Anti social ex husband and impact on the children

[JustmeandtheKIDS2]

I have a very difficult ex husband, he is controlling and manipulative and will happily use the children as pawns.
His behaviour is volatile and unpredictable (but not violent) . I can not approach him about anything, this makes parenting very hard.
My children often come home and tell me about daddy saying this or that, its often unkind and anti social. A few examples

Daddy called a child in the play ground fat (child is only 5) My children then call the child fat.

Daddy says his own mummy is ugly, my children then call her ugly

Daddy calls me a fat cow, children repeat this to me

Daddy says fucking hell, children walk around saying fucking hell

Daddy sticks his tong out at the children, talks about poo and wee, children do this at school and then get told off.

Daddy says people who eat meat are unkind as their murdering animals

To name but a few

So far the approach ive used is to say we must always be kind about other people or to say what would your teacher say if you say that to them in school. But its very hard to get the point across with out making it clear that daddy's behaviour isn't right, which it clearly isnt. Im desperate not to put my young children in the middle, but its a struggle to navigate it. Any advise anyone???

Anyone?

You need a book. Let me just remember by who... Lundy Bancroft - anything by him. Look for his talk on YouTube,

You need to read this book - it is very good.

So when daddy says someone is fat don't call him out on it as it doesn't sound safe.

When you say other bad behaviour say by someone else you can start saying stuff like - we are kind in our family we don't act like person x, or you make up an imaginary person.

Eg I was on a bus today and I saw a little boy call his mummy fat and then an elderly lady got up and said don't do that and the mummy was very sad but it was good the people looked out for her. The bus driver even stopped the bus to check the mummy was ok and the boy said sorry.

Please please read books by Lundy Bancroft.

Have you got support in real life?

Do something just for you everyday even if it is just having a quiet coffee.

You need a plan.

You need time with just you and the children as much as possible.

And I am so so sorry this shit is happening to you

Gosh and sorry your husband isn't anti social he sounds very mean and very abusive

He is an ex people

I'm in a similar position, it's hard because my instinct is to say 'Daddy was wrong to say that to you'.

What I actually do is ask my daughter what she thinks about it. Usually she comes to the conclusion that Daddy was being rude/unkind all by herself, and then we agree that we don't say those words in our house because we only speak kindly.

She's only 4 and it hasn't come up at school yet. If it did, I would explain the circumstances to the teacher and ask them to help the children decipher what is OK to say at school and what isn't ok. Ask that the school contacts Dad about it if need be rather than you.

Some adults unfortunately have never learned to be decent to others. It's our job to make sure these horrible traits aren't passed on. I dread how much worse my ex will get though. I do sympathise.

You cant stop him behaving like this. Was he like this when you were together, or is it new? I would just concetrate on being kind, blatantly rewarding for kindness ("that was so nice of you to share your crayons with Harry. Chocolate buttons for kind children who share!").

So sorry I see now he is an ex - my apologies. Hope the advice is still useful.

What's wrong with saying "Daddy is being very unkind" or "Daddy should not have said that" or "I know daddy loves you very much but he isn't always very kind to other people and that isn't very nice".

If he's being an arse you should let your DC know that you don't approve of his behaviour. Otherwise they see no body getting upset with him, but they themselves get in trouble - very confusing for them.

Thank you. Its very very hard as this is a tiny part of the problem. You are all right he is abusive, tbh life would be a lot better for me and the kids if he just gave up on contact, but he wont as he doesn't want to loose control. Of course i would prefer him to just act life a decent human bean but thats not going to happen.

School know all about this, they were heavily involved in some serious safeguarding concerns where my children were involved with social serveses and the police, due to their fathers horrendous behaviour. Even with ss and police involvement he continues to be beyond difficult. He enjoyed having a different opinion than other as he thinks hes superior. A lot of his bad behaviour is geared towards me.
What i worry about is the slow dripping of emotional abuse and cohurson that i fear my children are subjected to. Their only very young so its very hard for them to understand why one parent is saying one thing and the other parent saying the opposite. I tend to say o what would your teacher think or what would they say. But its hard, i want to guide them in the right direction with out appearing to be against their father. (as i dont think thats helpful). I also have to be very careful about anything i talk to the kid about, eg if they ask who finished with who, i made the mistake of saying daddy didnt want to be with mummy, so he left. Daddy told them i finished with him, this caused a lot confusion for the children.
I want to guide them into adulthood as well balanced and happy children who can fit into society and get on with people, they will not learn that from him.

Ha ha no deffo my ex husband (waited 2 long years) to finalise my divorce because hes so difficult.
I suspect this is part of him having an un diagnosed personality disorder. His behaviour is often/always difficult, strange and emotionally detached. I worry my children will be damaged by him and that im powerless to do anything about it.

Well you are a awesome for getting out of that relationship. so hope you realise that you have done something fantastic there.

Please read a Lundy Bancroft book - the daily wisdom one is great. I think it will reinforce what you have done.

I think what is important is to realise that you are their mother and there is power in that.
Your relationship with your children is unique.

Give your children all the love you can and it really is like putting gold in the bank.
I wouldn't focus on pointing out their father's faults.

I would do it in more general terms or use other people as examples.

For example

We treat people well I'm our family.

Words matter choose kind ones.

We are allowed to get angry but that anger can't turn into abuse.

So Ofcourse people get angry but it shouldn't turn into name calling.

I would use the time you have with them to have really positive experiences and if they have an asshole of a Dad then they really really need to feel valued and have confidence.

Get the school onside as they can help.

The book I value is Daily Wisdom by Lundy Bancroft.

It is just a page a day and I use it everyday and think it makes me a better parent.

Your children are going to have to deal with awful people in their life but there is no sugar coating that having a parent who is an asshole can be difficult but I believe by showing them positive love and exposing them to fantastic role models then they will work out just fine.

Your children have 1 asshole to deal with - not two.

You get the school on side and other role models and it will be fine.

It may be tough but doable.

Your presence when you are with your kids can be something powerful and who knows when they are older they may well decide to gravitate away from their father.

Thank you.
It has been hard getting school on side, its as if they dont want to get involved. They never say but they do understand that hes very difficult and i know their weary of him. Thank goodness i have a residency order and the school come to me for all the day to day issues.
Im just concerned cos i dont want to unintentionally be doing more harm than good to the children.

One of the children are already distancing themselves from him but that kind of leaves the other one more vulnerable. The one who is distancing themselves knows hes not "safe" they know hes an inconstant care giver. The other one is too young to realise this

I will look for the book.

Yes please do look for the book.
It is called "daily wisdom for why does he do that" by Lundy Bancroft.

There is a particular page I love which is "you are their mother" which is all about staying how absolutely critical your role is in who they are and who they will become and how inalienable your right is to guide and love them.

I find the book to be very easy to dip into and I swear it makes me a better parent.

I am meeting a friend tonight in same position as you - her ex is always undermining her and I will see if I can get any top tips.

Also maybe the school can help with getting some kind of intervention or therapy - I don't know if it was a charity or the school but this was out on offer for my friend's children and it was blocked by the ex (Ofcourse) but they found time in school hours to get the kids help it involved some kind of drama stuff too.

I am sure my friend's ex does not think the school are taking sides but they were clever enough to just present stuff as helping the children if that makes sense.