't afford to go back for a funeral in the near future. My dad actually said that was the right way to do it - "what is the point of visiting me when I'm dead?" He's not sentimental and when my mom died he said that he didn't want us to waste money on a funeral for him. Obviously, there will be a funeral - I'm just saying that he doesn't care. The only reason I'd go would be for my brother's sake. But I'd genuinely be afraid of his girlfriend being obstructive and miserable. If there's a funeral version of Bridezilla, I'd expect her to be it.

Has anyone else been in a similar situation? Am I doing the right thing?

OP posts:
Swimminguphill · 08/04/2019 19:26

Didn't want to read and run. Just sending you a virtual hug. That is all totally shit. The whole thing. No one is thinking of you as a whole person with emotions, needs hell even a time zone of your own. My only question after all of this is why on earth you are asking yourself if anything you do in their regard is 'ok'? You sound like a balanced, caring person. They sound horrible! Do whatever you need to do, for your own wellbeing. Don't make your wellbeing contingent on their approval/happiness etc. because then it will be unattainable.

JustGettingStarted · 08/04/2019 19:38

Thanks for your reply.

I don't think my dad is horrible - I think he's just letting her call the shots. So, I'm worried that my anger at her will result in him being hurt.
He's very old and frail and he lives in HER house. I don't think he could handle a fight with her even if he was inclined to undertake one.

OP posts:
Sunonthepatio · 09/04/2019 07:01

Yes, do whatever you need to do. Older people can be very hurtful sometimes.

You write beautifully, by the way.

Jennbot · 09/04/2019 07:27

Yes you're doing the right thing. Seeing your father while he is alive is important to him.
Whereas attending his funeral, at great expense to you, would only really be necessary if you'd need to support his wife. You don't.
I'd never have apologised to such a rude woman.
There are different levels of congested cardiac failure some people live for years with it. It depends how out of breath, BP readings, mobility and over weight etc he is.

user1474894224 · 09/04/2019 07:38

You haven't seen your stepmum in 13 years?!? How did you see your dad last October then? Where was she? I can see this from the other perspective. My mil has fallen out with my 2 BiL. Because they do nothing to help their dad. Are both incredibly selfish. Think only of themselves and leave her to look after him. But then want a say in what happens in the family home. Your stepmum is looking after your dad every day, he had a mini stroke which is very scary. Cut her some slack and see him more. No wonder she is resentful of you....you do nothing to help him. She just wants you to step up and be a better daughter.

unicornsandponies · 09/04/2019 07:43

Look after yourself first. Your Dad made his decisions years ago to re marry and he is responsible for those decisions and his own life, as you are for yours.
The elderly can be very challenging especially when physical ill health and cognitive decline plus long distance travel are thrown into the mix.
You are doing the right thing. Decide on your boundaries and stick to them.

JustGettingStarted · 09/04/2019 10:44

user1474894224 When I went over in October I stayed in a hotel and met my father elsewhere, like at restaurants and my aunt's house. He made it very clear that I couldn't visit their house and I was to call him on his mobile phone, not ring the house. He was able to meet me for a few hours at a time about 3 times that week. I preferred to stay near where I grew up - her/their house is the other side of town and not near anything familiar to me.

I can't visit him more often - it's not cheap to fly to where he lives. I've gone over to the US 3x in the last 4 years. 2x we went to where his sister lives in Arizona and invited him to join us. The first time he did (with my brother) and the second time he said he would but then decided not to for a few reasons. So I went to visit him in October.

Prior to those trips, he visited us over here, as he was in better health and I had babies/toddlers so it was easy that way.

Anyway, I have seen him 6x over the 13 years and tried to meet him another time. I don't think that's too bad.

OP posts:
HollowTalk · 09/04/2019 10:49

That sounds like a nightmare. Just quickly, why can't you use WhatsApp audio/video?

SandyY2K · 09/04/2019 11:02

I was also going to say use WhatsApp to call him. It's free.

Your SM sounds like a nightmare. The fact that you were not allowed to visit says it all really.

Does his sister keep in touch with him?

AttilaTheMeerkat · 09/04/2019 11:27

I think you are doing the right thing re the question of boundaries here. Do maintain these and raise them as and when necessary.

He married this woman of his own free will. It sounds like he is well under his wife's thumb and he has also actively chosen to put her first above all others including you and your brother (his now wife has probably washed her hands of him too).

I would not have much to do with him and nothing to do with his wife going forward. Do not forget that up till now at least they are getting what they want out of their relationship.

Re your comment:-
"Why did she want him to go live in England rather than, say, an assisted living facility".

