How to explain to DS he won't see his father again?

[UtterClusterFluff]

This is a complex issue and I don't want to go into the details because they don't really make a difference to the outcome.

I have just found out my exP has been charged with a serious sexual offence. Due to the nature of it I do not want him to have any contact with DS who is 10.

They had a good but limited relationship with only a few visits a year due to distance. They did keep in touch via the phone in between visits though.

I don't know where to begin with talking to DS about this. I don't not want him to know what has happened at all. This isn't negotiable in my mind.

I just don't know how to say he won't be seeing or talking to him again.

Is it better to tell a version of the truth - as in Daddy has gotten into trouble with the police and we have to stay away from him? Or do I just somehow say that we can't see daddy anymore? I'm so confused. And so so angry but I don't want DS to feel any of that.

Please can someone help with what I should do?

He will say he wants to speak to them I'm sure.

I think initially I will suggest a break to let it all sink in. And some limited skype/card/letter contact between them which is regulated and supervised by me to make sure it is appropriate.

Just be aware that if he is allowed to live or have access to his other children a court may well grant him supervised contact, if not more with your son. If he's not seen as enough of a risk to them to remove access to them then he won't be seen as enough of a ridk to your ds either.

Be prepared for a fight.

Yes I've been told they will be taking me to court if I continue to block access. We have no formal agreement in place at this stage.

I think it's a bit about control at this stage. I was expected to fall in on the "poor depressed thing" party line and I haven't. I want no part of the drama so therefore I'm a sick manipulative bitch making a bad situation worse.

I don’t feel like I am in a position to comment as it’s not a black and white issue. But I thought it worth mentioning - plenty of families live overseas from their families - and contact with cousins / half sibilings etc is usually only limited Skype contact. Maybe consider limited Skype contact with his half siblings until he is at the age where he can decide for himself whether he wants to continue to Skype or not? Since he will soon be a teenager and he may lose interest in younger siblings naturally anyway. At least it will not be you making that decision that he later, rightfully or wrongfully, might be angry at you for seeking a complete ban on contact.

She is supporting him which is totally her choice but I don't want exP to have any input in DS life at all. He must not be allowed to influence who DS will become IMO. She disagrees

It should not be her decision in any part. She can choose how to manage her childrens' relationship with their father. She has no input into yours.

Contact between the half-siblings is a different question altogether and one which does involve her. However, here I would be throwing this back to the social worker, especially if she is threatening court, etc. What do THEY think about her stance? She is already setting out her stall as an apologist for what her partner has done. She is attempting to minimise and excuse his behaviour to her children. What does the social worker think of that? Does she agree that actually, that in itself is ill-advised, even possibly abusive, and does she agree that you are right to want to protect YOUR child from exposure to attitudes that are really not very far away from grooming?
Bat it right back to them and make sure that step-mum knows that these are the point you are raising. She may decide to leave well enough alone in case her actions are also called into question.

As for sibling contact. I'm probably biased in a way - as an adult who considers myself fortunate to have not contact with some pretty dysfunctional siblings. Family relationships can be poison as well as pleasure and support, remember. Be careful what you're letting your DS in for, long term, by maintaining what might turn out to not be such a great set of relationships after all. And in the short term? Well, you say it all above:

The siblings are young. They will mention time with their dad, ask DS why he is not visiting for the summer, talk of family days out etc This will be confusing for DS. He might feel pushed out of the family and blame himself for that.

Yep. That's pretty much what will happen. And if you've got your Ex's partner in the background with her own agenda of getting her ?rapist husband and what he has done made acceptable to children, then your DS is going to end up manipulated.

What he has done is just too terrible. I don't think you can separate the two things. He can't do that and still be a good person/dad.

If that is the case then I would fight for no contact and I would absolutely throw these questions back to the social workers. What do they think of the agenda being pushed at the 'other home' to make this crime ok, explained away, it's all fine, Daddy was just depressed? Is this ok and is it safeguarding the children of the family? It does not look like that from where you are standing.

Is it on the Internet? You don't want dd to google and find out that you lied.
I'd go with Daddy is in trouble with the police and they said that he can't see ds until he's an adult. If he asks about the crime then I'd say he hurt someone badly rather than explain sexual assault.

