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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Boundaries vs intolerance

14 replies

SteadfastTinSoldier · 29/03/2019 06:27

I've never had particularly good boundaries, having had an abusive upbringing and subsequent series of abusive relationships and bullying/emotionally absent friendships.

Over the past 20 years, these people have slowly left my life and I cut the last of them out about 3 or 4 years ago. I did some work on myself and established much better boundaries for myself.

I now have a boyfriend who accepts my boundaries and has his own. It's incredibly early days but it seems to be good so far. Although I can already see upcoming situations where I won't know if he will be crossing boundaries or if I'm being intolerant.

But, I'm really struggling with friends. My boundaries seem to be interpreted as 'mean', 'unkind' or just plain 'intolerant'. When I'm anything but.

How do I know if my boundaries are 'healthy' or 'intolerance'? Are there ever times when I should 'ignore' my boundaries? Or revisit them?

OP posts:
CloudyTuesday · 29/03/2019 06:31

Could you give us an example?

It does sound like you've cut a lot of people out, and yet still have people calling you mean? Hard to tell whether they've got a point or not from what you've written.

PaterPower · 29/03/2019 06:33

It’s going to be pretty subjective and you’ve not indicated what your boundaries are, so it’s difficult to say whether we/I would find them intolerant or reasonable.

If you’re happier now though, and as long as you’re not actively hurting anyone, then stick to your guns.

8FencingWire · 29/03/2019 06:39

Are they boundaries or expectations?

Are you talking about: I need time for myself, let’s see each other at the weekend, or are you talking about ‘you can see how tired I am, why can’t you take it upon yourself to go home and let me rest’?

LemonJuiceandSugar · 29/03/2019 06:44

I think sometimes it isn’t so much about where your boundaries are rather how you assert them?

For example I know two different people who have very strong boundaries when it comes to having personal conversations to the extent of it being awkward and to the detriment of superficial chitchat. One, when asked something they don’t want to answer, with say something like ‘oh I’m not comfortable talking about that, did you see xyz on the news?’ This is fine for me as I take the hint and keep chatting. The other person was a workmate who called me nosey when I asked if she was doing anything interesting on the weekend and I haven’t been much inclined to talk to her again

SteadfastTinSoldier · 29/03/2019 06:54

Well, the most recent thing is this:

I had a 'best friend' who I was only seeing half a dozen or so times a year anyway. She was always "too busy" to answer the phone when I called yet had time to talk for 3 hours if she called me to offload about something that was pissing her off.

I felt a bit used. Especially when I learned she still had time to meet others for coffee. So I challenged her about it. She said that friends are people you can call on for support even if you don't see each other for years and that there is no need to spend social time together more often than we did.

She also repeatedly cancelled, at short notice, a meeting we'd scheduled about a community organisation we were looking into setting up. I'd repeatedly rearranged things to accommodate this meeting and wasn't prepared to do it again. So I pointed this out to her and gave her the dates I was next available and asked her to commit to one. She didn't.

I was less available to her after that which was considered to be me being difficult and unhelpful. After all, she wouldn't have cancelled at short notice unless it was necessary. And I understand that, but don't make arrangements when you're in the middle of a busy period of work/during a family crisis then. Wait until you can actually fulfill that commitment. I'm happy to wait. I'm just not happy to be messed about.

We saw each other recently for a social thing where I personally found her to be incredibly offensive and insulting and what she said really upset me. So I left. She says and does these things quite often. She quite often gets a bit drunk and then dominates a social event crying and recounting an upsetting event from years ago. (I'm not unsympathetic to this - it was awful but I'm trying to be succinct.)

Other people are equally tired of having every light hearted social event 'upset' in this way, but are very accommodating of her due to a desire to be kind.

But I have my own shit to deal with and my own traumatic past events. I want friends and people around me that I can have fun with as well as support. I want the support to be mutual - I don't want to feel like someone's 'whipping boy' and just take whatever they say and have to 'let it go' because they "don't mean it, they're just upset".

I've lost all of my friends on the back of this because I am, evidently, 'mean' and 'unkind' because I haven't just brushed what she said/did under the carpet. I was also clearly upset and now no one is talking to me.