Well to me that is obvious, she wants you to look after him so that she no longer has to be obligated to him morally or financially. She knows also this man is your dad. His ongoing medical care in the US is and will be extremely expensive to pay for. I would not put it past them either to phone you in such a manner again in the future.

TixieLix · 09/04/2019 11:30

It sounds like your father's health is declining and your SM is realising that the fun times are over and she'll have to step up and become his carer. Does your DF have his own savings to fund care in an assisted living facility if it were necessary? If not, she may be worrying how they'll meet the cost, hence why she was trying to encourage his move to the UK. It also sounds like your DF is completely under her control - telling you not to visit the house or call the house phone, apologise to SM even though her own behaviour was questionable.

You've done the right thing OP in visiting whilst your DF is alive and reasonably well. It doesn't seem as though you have the closest relationship with your DF, so don't feel guilty about not being able to do more.

JustGettingStarted · 09/04/2019 11:39

We don't use WhatsApp because I don't think my father could figure out how to install it. I don't mind paying £2.40 a month for unlimited calls to any phone in the US.

By the way, they're not actually married. That's because they would both lose their widow's pension/social security from their deceased spouses. I have no problem with that at all. But it shocked me when I introduced her to my maid of honour as "my father's girlfriend" and she called me the next day to yell at me and say that I was to introduce her as his fiancée. I hadn't had an inkling that they were engaged.
("Partner" - at least at that time - was used only by homosexuals who were not allowed to be legally married,so it would have sounded odd. "Girlfriend" and "boyfriend" were perfectly acceptable terms for romantic partners of any age.) I apologised and congratulated her and asked if they'd set a date and she snarled that she would marry my father when it suited them. They never did.

That was the first time I had a hint that she didn't like me. I think it's OK to not be fond of someone if they rub you the wrong way, but I have always tried to be polite to her. I moved far away so she didn't have to worry about me.

OP posts:
barryfromclareisfit · 09/04/2019 12:51

Oh.

You father’s girlfriend does not want to be his carer. Not your problem. Don’t give that another thought.

Someone might need to make his elder-care arrangements is she won’t and he can’t. Your brother? Maybe even you. In a goodbye visit?

Put all thoughts of her, her needs, her opinions, out of your mind. Find out about his will now, so there are no shocks later.

You sound a bit uncaring, saying that if he can’t hold a telephone conversation he won’t know if you visit. He might. He might recognise a familiar voice or feel reassured by a hand-hold.

Overall, though, it sounds like you’ve done all you can to keep the peace. Be honest and firm with yourself. Don’t attempt to do more than seems reasonable to you - it’s your opinion you have to live with, not hers.

Innernutshell · 09/04/2019 13:29

There is no need to take any notice of negative comments on this thread any more than you need take notice of your fathers partner manipulative ways.

You found yourself in this very difficult situation and yet you have handled it with dignity, love and compassion. It's natural for us to doubt our opinions and/or to feel guilt but you have nothing to feel guilty for.

Your Dad's partner sounds like a very difficult woman and I feel for him being stuck there but you are exactly right in deciding to accept the decisions he made.

Well done for setting out your boundaries and truly realising what you can and can't do to help.

I admire your balanced views. Be kind to yourself on this journey. Flowers

MadisonMontgomery · 09/04/2019 13:36

She sounds a joy. I imagine she thinks that she can send him to you and that the NHS will fund his care, thereby saving them money. It sounds like you have done all you can - I would just make sure that you feel comfortable that you have said any goodbyes you want to say to him, as I doubt she will be helpful when the end comes.

LexMitior · 09/04/2019 14:07

Sounds to me like you managed okay given that I think she engineered this whole thing but if it happens again, take your time. This woman is all about pressure!

Why did your father say your stepmother is no 1. She is, and more important than he. Remember that - she will want you to accommodate her wishes in the future.

JustGettingStarted · 09/04/2019 14:47

Talking to my dad on the phone is really for his sake rather than mine. He asks me the same questions each time, there's not a lot to say. I moved away from home when I was 18 and spent my 20's on the other side of the country. It's not like we were terribly close. I do love him and want to do things that won't make him unhappy. But my home and family are here, now.

I don't want her to get at me again because I think she would be trying to manipulate him via me.

I'm unable to rush over even if he is dying so I literally won't be reachable on the phone. My husband said, "but what if she calls to say he's dead?" "He'll still be dead in the morning." I will likely call back right away, of course. I just have a hard line that she is never to call me and get me on the phone like that again. There's no emergency that needs my immediate response.

OP posts:
Chocolateisfab · 09/04/2019 14:52

Reminder her she married him in sickness and in health. She sounds fucking nuts.

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