Did I over react?

[losingwill]

Apologies if this is long, trying not to drip feed! Difficult times between DP and I, been not great for a few years now. We have bouts of 'trying' where things are tolerable then usually something blows up and it becomes much less tolerable. One major area of disagreement is over child rearing. I'll admit, I am protective and cautious - he considers me paranoid and influenced by 'propaganda' on the internet (largely Mumsnet ).

An example would be extended rear facing seats. That got horribly ugly at times. He didn't disagree that it was safer, he just thought it over the top.

In the end I bought even more expensive seats that could dual face. Kids stayed RF until 3.5/4, which they actually loved and have been car sick more often since forward facing - two of his main arguments completely proved wrong.

I was away recently and found out he'd taken the children out without any car seats at all. Youngest has just gone into HBB and older one is petite so still very much needed. I was beyond furious but calmly told him that if he did it again, I'd call the police.

He does shout a lot, and quite quickly - he thinks it's the best way to get the kids to behave properly. I admit to shouting occasionally but usually after several other methods have failed and it's usually just their names (or "shoes"!!) to get their attention or "stop" if they are fighting.

Anyway, the other night I'd put them to bed and they were messing around as they sometimes do. He went in, yelled at them and took all their toys out of their beds. A little while later, oldest called me to say they had a sore foot from an earlier scrape and the blanket was hurting it. I savloned then propped it up on a toy cushion. 5 minutes later DP went in, saw the cushion and told oldest that he was putting the cushion in the bin because they were still awake. When I checked a bit later, DC was sobbing but trying to be quiet as didn't want any more toys thrown away. I saw red, marched downstairs to get the cushion and give it back. Then ended up arguing with DP and told him that he was bullying our children and would traumatise them.

We've not really spoken since...

If you've got this far - did I overreact? WWYD?

My dad always shouted (and smacked) and I can remember being DCs age and how I felt so I'm sure that influenced me. Just really don't know where to go from here

Sorry for the epic post!

He sounds bloody horrible, OP.

Oh Op, he sounds horrible! Don’t ruin the DCs and your lives by staying with this awful bully. Seriously LTB. Your DC will thank you.

He's being a bully. He needs to be told this. Yelling at a child for still being awake solves nothing. He should have asked what had happened. Are the children scared of him because if they are you have a problem. Ask him if he's proud of his behaviour....

OP - it sounds like you have some deeper issues and power struggles that come to head in other places.
So -in other words - it’s not necessarily about the actual child rearing.
It also sounds disfunctional.
Sorry

Oh and no you didn't know overreact. I'd have gone mad at DH if he pulled something like that.

He needs help. And whilst he's getting it , he needs to move out. Twat

What a meanie. Have you considered breaking up?

I don't think you overreacted. I think he lacks patience with the kids and this leads to him being unpleasant in dealing with them, which is frightening them.

He needs to adjust his behaviour and learn to control his anger.

From your description you do sound like an anxious parent.
I think your DC will be picking up on the conflict of parenting styles.
It does sound as if you undermine your DH. In your OP you mentioned that your DC were messing about at bedtime - from what you said about propping foot up e.t.c it sounds as if you were pandering to your DC and hence they know to attempt delay tactics with you.
I don't think trying to discipline your DC will traumatise them. From your OP he sounds as if he's trying to assert his parental role and you are pulling the rug out and undermining him. What's wrong with confiscating toys when they are disobeying their bedtime?

As always - there will be a huge divide in responses to this thread,
My personal opinion is that whilst you may be an anxious parent, there is no excuse for him shouting like that at the children.
If you need to shout like that, then you've lost control.

I struggle with a similar situation with my DH and my DS (not my DD though - but that's a whole other story)
So I do feel your heart right now xxxx

Thanks all. He isn't a bad person and he can be a great dad. They love things like going camping with him and he is hands on. But he is far more laid back about safety than I am and sometimes it almost feels like he's 'getting his own back' if that makes sense?