So give it to me straight. Was this a boundary she crossed or am I intolerant?

OP posts:
SteadfastTinSoldier · 29/03/2019 06:59

Before I am accused of being a bad friend for not wanting to support her, I have spent hours with her before talking about it. I encouraged and supported her into therapy which helped.

We have literally spent hours and hours talking about it and i am happy to do this too. But I do find it hard when the fun rare social events we all arrange are dominated by it too.

I also find it hard when she minimises and dimisses other people's experiences as "not as bad" as hers.

OP posts:
LemonJuiceandSugar · 29/03/2019 07:03

No I think the issue is you had no boundaries at first and let yourself be used, then pushed back and asserted your boundaries in terms of how you will let yourself be treated and she didn't like it.

I've been in the same position as my self-esteem improved and didn't want to be the fallback friend anymore. A couple of people didn't like it and I guess you can understand as the old way suited them - they got me at their beck and call.

I don't think redrawing boundaries is ever an easy process, I know because I'm consciously redrawing mine.

I have it at present with a friend I've known 20 years who always talks about sex including asking intrusive questions. I never really liked it but never really said anything as thought it was me being a prude - it's only recently I saw it as what it is, a boundary of mine. Another is a family member who I have always let mock me. But it's really hard to effect change when you're ingrained in these habits from years and years ago.

category12 · 29/03/2019 07:04

Honestly sounds like you did the right thing and that she's used to being able to get away with being a flake and behaving badly, so is crying unfair.

It could be coloured by whatever was said, if you did say anything harsh, but just leaving/not falling over yourself to comfort her is fine. Doesn't sound a particularly good set of friends to ditch you over it.

SteadfastTinSoldier · 29/03/2019 07:04

Are you talking about: I need time for myself, let’s see each other at the weekend, or are you talking about ‘you can see how tired I am, why can’t you take it upon yourself to go home and let me rest’?

The former.

OP posts:
PaterPower · 29/03/2019 07:09

You’re not being unreasonable In the example you’ve given. Your “friend” sounds like she’s got used to using you.

I’m surprised your other friends have reacted so strongly but stick to your guns.

SteadfastTinSoldier · 29/03/2019 07:10

It could be coloured by whatever was said, if you did say anything harsh, but just leaving/not falling over yourself to comfort her is fine. Doesn't sound a particularly good set of friends to ditch you over it.

Without giving identifying details, I calmly told her why I thought she was wrong and said that I was leaving. I didn't want the evening to be ruined any further by it.

Well, no, I think they are clearly 'her' friends and I'm just on the periphery of it all.

It's just that I literally have no friends left now.

OP posts:
SteadfastTinSoldier · 29/03/2019 07:12

I’m surprised your other friends have reacted so strongly but stick to your guns.

I think that this aspect of her is just part and parcel of her. We've all known about it since almost day 1. It's who she is. Whereas, I'm always quiet and compliant. Always in the background not making a fuss and just getting on with things.

Now I've 'made a fuss', I'm the one in the wrong because everyone else did exactly what they always do.

OP posts:
LemonTT · 29/03/2019 08:21

You ex friend behaved badly in the past towards you, by cancelling, and other people by getting drunk and crying. It’s perfectly reasonable to set boundaries if this behaviour annoys or upsets you. I think the boundaries are fine.

What I can’t say is if you were reasonable in how you enforced your boundaries based on the information you have given. Because having boundaries doesn’t give you the right to be behave disproportionately to enforce them.

The accusations levelled at you by your ex friend and others is that you were mean and judgemental. Which in the context would, if true, have been unnecessary and socially unacceptable.

Someone stepping into your personal space is crossing a boundary. You can point this out and ask them to move back or move back and explain why. But you can’t punch them or push them back. Even if you had a past bad experience it’s still wrong.

ChristmasFluff · 29/03/2019 10:22

When someone who was previously unboundaried gets boundaries, other people who are not used to that will push back at those boundaries using fear, obligation, and guilt (FOG). they always did use those things, but now that subtly using them isn't working, they will do it more obviously.

Either they will end up accepting that you have changed, or they will drop out of your life.

Stick to your guns OP, you sound like you are doing great!

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