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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Behaviour around kids question. Might be triggering

6 replies

PookieDo · 09/01/2019 21:51

I do not want to go into too deep specifics but a question has been raised in my family for a long time about some odd behaviour around children. This has come to a point where there is a difference of option in my family

My father grew up in an abusive household, very physical to him and sexual/emotional to his siblings. Over time the abuser went on to abuse others (is now dead). Part of the dynamic was that abuser was very playfully aggressive with DC. He would trap you and not let you go, tickle you to the point of painful and scary and try to force you to sit on his lap. This was in full view of whole family and no one ever really intervened. DC would find this in some ways fun, because it was attention but usually end up with the child crying. There was a much darker sadistic side to all of this that was swept under the carpet by many, and culminated in sexual abuse. The DC who were impacted are now all adults.

My DF has displayed many of these aggressive play behaviours with his own grandchildren but none of the sexual abusive aspects (Never either to his own children). He is not allowed to be alone with grandchildren because the elements of ‘playing’ are too aggressive, too inappropriate and too coercive. If a DC doesn’t want to sit on his lap, he will cajole and coerce them to. He will follow them to get a hug, beggging and pleading. He tickles them and it hurts. Which is horrible. They don’t really know him which doesn’t help. So it is like a strange man is asking for rough affection and then he gets so frustrated when the child will not give it. We have told him over and over not to do this but he doesn’t seem to understand why he needs to keep his distance and personal space. This has made all relationships almost impossible because the DC now don’t like him and we end up having to police him and don’t trust him.

There is a difference of opinion in my family as to whether he is actually predatory/dangerous and whether this is learned really dreadful social behaviour, with no malice.

How do you determine the difference?

He keeps trying to visit us Sad

OP posts:
Nanny0gg · 09/01/2019 21:56

If you have him visit once and he tries it on, you remove the child and ask him to leave.

Or, don't let him near you at all.

Don't care what the difference is. No-one likes it and he needs to stop. Is your mother around? Can't she tell him?

Neverenoughspoons · 09/01/2019 21:57

I don’t think you can know for certain, but it sounds horrible enough that I wouldn’t want him around any children. Especially as he’s been told repeatedly and has carried on.
It sounds terrible for you, and the kids!

Lacypants · 09/01/2019 21:59

It doesn't matter whether it's learned non-malicious or predatory... He's been told to stop, and he won't.
He's made it clear that his feelings are more important than the feelings of a small child. Therefore he is not suitable to around children. By enforcing this you are asserting that you are willing to defend your child's right to their bodily autonomy, and that is an important lesson for your child.

Although, having said it doesn't matter why he's like that, I have to say that my interpretation would be if he won't stop and refuses to acknowledge that it's a problem, then he's choosing to hurt / scare / cause discomfort which is abusive.

Tell him he can't visit and tell him why. "You act like a creepy pervy old man and you have been told to stop. You won't. So you can't be around the kids because you want to be creepy to them."

Fem2019 · 09/01/2019 22:01

Lacy pants yes, I agree

FlagFish · 09/01/2019 22:01

I don’t think the difference matters. It could be either (I would be leaning towards the second), but the point is that if you have told him again and again to stop and he can’t / won’t then your responsibility is to protect your DC.

PookieDo · 09/01/2019 22:17

He’s not seen any grandchildren for 2 years. And like I said never left alone and prior to the gap in visit, children are removed and he is asked to stop/leave if this happens. Or I have left

Have spoken to him over and over. He always acknowledges it and says sorry it won’t happen, you give him a chance and then before you know it he’s coercing again.

Just confirms to me that DC can’t see him again because it’s not going to stop. Thanks all

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