I agree the conflict worries me, as does the lack of closeness - what lessons did we learn as kids (both sets of parents divorced) that we are repeating now? What are we teaching our own children?

I don't think the shouting is malicious on his part - he's repeating parenting perhaps and just cannot see the potential harm. He doesn't really analyse - or if he does (after much heated discussion) he can come out with some odd ideas - he actually suggested that shouted regularly would be beneficial for their adult lives as "they'd be used to it"

Discipline - I do have firm boundaries but tend to use things like 'raindrop' or shorter story time etc for misbehaviour. I also try to explain why it's wrong. He just goes straight to shouting. With oldest child, yes probably some delaying tactic in there but I know the alternative usually means taking longer to get to sleep.

It wasn't the taking toys out of bed that was the issue (although DC1 finds it hard to sleep without something cuddly and often suffers from bad dreams) - it was the binning of something much loved after I'd given it to them - I didn't actually know he'd said he would put toys in the bin and it felt that he hugely undermined my status as an equal parent as I'd given it? That 'Mummy can't protect me/my stuff from Daddy' IYKWIM?

I do spend a lot of time thinking about separating. It just seems a terrifying decision and so hard practically with cost (we are in an expensive area and moving away would make school journeys much harder or even mean changing schools which I would hate to do). He'll also make life difficult I suspect

I just wish he'd actually properly listen and try to understand rather than pull out the passive aggressive - 'oh if I do everything your way (sulkily) then you'll be happy won't you'

Hold on, did I read it correctly?
You threatened to call the police? For crying out loud.

You do sound overly-anxious, but he sounds like a bit of a dick so I’d say it’s 6 of one and half a dozen of the other. He overreacted to the kids being awake and you overreacted to him overreacting. You could have just explained that you put the cushion there rather than kicking off about it. Him taking them out without car seats if they’re around 4 (it’s not clear to me how old they are now/ at the time) is just illegal though so you e a right to kick off about that.

Sounds like you did a bit to be honest.

You dont like his views on parenting and are unable to find a middle ground where he feels his opinion counts.

Is seperating about parenting or something else?

Either way if he wants to be an involved father together or seperate, you will need to find middle ground on how you handle things or the kids will pick up on it?

Honestly, it sounds as though you're both to blame here. You both feel entitled to have everything your own way and behave like stroppy, petulant children when you don't get it. A successful partnership, and successful parenting, requires negotiated agreement, mutual respect and compromises on both sides. The two of you need to learn to communicate with each other like adults.

@Disquieted1 threaten led to call the police for driving the children without any child seats. I think that is perfectly reasonable imo

I would ring your local children's centre and book both of you on to a parenting course before you think about LTB.
You do sound anxious, he's shouty and your children are going to pick up on your different parenting styles it would help to both be singing from the same songsheet so to seek and get advice from professionals...

I just wish he'd actually properly listen and try to understand rather than pull out the passive aggressive - 'oh if I do everything your way (sulkily) then you'll be happy won't you'

It doesn't sound like you listen to him though.

You sound VERY anxious and as though you want everything YOUR way. Anything less is deemed abuse/irresponsible parenting.

He could be doing better, yes. But so could you tbh. If DH and consistently undermined my parenting for years then I'd lose my shit occasionally- doesn't make me a bad person.

Also, why are you unilaterally deciding on what car seats to buy? These are joint decisions in our house. We research them together and then try and find the best we can for the budget we set. We can do this because we communicate well and try and work as a team.

I think there are more fundamental problems in your relationship that need work. And yes, to me it sounds like the kids were messing too much and you pandered to them at bed time. I can see at he got annoyed but he also overreacted.

Thanks all, some interesting thoughts and perspectives there.

Yes both children under 7 so illegal not to be in a car seat. Oldest isn't much bigger than youngest so is still so small in an adult belt.

