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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Middle-aged brother still suffering from sibling rivalry

35 replies

Sadsiblingatsea · 14/10/2018 19:55

I’ve always admired, loved and respected my brother. He is a greenie who really walks the talk – a Vegan, cyclist, feminist, refuses to fly, a devoted father, son and boyfriend. The trouble is, he’s horrible to me.

It came as a shock when I realised a few years ago (we are both middle aged) that somehow a family narrative had been created in which I was a flibbertigibbet - I’d had a bit of success in the media in the 90’s from my chosen career (modelling/media/creative) which I’d really enjoyed – and he was the sincere, saintly sibling and always scathing of my moderate success in such a shallow (in his view) milieu.

He married a woman who seemed to like me until I achieved some moderate success and thereafter similarly became scathing about my work and began organising family events excluding me. By this time, they had had a daughter (I was single and childless) and my mother, aware that SIL was tricky, went along with the excluding as she was terrified scary SIL would stop her seeing her granddaughter. For 30 years I have never had Christmas with my family as brother and SIL always excluded me from the festivities.

Because of low self-esteem I always went along with all this as I felt my brother was a higher being – he extremely intelligent and sincere about his beliefs – and accepted his scathing put downs as my due.

He said he had a problem’ with me working for a certain network, which I thought was fine coming from him, a middle aged man who has never earned a penny in his life, a Vegan who lives off a family trust fund which comes from the meat business. He once called me up to say my work was shite’ and was so abusive I came down with bronchitis with the horror of it.

But things came to a head 6 years ago. I’d been in a physically, verbally and financially abusive relationship for 10 years which I felt unable to leave (having no family or RL support). One night, the abuse became so much that I took an overdose of sleeping pills and plunged into the sea to drown. I was pulled out sometime later that night, amazingly enough doing backstroke while unconscious (I’m a strong swimmer and/or it wasn’t my time).

I called my brother when I came round as I literally had no one else to call. He seemed sympathetic but I didn’t hear from him for 2 months. Then he called me (unusual!) to ask if he could borrow 50k. I was so hurt I said no. The next time I saw him was with my father (old and Teflon coated – I didn’t tell him about my overdose). At this meeting he started discussing my father’s travel arrangements to my niece’s 21st – I wasn’t invited. Although I didn’t know my niece very well (because my brother and I are not very close and my SIL doesn’t like me – I always got the feeling they thought I was a bad influence or something), because I was so depressed this cut me to the bone. In his situation, I would have pinned my father down, told him how desperate I was and generated support.

Realising my brother was a bit of a shit, despite his saintly demeanour, I went low contact for a few years and felt much better for it. While respecting his principles in how he lives his life, I felt I’d been duped by him. He’d once admitted that he suffered from sibling rivalry (whereas he was my late mother’s favourite he has a very difficult relationship with my father who prefers me a bit). He once admitted that when my father gives his daughter attention he feels envious.

During the years of low contact (we have to be in intermittent contact as we have shared interests from our late mother’s estate) he would send me lovely birthday cards saying that he `missed me’ and how he hoped for a rapprochement. He had divorced his wife and now has a very nice new girlfriend who knows of me from a charity I’ve set up. She got in touch and we shared extremely nice messages on FB – after the abusive SIL this was music to my ears. Perhaps at last I might have a family.

I decided to give my brother another chance. I thought he had changed. As he had suggested meeting up I made a few suggestions which he batted off.

In June I met up with my elderly father – while I may be the favourite he isn’t easy these days. He was drinking a lot and said something very mean to me, which came as a shock as while I knew he had that side to him, I hadn’t seen it directed at me. I called my brother up the next day to commiserate – unfortunately I know my father is like that with him. Over the years, I’ve always tried to protect my brother’s views and lifestyle to my uber capitalist father – having a Vegan meal with him when we all met for a meal so he wouldn’t feel the odd one out, for example. We had a nice chat about it.

But a few weeks later, my brother said he’d been with my father, his carer (who my father is mad about) and a friend and they’d all agreed that I’d overreacted to my father’s comment. My brother said he thought it best not to say anything. Later I thought, again he is throwing me down the swanny in order to preserve his own relationship with my father and make him look good – if that had been me I’d have said, well, maybe she has a point and had a discussion.

I’ve tried so very hard over the years to support my brother but I’ve realised it’s hopeless. After my overdose I explained to him how his rejection made me feel and he made sympathetic noises but nothing has changed.

It’s ironic that sometimes the people that publicly seem the most saintly and sacrificing can be so cruel in their personal life – a bit like John Lennon singing about peace and then beating up his first wife and emotionally abusing his young son.

I suppose I’m posting to see what others make of this and if they’d continue to try to make this relationship work.

OP posts:
HollowTalk · 14/10/2018 20:04

I wouldn't. I really wouldn't. Re-read what you've told us. He is a manipulative bastard. He has no empathy for you. He lives off a meat trust fund and is vegan, ffs. That tells you such a lot. He's jealous of your relationship with your dad and is trying to destroy it. He sounds almost insane.

