Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Would you regard this as unacceptable harassment? Or just a git to be ignored?

11 replies

ItsHarryTheDirtyDog · 12/09/2018 02:46

I am 42, so this all happened a long time ago.

When I was at uni I was a good student of the sort who "will clearly become an academic" so spent a lot of time from about 2nd year on hanging out with members of the relevant uni dept at the pub, at research seminars, etc. I got on well with several faculty members so it seemed reasonable to attend social gatherings at their houses, catch up for meals out when I returned to the area after leaving uni, host them when they visited where I was studying, and particularly, to ask them for references for scholarships and jobs.

One professor did far more of this kind of thing than the others. It seemed natural in that I was quite similar to his kids, we shared many research interests, and I went on to do postgrad and postdoc work at his old university, which he visited fairly frequently.

At some point when I was late 20s, the visits seemed to become more frequent, involved multiple meetings, always dinners out, and every time he met me he would give me hugs that were just a bit too tight, a bit too long, and a bit too revealing of his own level of interest. He continued to provide lots of academic contacts and references for jobs, grants, etc.

I tried to reduce contact a bit as the full-body hugs were unwelcome and I felt honestly a bit suffocated. He stepped it up a notch to trying to play footsies under the table in a restaurant, and putting his hand on my thigh whenever he happened to sit next to me - in front of other people. I felt really uncomfortable so stopped asking for references (despite still being in the academic hell-hole of needing them for the 20th, 30th, 40th applications for permanent jobs).

He met my parents socially and asked why I was avoiding him. My parents asked me, I said "he's a bit of a letch, I'm trying to avoid all the hugging and hand on thigh stuff". My parents scoffed at the idea that anyone would be so tasteless as to try that with someone like me.

All of a sudden anyone who knew this professor suddenly rejected job applications from me without shortlisting. People came up to me at conferences with hilarious tales of how I was this professor's stupidest ever dissertation student. People suddenly knew all the details of various boyfriends I'd had over the years, to whom this professor had been introduced; I was apparently a bit of a slut and never seen without a man in tow. Etc.

In the end I got a job without his references and haven't heard form him in years, thankfully. It's probably not coincidental that all email contact from him suddenly ceased when he wasn't invited to my wedding.

i think this kind of thing in my mother's generation would've been regarded as totally normal and I'd have been told to be thankful "he" got me scholarships and jobs "with his references", and be thankful anyone found me pretty. I look back and think "Idiot, but a lot worse could've happened."

The memory makes my skin crawl a bit though.

OP posts:
AmeliaAK · 12/09/2018 04:13

100% unacceptable and 100% harassment.

counterpoint · 12/09/2018 05:12

You indicate that you harassed them in some respects. For example, My parents never met any of my profs. I never socialised one to one with any of them either.

inquiquotiokixul · 12/09/2018 05:15

Not just harassment - active career sabotage. What a git. Are you still working in the same field?

ItsHarryTheDirtyDog · 12/09/2018 06:03

Counterpoint, I don't think I harrassed him, but I probably didn't give sufficient detail about the context for you to be able to tell.

It was completely the norm at that time, in that place, for students doing research projects to hang out socially with members of the lab, which included everyone from undergraduate students through to emeritus professors.

The social meeting is because my father worked in roughly the same academic field, so knew the guy a bit socially and saw him at a hobby they shared as well.

i don't work in the field or as an academic any more, thankfully.

OP posts:
KataraJean · 12/09/2018 06:33

I am a bit older than you and an academic.
I only ever socialised with academic staff from post-graduate level and have never received that level of unwanted attention from colleagues. Men at conferences or at other institutions, yes, but no-one in a direct position of power related to me. So I don’t believe it was just what happened - second year seems awful young to be in the socialising group - more that where you were, there were not appropriate boundaries in place.

That said, I believe what you say as one only needs to read about sexual harassment in institutions to know it goes on.

I also know the level of narcissistic rage I received from my xH, also an academic, when I had the cheek to end the marriage. And that is what the lies and the smears were, you rejected him and his advances so he had to devalue you and try to destroy your chances. Horrible.

Nothing normal or acceptable about it.

gylly · 12/09/2018 13:53

It's definitely harassment and very concerning.

References provided must be factually correct, if he was giving references stating that you were his worse student and a slut this is clearly not factual and you may have been able to pursue a claim against him in this respect. However I assume that he wasn't stupid enough to commit to this in writing and his opinion was probably given during an "off the record" discussion.

He is clearly an arse but what worries me more is that the academic institutions that you were applying to took his opinion as the truth and rejected your applications. Surely you wouldn't have any respect for someone who discussed a previous students private life during the recruitment process and I would've thought that your work would've stood for itself thereby casting doubt on his opinion that you were a rubbish student.

I can only assume that the people that rejected you on these grounds were of the same ilk as the idiot that spread these malicious rumours about you, therefore they probably did you a favour by rejecting you as you may well have encountered the same treatment from them.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 12/09/2018 14:35

You indicate that you harassed them in some respects. For example, My parents never met any of my profs. I never socialised one to one with any of them either

Oh FFS. Bullshit. She did not harass him. This is up there with 'she asked for it'.

marvellousnightforamooncup · 12/09/2018 15:03

Quite right Spartacus, or is socialising with someone senior to you and asking for references harassment now?

AngelsSins · 12/09/2018 17:56

He’s disgusting entitled pig.

ItsHarryTheDirtyDog · 12/09/2018 21:49

@KataraJean Thanks - I agree that appropriate boundaries definitely weren't in place at that particular institution (for all sorts of reasons). I also didn't learn much about socialization growing up so had no useful radar for what was appropriate and what wasn't.

@gylly I imagine that the smears were in personal conversation - everyone knows everyone in this field. Fairly easy to write a reference damning with faint praise or deliberately get a detail wrong that will piss off the institution, which he definitely started doing - "I recommend ItsHarry for this fellowship at XXX College" when it was YYY College... had that particular application binned in front of me by a snotty admin who pointed out that the other 1000 applicants could at least get their referees to change the college name in the file....

OP posts:
PawneeParksDept · 12/09/2018 22:03

I remember in my uni years it was spoken of in hushed tones that the prettiest girl in our year had slept with the most qualified professor in our subject. He was married and everybody disapproved.

That was almost 20 years ago - these days he'd probably get the sack

New posts on this thread. Refresh page
Swipe left for the next trending thread