Daughter saying she'll run away from dad

[scaredofex]

My 11 year old dd does not want to go to her dad's but has been told she has to go as there's a court order in place. She has refused to go in the past for months at a time which ended up with court applications by her dad, investigations by social services and the end result was she had no choice.
She's at high school now and makes her own way home unless her dad is picking her up. She's saying she's going to give her dad the slip when she's next due to go as she doesn't want to go. I've told her she has to go but she's all too aware that as I'm not there at school that I can't do anything to stop her giving him the slip. She is very unhappy with her dad but social services and the courts aren't listening.
I know where she'd probably go if she didn't go with him which is to a friend's house, not sure which friend though.
What can I do?

I have talked to her about where she would go as she told me where she was planning to go. Dad would likely try there and cause an ugly scene. That house and mine have police markers on them so the police would come quickly if any trouble. She might go to a friend's though and dad doesn't know where that is. I do.

My solicitor is starting the process of getting it back to court. Her dad has made so many vexatious applications and Cafcass were concerned as to the effect on the children. I've never made any applications apart from for the divorce and a restraining order that has now expired. The barring still didn't stop him from being allowed to apply to enforce the order. I don't think a year has gone by that we haven't been in court.

It's not just because she hates the overcrowding. She hates his gf, hates him not being there, hates the gf's friend who looks after them, hates that she has to share underwear, hates that the gf tells lies about me, hates that the gf questions them about me and my finances, hates the dirty table and chairs where they eat, hate that dad never eats with them, hates the lack of privacy, hates the lack of autonomy, hates the favouritism the gf shows her own kids, hates never getting time with just their dad.....there's not much they like about going there. It's not a home to them and they don't feel welcome or comfortable.

There is a petition created by Womens Aid called Child First: Safe Child Contact Saves lives, ot might help family court to understand the harm they are doing to children by forcing contact.

Thanks, I've signed that petition.
Waiting to hear back from my solicitor as to applying to court to change contact. The problem is that any concerns never meet the safeguarding threshold so no one does anything and the children are too afraid to say how they feel to the authorities which makes it look like it's me putting them up to it.

I'm a bit naive about all this but surely 'forcing' her to go doesn't mean her dad can put his hands on her and physically drag her out. Surely the police should be called to be witness and intervene. Does the court not take into account that her dad isn't even there and she's saying no. What an awful system. I really feel for you and your poor DD.

@blackcat86, when an order of contact is made the resident parent is expected to follow through and do whatever to fulfil the order..the onerous is on the resident parent, usually mum. Courts take a dim view of orders not being followed and the threshold for no contact is very, very high.

If you look at the cases around the Child First petition you will how often contact is forced despite warnings. "Unhappiness" isn't a reason to not see a NRP.

I know of a case where the 14 year will absolutely not see the dad due to his dad's aggression. The courts haven't ordered contact however the mum is ordered to report to the Dad every week what she is doing to encourage the child to see the Dad. The Dad doesn't have to report what he is doing to fix the relationship and rebuild the child's trust.

There is a belief that mums have alienated fathers. My ex tried to use alienation but thankfully our DC consistently told everyone how scary their Dad could be. Cafcass report however just suggested Dad needed to see someone so he could rebuild trust. Everything statement the children make is played down and contact with the parent is paramount.

@scaredofex, your dd will have to be consistent in stating what she wants. Let her know she just needs to say how she feels and of course reassure her that you are fine if she spends time with her dad.

I totally understand the need for DCs to be encouraged to see their parents (DSS's mum has denied contact as a means of financial extortion and control, and has used parental alliteration) but to allow someone to physically manhandle a child must be heartbreaking for mum's to watch and terrifying for the child. The more I hear the more it sounds like a terrible system that really does favour the parents over the DCs. I'm not in OPs position but personally I'd make all the right noises and see if DD runs. It sounds like she'd go somewhere safe and then see how DF sorts it out with a 'well in the police need to speak to me or come here then of course I'll do whatever I can but ultimately it's your contact time and you need to be the parent looking for her'.

She has to share underwear??!

I'm just trying to hold on as best I can until they can vote with their feet. It's the gf that's the main problem but he won't see the problems that dds highlight, my solicitor writes to him about and social services speak to him about. This man is someone who abused me in every way possible and I hate him having access to them. I've tried and tried over the years to get my concerns listened to but no one does.

Yes, have to share knickers. Badly stained ones at that. If they come home in them they go in the bin as do other stained, ripped clothes. Meanwhile his gf is claiming the ones I bought for them were a gift from her for her daughter!

Thats terrible! Can you buy white ones and write her name in them or something? The poor girl "You're not good enough for the Good Knickers Cinderelli"

Gf cuts all labels out so I'd have to buy labels and attach them in a way that can't be easily removed.

Marker pen? I can't believe we are trying to find ways to stop your ex's girlfriend from stealing your 11yr old daughters pants so her own child can have them. This is insane.

She's vile. Rough as a bear's arse and jealous of our John Lewis knickers!

DD has to understand that hers is the voice here. If she doesn't speak out then they carry on making her go. Not only that but you look like the parent who is making it up and intent on alienating them. She has to say the truth.

I'll have a chat with her again later. I've tried to get her to understand that she can't keep changing her mind all the time and that she has to go. She knows dad takes me to court if she doesn't go, even if she's ill and he gets a day in lieu, so she knows how much trouble it causes for me.

Gross but take pics of shared items, your dd has the right to her own things!!
Ask dd to keep a diary, make sure you are most def not in the same room when she writes it. Suggest she gives it to your solicitor. My dc wrote to a judge at under ten saying they didn't want to see df. He got nc.

@Santaispolishinghissleigh she has written letters to her dad several times and these have been presented at court but he just says I've put her up to it. Judge claimed no issues. My solicitor has a list of all her current concerns to add to the next court application.

I had a chat with her last night and it's still the gf who is the main issue. She doesn't want to go to contact the next time she's due to go. I've talked to her about safety and she's sensible so wouldn't put herself in danger and would contact me.

It's a constant worry.

Send her ill next time. They won't want to deal with any sickness etc. Did it once with exh and he insisted I kept them if they were ill!!

Fuck me, has to share underwear
Write her name in a black sharpie, dispicable cunts!

Your daughter has a right to her own legal representation, the Coram Children's legal advice centre might be able to advise https://www.coram.org.uk/how-we-do-it/coram-childrens-legal-centre-upholding-childrens-rights

I must be naive but I don't understand how the court can keep ignoring her when she is being so vocal about why she doesn't want to go.

Has she explained about having her underwear stolen? (That's what it is, it's not sharing). Utterly gross. Poor girl.

This is the problem Greenfingers. DD says to OP she doesn't want to go but then doesn't tell DF or CAFCASS that, either at all or in clear and strong terms.
DD has to understand that she can't say different things to different people. And if she does then she will be made to carry on going.

Your daughter is 11 and the court will eventually have to listen to her wishes.

Bit shocked how the judge is ignoring this.

What she wants is more important than court order. Your ex can still see her but maybe at a neutral place.

The problem is that her dad is very involved with his gf's kids so he's taking them here there and everywhere so can't or rather won't, just see our children on their own. His gf doesn't like that either. So contact time is about fitting in with what dad and his gf want and need rather than what dds want and need. There is no way that their dad will allow them any choice. They have to do what he wants and his gf's kids come first.