I would go NC with him.

DarklyDreamingDexter · 14/10/2018 20:14

Why are you pandering to this horrible hypocrite? He's not adding anything positive to your life. Just dump his ass like you would an abusive partner and go NC or the closest thing to to it. Why bother trying to support him in any way since he doesn't reciprocate and makes you feel like shit? No, I would not bother trying to make the relationship worth, utterly pointless.

Sadsiblingatsea · 14/10/2018 20:25

Thank you for your replies.

It's hard as he was always the golden boy and in families a narrative gets set and it's hard to change.

Apart from my father he is my only relative so I've always tried to make it work, but I don't believe people change - especially after middle-age - besides, this narrative has served him so well.

I don't pander to him anymore and don't offer any support (not that he's bothered either way). I'd given up but was seduced by his thoughtful messages wanting to be back in touch.

OP posts:
Thebluedog · 14/10/2018 20:33

Being a vegan and saving the planet doesn’t make him a good person. He sounds like an absolute arsehole to me! He’s my exactly walking the walk if he’s living off a trait fund, funded by a meat business Confused

Just do yourself a favour and go no contact with him. You’ll never have the relationship you want with him.

HollowTalk · 14/10/2018 20:34

It's awful that he ignored you after your suicide attempt and then asked to borrow £50K. He had a real nerve, didn't he?

Does he not work at all, then? How come he gets a trust fund? Do you have the same? (Only asking because of equality.)

Wishiknewthen · 14/10/2018 20:35

Sounds like your loneliness and need to belong to the family has left you vulnerable, in the same way you stayed with an unsuitable, abusive partner for similar reasons.
It's one of life's bitter truths that we try desperately to look for love and support from those who have (and continue to), mistreat us as we have no-one else, blinding ourselves to the fact that it is due to them and the damage they caused to our self esteem, that we now find ourselves so alone.
They do not wish you well and will (brother especially ) continue to scupper any future success and pleasure in your life going forward.
They will never be what you need and crave.
Look elsewhere to built relationships.

puzzledlady · 14/10/2018 20:46

my brother is like this - it grinds you down doesn't it. My brother is the son who can do nothing wrong, if i did something great - he would and could always do it better - but i cannot cut him off, because i still look up to him and i love him - he is my older brother and he will risk his life to save mine, of this i have no doubt, but he has his flaws and ive had to push that aside because i just cannot not have him in my life - ive learned to keep him at an arms length though - its better for me this way.

Sadsiblingatsea · 14/10/2018 20:47

In his defence and trying to be scrupulously fair, he has given away a great deal of his money - but has just kept enough so he still doesn't have to work. The trouble is, he gave away so much he then had to borrow money from my father to tide him over while he sold a property - but he isn't very businesslike - the property is run down and has been on the market for months (I said I'd help him with this as I've had a property business) but he wouldn't want to take advice from me, so there we are.
@HollowTalk - yes, we've had exactly the same.

OP posts:
eddielizzard · 15/10/2018 08:30

This is something I've struggled with too. Your position in the family throws a shadow over your life, and when that position is wrong, I'd even say abusive, you have to fight so hard to cast that shadow off.

It's reasonable to want the approval and love of a sibling whom one looks up to. But in this case your brother will never give you the love and approval you need, and actively kicks you when you're down. He takes enjoyment from belittling you. He seems like he has massive self esteem issues, actually.

The only thing to do is go lc to nc. Interesting that when you were lc, he sent you lovely birthday cards. That's telling. That's an abusers MO. When they sense they've gone too far, they're conciliatory to draw you back in. He wants to keep kicking you.

The thing is, yes, your brother is family and is important. But you're under no obligation to maintain a toxic relationship with him. For your mental health I do think you need to go nc, and get some counselling for getting over the very damaging effect your family has had on you.

Sadsiblingatsea · 15/10/2018 16:26

Thanks, eddylizard, that is very helpful, as are everyone else's comments.
So much wisdom on mumsnet!

OP posts:
noego · 15/10/2018 17:28

Interesting that when you were lc, he sent you lovely birthday cards. That's telling. That's an abusers MO. When they sense they've gone too far, they're conciliatory to draw you back in. He wants to keep kicking you.

I totally agree with this insight.

What is his motive? Could it be your parents estate?

springydaff · 15/10/2018 21:04

I feel so sorry for those of us in families like this.

I say 'in' but I am no longer 'in', have voted with my feet. It's the only way. They/he will never ever change.

What is so sad is waiting waiting for them to change. I simply couldn't understand my sibling not loving me, it just didn't compute. Like you I imbibed it all Sad

Do have a look at this. It was such a revelation for me. Do go along.