He didn't lose his temper though - this is his normal parenting style and that's what I struggle with. It isn't him overreacting, it's his completely normal reaction and he can't see anything wrong with it.

We don't communicate well, we've tried counselling (he would only agree to 2 sessions) and got some tips but he won't try and use the methods. But then says he doesn't want to split up and will do anything. He says he is trying hard but he is so often grumpy and sullen.

I'm well aware I'm a long way from perfect too. I have a temper, I can control it around most but he pushes my buttons. My father had a vicious temper, yelled and smacked. He once kicked down a bathroom door after I'd locked it to get away from him. I hate shouting but find conflict very hard to manage - coincidence??!

I just know what I felt like when I was small and had been yelled at and I saw that scared face in DD - so I lost it a bit. I did tell him that I gave it to her, it made no difference.

Maybe I need to write some of this down for him! I don't think I manage to express myself well even when trying to talk about things calmly,

He's a fucking bully, get rid!

Or get ready for your kids to resent you .

Hi there
Some of your post reminded my of my relationship with my stbxh. I cam across and was anxious and a little over protective of the children. But he was very very controlling and had to have a different view about the most normal of things. Since then he has now left me and the children and i see a very different set of circumstances!
I am no longer anxious and realise that a lot of my anxiousness was due to the fact that he was very controlling, esp regarding the children. i had very little choices, i certainly would have had no choices regarding car seats, i wanted rear facing but stbxh was also very tight and would just buy the cheapest or wait till someone had given him one. He was emotionally detached so safety didn't really feature in his school of thought.
I would take a long hard look at your relationship and mostly about the power struggle that appears to be happening, this may well represent something bigger that just the children. Good luck

Thank you for sharing your experience WhatIwish. In my view - I did compromise over the car seats in that I would have kept them both RF until 5/6. He wanted FF from the move up from baby seat so around 12-15 months. We ended up with dual facing seats (at a higher cost that I paid for entirely) and turned them FF from 3.5/4. Recommendation are now RF until at least 2 I believe?

Yes there is probably some power struggle throughout, there is a difference in wealth although we are both good earners now, he has family money and always had more when we were first together.

I've tried discussing the issue and that I don't see a huge problem in what he does for discipline (although I think he can use other methods than toy removal) - it's the delivery that upsets me

OP - i doubt that your power struggles originates in his family money and wealth difference you had when you met.

It sounds more like you have some differences - you (as you said yourself) - are overly anxious over something, and you want things your way - or maybe you don’t feel appreciated as a mother.
And he, probably, feels that he doesn’t get to decide much about kids despite being a father - and he feels resentful.
This happens often and I don’t know how it might be resolved.
It sort of requires both to realise that BOTH have issues.

(as a side note - even if YOU feel you already compromised on car seats - it still was way beyond what most people’d consider rational.
But - it doesn’t really matter. It’s not a rational argument for either of you)

Totoro nailed it. Doesn't sound like you value his opinion on raising the children in the slightest, and that's leading to frustration on his part.

You both need to work on communicating with each other by the sound of it. If that means writing stuff down rather than face to face conversation then do that - often it's a lot easier to get your point across if you can rewrite it a few times to make sure you're explaining yourself as well as you can.

To me it sounds like your experiences as a child are causing you to judge your dh possibly a lot harsher than someone who didnt have that experience or type of relationship with their own father would.

I.e I dont have an issue with toys being taken away for misbehaviour. Tablets are witheld for a day or two for particular issues but always given a warning first.Dc is clear on the rules, understands that actions have consequences and that works for us.

May or may not be relevant to you but dh and I have very different parenting styles with him being more strict than me. He would appear quite shouty with dc in my prescence. One day my mum pointed out that she only ever sees dc act up with him when I am around because they know I will defend them against their dad, and he as a result would get more fruatrated.

When I stopped intervening and said well your dad has decided xyz and if you have an issue talk to him not me the whole thing gradually calmed down over time.

Of course if you think he is being genuinely abusive that is something else altogether.