I think letter contact with the siblings for the time being which is stopped immediately if the wife tries to put across exes case in the letters.
Building up to more contact with siblings when child is older.

I think you are totally justified in stopping contact with the father.

I seriously doubt they will take it to court and get anywhere. Especially as im guessing it is some kind of child sex offence... presumably either child porn or coming on to a young teenager.. both are which are regularly minimised by families
They wont be minimised in a court of law however.

The other thing to think through is this.

Right now, it's all just happened. Feelings are running high. Step mum is not thinking straight really - and who can blame her. Right now she's doing the equivalent of 'hysterical bonding' in a way - just going all out to keep things as they are, to not 'lose' her life as she knows it - she's in shock, probably.

But that will change. If he goes to prison for a significant time, it is likely that they will quite possibly split up. She may change how she feels about him and the crime very drastically in the coming months. She may change her mind not only about the level of contact she wants her children to have with him, but also with their sibling via him. If they did split and she met someone else, that goes triple.

So be cautious on that front too. Again, minimal to no contact with you firmly in charge and keeping her and her opinions OUT of your decision making process is probably best.

Thank you again for the support and advice. I'm struggling a bit to talk about this in real life as it's such a horrible thing. It sounds silly but I feel a small sense of shame for even having let him near me given the type of person he has become.

crazedzombie sadly it is on the internet. I know one day DS may look and find the reports. I am more worried that others in his life will make a connection and he will be bullied at high school for it too.

FizzyGreen thank you for your measured response. You've managed to put how I feel into better words then I did. You are right, I will put the questions back to them. I have spoken with their social worker I believe DS step-mum has told them she is waiting for the facts and has kept things neutral. They said they do not feel his own children have been harmed. The only concern she really spoke about was that he was not a 'present' figure when he had care of them. They told her he was always on his phone/laptop etc At this stage they are assessing the family and have not handed down any conditions other then contact is supervised by mum.

I have asked for no contact for the time being but it's not gone down well. I will see how DS handles the news and judge what's best regarding his siblings.

I'm not raising it with him until he asks me which may be in a week or two. This weekend we are scattering the ashes of my own mum so I am aware he's feeling a big loss already. We are trying to grieve her and he will now have another huge portion of his family removed because of that selfish disgusting man.

I’m sorry to hear about your Mum 💐, this is the last thing you need right now x

Only you know what’s best for your DS, but hopefully different opinions will help you to decide.

Obviously, this is all only my opinion.

Firstly I would pay privately for DS to be assessed. I would have to know whether he’d been subjected to anything himself, including ‘innocent’ photographs. I’d get this done ASAP & before talking to DS about his father.

I would be asking the police what they do to see if he has photos of DS.

Then I’d talk to DS. I think 10 year olds can handle the truth better than being fobbed off. I think you risk really damaging your relationship with DS if you’re not honest with him.

He’s 10, even if he doesn’t, most of his mates will have access to the internet. The last thing I’d want is him finding out via google.

I would explain that the police have found out that his father has been doing something illegal and hurtful to children. Then I’d explain what he’s done, in very broad terms.

I would tell him that he won’t be able to see his father, that he will be in prison (one hopes anyway) for a long time. If he asks about calling/Skyping then I’d explain it can’t happen right now, but maybe at some time in the future.

Then talk to him about his siblings and their Mum. Explain that she’s trying to excuse what he has done and there are no excuses. NONE. Tell him that you won’t be seeing them for a while until she understands that what their father did isn’t excusable.

It’s hard to accept that someone you love could do something so awful, there’s a real disconnect. He’ll go through a lot of different emotions. I’d tell him that he can talk to you anytime or you’ll find someone neutral he can talk to. Tell him it’s categorically not a secret, but it might be good not to tell his friends etc for a while, because you can’t untell stuff and later on he might wish he hadn’t told them.

It’s bloody tough on you both.

Poor DS x

...and all of the children involved.

My children have been at school with kids whose parents' crimes were reported in the local papers. They said that the overwhelming mood in the classroom was "poor kid for having a shit parent. Must be embarrassing that everybody knows." Hopefully this is the treatment that your son will get if this comes out but hopefully it can just be brushed off as a stranger as he wasn't living at the same address as ds which is often the part of reports.

