What does a good marriage look like?

[Gugglebum]

My parents had a weird marriage, not warm, not great. I am in one that I think is not good either, based on how I feel most of the time. I always heard marriage is hard work, you work through hard times, etc, but what is the balance supposed to look like? I am 20 years in and every day, I feel
frustrated,
alone,
not listened to,
relieved when he leaves and stress when he comes home,
starved for laughter (outside of my kids),
like it’s mostly hard work and very little easy or fun.
If you are in a happy marriage, how would you describe it? What’s normal ratio of good- difficult? How do you feel when your partner comes home? I have a sinking feeling I have been on a sinking ship for many years and haven’t known it was perhaps not normal. I am wondering recently if it really supposed to be this much work.

Yes. Sad. I hope to create a time of NOT this at some point in my life.

Hi Gugglebum, I don’t have any words of wisdom, I just wanted to say that I could have written your first post. My DH doesn’t have the narcissist issue that yours does, he is inherently a good person, but our marriage doesn’t bring much joy to either of us. My parents’ marriage sounds similar to your parents’, and as Attila so wisely says, I seemed to have mirrored that.

Just wanted to wish you luck for the future - I would also like to believe in a future which is NOT this.

Margie- thank you. For so long I have thought I don’t handle things well, or that I look at things the wrong way or something. But I have been realising it’s not that, or at least not only that. I hope for better for you too.

I never really understand it when people say you have to work at a marriage or that marriage is hard work. Maybe I have been lucky but have never had to work at my marriage.

We have been married almost 40 years. Still very much in love, hug and kiss all the time. We have lots in common - cinema, theatre, walking, museums, castles etc plus a few separate interests.

He is my best friend. I would rather spend time with him than anyone else. I can talk to him about anything and tell him anything. I know if I tell him something silly he won't laugh at me.

He makes me laugh almost every day. We do, of course, sometimes row but usually end up looking at each other and laughing.

He sometimes goes away overnight for work and even for that short time I am always excited when he is due home and listening for his key in the door.

When he has days off I love him being at home

My DH drives me nuts, we argue quite often, and our marriage is a bit notorious for our Burton-Taylor style spats. But the simple truth is that we love each other and get excited when the other comes home. We have grown towards each other over the years, and almost always agree on matters big and small. Eg, we both vote labour, but we both have the same favourite Tory MP 
I am religious, he's not, but he comes with me and DS to church on special days like Easter.
When we are both out separately and see each other across the street, the delighted look on his face tells me more than all the flowers he doesn't buy me 
We used to be very social, but now our idea of bliss is an evening on the sofa with something nice to eat, a bottle of red and a BBC4 documentary or Drama 

When you say marriage is hard work, I'd say, yes, it is, but not in a bad way. For example, I'm an irritable sod and I shout a lot. I've done quite a lot of work on myself to reduce the stress to make myself better to live with. DH has had therapy for his own issues to make himself better to live with.

I still call him a prick at least once a month though 

@Gugglebum I think you know your marriage is not working for you. What you do about that is up to you - but I hope you do something

Marriage should not be hard work, no.
'You have to work at a marriage' means that you need to be active in your relationship, don't take each other for granted, take time to sort out disagreements, talk to each other, dream together, make sure you connect regularly when you are both busy.

mutual love, mutual respect, mutual liking of each other.

Someone I chose to spend time with, someone who I am happier with than without on balance.

There are boring bits, and times we irritate each ither, and as a pp said, times when I love it when he goes out and I have the house to myself.

But that word mutual is key. It is about both of us.

I've never understood why people think you shouldn't have to work at a marriage. Most things worth having and doing well require effort: raising DC, getting fit, keeping a house looking clean and welcoming, studying for a degree, getting promoted at work etc. Why would a long term relationship be anything different? It's easy to stop seeing each other when DC come along, or to find fault with each other when you're mainly just sleep deprived and shocked by the change in circumstances DC bring with them. Loads of marriages fail when DC 2 comes along and anothe rload fail when DC are in late teens - classic periods in a marriage when it's easy to stop noticing or appreciating your partner.

It shouldn't be endless slog, but it does require effort. But effort can be fun. Hard work can be fun. And it pays off.

I see what you mean Mina but I think it depends what you mean by the word "work".

I guess if you don't feel any negative connotations with it, and simply mean "taking actions together in order to continue your relationship", then you could say that yes, everything takes work.

But to me, work is something that's conscious, deliberate, boring, pretty unpleasant; it's an effort and a slog, it's hard. My marriage honestly hasn't been those things at all, even in the less pleasant phases of our lives.

Posted a bit too quickly - I didn't mean to sound so smug there and I'm sorry if it came across that way, I'm just trying to explain why I don't think the phrase really works for me!

avva you don't sound smug - but you do sound like you have an unusually good marriage. I work to keep my marriage as good as yours. But could be we just interpret the word 'work' differently. I know if I didn't actively seek out fun things for us to do we wouldn't leave the house much because we're getting older and knackered and DC are full on. But I make the effort and so does he, so we have plenty of things to look forward to and talk about.

My marriage is good and I'm grateful for that every single day. I say that because most of my life could have been called dysfunctional and largely unhappy to say the least up until a couple of years before we met.