I remember years ago someone telling the analogy of beating, beating on a door until our hands are bloodied but it won't open, even though we can see the light underneath that proves someone is in. This is an astute illustration of what it's like having family/siblings like this.

springydaff · 15/10/2018 21:08

BTW it's not sibling rivalry it's abuse.

There's no excuse for it! As with all abusers they do it because they enjoy it.

Hidingtonothing · 15/10/2018 23:55

Some of this is depressingly familiar OP, especially the pulling you back in when you’ve pretty much made peace with them being out of your life. I’m very LC now, I’ve decided my boundaries and am not afraid to protect them, he doesn’t get to do the push-pull thing to me anymore. What contact we do have is superficial, I won’t allow anything deeper because I would just start to trust him and he would invariably prove what an arse he is all over again! I refuse to get involved in the issues he causes with other family members too, I go a bit grey rock and make a few sympathetic noises then change the subject, I have to say I’m much happier for it Smile

TatianaLarina · 16/10/2018 00:10

This is what I don’t get about women: trying to make really awful people like them.

If you get on with your family, great. But if you don’t, and you’re related to an arsehole, then why bother? What does it bring to your life?

Life’s too fucking short for this envious, vindictive, narcissistic, hypocritical vegan wanker.

Personally I’d have binned him a long time ago.

Be happy and be free.

butterfly56 · 16/10/2018 00:47

Family like this can make you feel incredibly lonely and worthless if you let them.
Go no contact...take back control of your life.
Think about it if you are going to be lonely let it be on your terms and no one else's.
You have every right to a life unfortunately sometimes you have to kick certain people to the kerb to get that life back. Flowers

butterfly56 · 16/10/2018 00:49

p.s. Learn to put yourself and your needs first...always Flowers

PersonaNonGarter · 16/10/2018 00:58

This really hit a nerve with me - it is so hard to give up hoping that our family will love us and treat us like we imagine ‘normal’ families treat each other.

Stay strong. Find a way to keep him in your life, but on your terms only.

pallisers · 16/10/2018 01:00

This isn't sibling rivalry. Your brother is a complete shit. Only someone in a family with him would have put up with this (families fuck you up at times). Bet his life is littered with friendships shattered when people just couldn't put up with his shit anymore.

Go absolutely low to no contact. you'll feel like a new woman.

MrsTerryPratchett · 16/10/2018 03:22

It's hard as he was always the golden boy and in families a narrative gets set and it's hard to change.

But I hope that you understand that a 'feminist' who is dreadful to his sister, and a 'vegan' who lives off the profits of meat isn't a golden boy, he's an arse.

Sadsiblingatsea · 16/10/2018 21:12

Thanks again for the continued insights.

With the help of therapy I knew the relationship is toxic and everyone's comments reiterate this.

Unfortunately, my brother and I have been in a lot more contact than usual as we have a shared charitable interest that requires both our input - he is dragging it out which is bringing up a lot of bad memories and triggering anxiety. I am going to email him to speed it all up and once it’s done look forward to going LC again.

I’m now quite suspicious of those who virtue-signal the loudest – sometimes it conceals a darker side.

I remember once introducing him to a friend who was quite successful in the artistic field my brother is passionate about – I must have been mad but I thought they’d get on and he would be a help to my brother. My friend mentioned he was buying a council house and my brother became rude and disparaging – he insisted it was dreadful that council houses were being sold off. It was a very uncomfortable lunch. I later thought, it’s fine being so judgemental over people’s choices when you are cushioned by a large trust fund. My friend had very little money and this was going to be a great opportunity for him.

Anyway, there is some relief and peace in letting go of how we would like people to be – I’m now building up a good life with decent, caring friends and have much stronger boundaries these days.

OP posts:
springydaff · 17/10/2018 00:56

ime contact with my toxic siblings (plural!) just churns it all up again. It can really make me wobble.

I've had acres of therapy and, as long as I have no contact with them, I'm at peace. We have recently been thrown together a bit because our parents are old and frail. Big mistake to get involved with them. I have had to withdraw again.

If they behaved themselves then I'm sure we could have a working relationship but their abuse is never far from the surface, too juicy to pass up it seems.

I don't think we ever fully give up longing for our family of origin to love and respect us. Having them in our orbit rubs salt in the wound, even if we have intellectually fully accepted they are incapable of love and respect.

AgentJohnson · 17/10/2018 03:23

The relationship you have with your brother is an unhealthy dynamic and everyone has a role to play in their relationship dynamic but you don’t have to continue playing yours.

Changedname3456 · 17/10/2018 09:08

He sounds like a tit. Opinionated, hypocritical and, frankly, lazy as hell.

TheGoddessFrigg · 17/10/2018 14:50

it is so hard to give up hoping that our family will love us and treat us like we imagine ‘normal’ families treat each othe

This. In spades.
TBH I thought I had written your OP and forgotten about it! Same family dynamics, the sneaky criticism, the under valuing, the reaching out and then disparaging. Except 'mine' is a fucking gestalt counsellor Ffs.

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