If you're forced to have contact with half-siblings and step parent, then make sure you're there at all times; and when those awkward questions are asked, answer them honestly. "We don't see XXX because he did some terrible things, and it's not safe for children to spend time with him." Give the awkwardness back to the step mother. Let her deal with the fall-out. Because so long as she's making excuses for this vile man, she's part of the problem.

Well how bad is what your ex has done? If it’s as bad as you’re making out, his wife won’t be allowed to let their joint DC see him.

Is he going to be going to prison? Any idea how long for?

Can the kids come to yours? Failing that and going NC, can you say exP has moved to Austrialia/russia/Works on an oil rig?

Personally in this case I'd lie.... How old is he?

If he is not considered to be a threat to his resident children it is unlikely that a court will sanction no contact with your DC.

For you. I completely understand and would feel the same way but it might not be your decision to make.

Is it better to tell a version of the truth - as in Daddy has gotten into trouble with the police and we have to stay away from him?

Yes, do that.

“In trouble with the police” is fine for now.

On conviction, or when your DS asks, “because he hurt someone” is honest.

Later, you can add details about the punishment and the nature of assault.

Whatever you do, don’t go down the oil rig/job in Australia route. It will be so important to your DS later that he can trust you and that you didn’t lie. Also that he doesn’t tell friends that his dad has this glamorous foreign job and feel silly later. There’s the increasing risk, as he goes into secondary and onwards that other people he meets will know the truth or make the connection.

You’re doing the right thing

Circle - there is currently no contact order so presumably they would have to take OP to court in order to get one. She may well end up being able to argue for indirect contact.

There is no contact order between us. He made the decision not to see DS for the first 3 years so isn't even on the birth certificate. I left the door open and when he did contact me we arranged it between ourselves and it has always been amicable.

Contact for his other children has to be supervised at this stage whist social services make their assessment.

I think I could comfortably argue that there should be no contact whilst the court case goes on. This could take months I've been told.

I do not feel I need an actual conviction to make this decision though because he readily admitted it - seemingly thought he could 'explain it' because of his made up mental health issues.

I know it might be a court fight eventually. I just feel I couldn't condone his behaviour and let a person like this be a male role model for my son. I need to be able to say I did everything I could to protect DS especially from the wider society stigma that may get attached to him.

For those asking, yes it was involving children. According to the first social worker I spoke to they aren't overly concerned about DS because he is not exs 'usual target' but that means little to me. He is a disgusting person who gave up his right to be a parent when he showed his own gratification will come above harming a child.

And having had lots of advice on here I really think I have to go with a version of the truth that is appropriate. DS must always be able to trust me.

As tempting as it is to say that Daddy has moved away that would be selfishly for my benefit of avoiding the awkwardness.

I'm going to say that Daddy has done something very bad and it means we are not allowed to talk with him whilst he is in trouble with the police.

If he isnt on the birth cert and it isnt court ordered crack on. Do dc and father share a name? Is there anything on the internet that links them?.
I agree with pp. A true version at a level they can understand. But 10 is a tricky age.

No, he has my name. Nothing to link us at all. Local people and friends to him know of DS as he visits but all mentions are of his wife and their children thankfully. (for us obviously - but terrible for them)

Completely agree that he needs to know the truth. Tell him as much as you think he can handle and in a way that he'll understand eg. "Your dad has been found by the police doing illegal things. Because of what he's done he was taken to court and the judge decided he needs to go to prison to punish him and protect the people he might hurt but doing what he did. What he did hurt children and he's now not safe for children to be near him." Etc etc.

It really depends what he's done and on what scale how much you chose to tell your son. Please point out to him that his dad chose to do these things and it doesn't mean he (your ds) will be like him when he grows up. Alot of boys worry they will become their dad!

You need to be honest - Daddy has done something bad and you think it's best if they don't see each other anymore.

You say he's been charged. What happens if he is found not guilty?

Jimwentto in my mind, a not guilty verdict would not change anything because he openly admitted it. He has told social workers and the police what he has done (or admitted what they presented to him - I'm sure there may be other stuff they are yet to uncover)

unsure I do want to make that a strong point - that he will not be like his dad. DS is quite sensitive in many ways. If he has done something a bit mean he will quickly feel he is the worst person ever etc. That's a big worry around why I'd rather he not know what's happened but I think he needs a version of the truth and I will have to work on his insecurities