I had an abusive childhood and nothing around me resembling a 'good' marriage - certainly not with my parents anyway. I went on to have an abusive relationship which was so bad I had to be rescued by the Police and left me with a whole load of emotional baggage.

But a few years later I met DH. We've been married nearly 20 years now and my husband is my soul mate. He has my back 100%, as I do his. He is the kindest, most straight down the line person I've ever met and he still gives me butterflies (the good kind!). I do sometimes wonder how I managed to get it so right after so many years of chaos before, but I'm so grateful that I did.

Aww, I love a good happy ending! 😍 So pleases for you Badtaste!

Ah thank you 😊

mina - see my post just before yours, sayign the difference between hard work, and putting some effort in.

I agree that anything worth having takes some work, but the sort of work that a relationship takes is not 'hard work' it just means putting some effort in, not taking each other for granted, taking time, even when you are tired etc to have time together, taking time to work through a problem of issue, turning the TV off and talking and so on.

I think 'working' at a marriage is sometimes interpreted as everything being difficult and constantly needing to be worked at, resolved etc.
If everything is difficult, it is time to get some counselling or leave really. That isn't a good place to be.

Sorry you're unhappy, that isn't how it should be.

I'm married 11 years this year (together 15) and I have a really good marriage I think no I don't think, I know. An example that happened yesterday is I came home from work and I felt really stressed and tired, my DH had just got in aswell and he literally took one look at me and led me into the couch put a blanket over me and said I'll wake you for dinner. I really needed that yesterday and he just knew. I think a good marriage is being a team and wanting to look after eachother and wanting, really wanting the other person to be happy

I've heard my father speaking to younger people about being married for 50 years. The younger people generally say that they would like a relationship like that. My father always says that it was about compromise. My parents also supported one another and the wider family through some really bad times and shared the good times. How much would you compromise ?

I feel like all I’ve done is compromise- or not really, I’ve set myself aside for him, for the family, all the while thinking I was doing the right thing by trying to be selfless and a team player, so to speak. It has backfired because I am with someone who evidently has no trouble with me being driven into the ground as long as the status quo is maintained (without much effort on his part). What Trinity used as an example would never happen here. He would act all sympathetic and say oh so sorry you’re feeling awful, but then go turn on the tv or back into his home office to do a bit more since dinner isn’t prepared yet. I am beyond exhausted. He ‘cares’ to the degree that it affects him negatively. That is my honest belief.

All your views and examples are really helpful and eye opening. Thank you all.

@steppemum I totally agree with your post at 12.21.11. But I know people who think love should just flow naturally forever, and in fact, given the stresses of childrearing, work, caring for sick/elderly parents/relatives, redundancy, house moves, illness etc, it doesn't. I always feel sad when the MN default answer is to LTB rather than give a bit of space and respect to each other. I've fallen in and out of love with DH a few times over the long course of our marriage (been together 25 years. And a couple of weeks ago he suddenly fell in love with me again. It was a bit disconcerting. Even he admitted it was weird. He suddenly couldn't take his eyes off fat, middle-aged me and kept getting all soppy and romantic. I know I've done the same to him at times. Love in a long marriage isn't a steady line. It has dips and troughs.

@Gugglebum I found being direct with DH really helped. He doesn't (or didn;t used to) notice if you;re shattered. But if you say, "I'm too shattered to cook. Will you do it tonight?" he'll do it. And if you do that frequently, he might get the picture. DH has started cooking and shopping regularly. But I remember the days when he asked how the washing machine worked, three years after we'd bought it. Might not work, but worth trying to stop doing it all and ask for him to take over specific jobs.

Gugglebum - compromise must be two way, otherwise it isn't compromise, it is one person's needs being overwhelemed by the other.
Give and take, not just give, give.

If someone loves you, really loves you, then it will upset them to see you tired, run down and struggling. Now there are times when you are BOTH tired, run down and struggling, but in general, when one needs suport the other gives it.

@Mina I love your description, falling in and out of love is exactly it, and it is so lovely to find yourself suddenly falling again for the man you've been with for years. 19 years this year for us.
I totally agree wih needed to give each other space, I also think many younger people walk away too quickly when the emotions are at a low dip. When they pick up again, they are often stronger and all the more powerful for having had that low point.

Mine sounds like the OP too. Married for 17, together for 20. DH said last August he didn’t think ‘we work’ and has given me a very specific and comprehensive list of criticisms which apparently serve as examples as to why we are not compatible. I think he’s right about the incompatibility but not because I don’t ride my bike fast enough/the way I cross the road (too cautions)/having a favourite kind of food etc etc but I have come to realise the incompatibility is due to the criticism/withdraw dynamic we are stuck in.

We had some counselling. First him by himself then some joint sessions then I had some sessions by myself. The joint sessions were dire. My DH retelling specific and detailed scenarios where I annoyed him, I literally could not believe the words were coming out of his mouth. Full of dislike/disrespect and I was paralysed unable to respond. The counsellor helped me to get my own thoughts together and was balanced and objective but DH didn’t like her as she failed to say ‘yes, your right, it’s all your wife’ I think he thought she would take his side. She took no ‘side’

I am really lonely