Pil woes

[susannahmoodie]

So my in laws.....they are like cats.....as in they are happy if they are on their own territory or their own terms. Now fil is retired they spend their time gardening and cooking - they will literally spend days in their kitchen preparing for a dinner party and they aim to be self sufficient in eggs, veg and meat. Fil is a great cook and they spend a lot of time entertaining. Which is lovely, and we love going to see them and spending time with them at heir lovely home. If we go to a restaurant/hotel/cafe with them which they have recommended or discovered they will wax lyrical about how wonderful it is, but they will very generously take us out and they are very hospitable.

The unfortunate flip side of this is that conversely, no where else is good enough for them or can match their high standards. If it was a meal I’m out that I had organised for them, they would be snooty and turn up their noses. And if they are out of their comfort zone of their own home and smallholding then they are utterly miserable.

This seemed to come to a head last weekend. Ds their eldest grandson was 7 so we invited them to a party tea in the afternoon. They arrived and barely lifted their heads to say hello to anyone. it was so obvious they didn’t want to be there. They were miserable and silent and conversation was despite the best efforts of me and my parents who were also there, very stilted. I have a photo of everyone singing happy birthday and they both have scowls on their faces while everyone else is smiling and singing. They refused any birthday cake which my mum had made, and then later complained to my sil who they went to see afterwards that the cake was “dry” 🤔 (despite the fact that they didn’t eat it). The thing that upset me the most however is that my sister was there with her husband. She is 27 weeks pg with her first child, which they knew about, and she is visibly pregnant. They have not seen her in a year or so as she lives at the other end of the country, but they have known her for 17 years....and they didn’t acknowledge her happy news in any way, didn’t say congratulations or anything. They ignore me- they pointedly ask DH if he has a busy week at work coming my up but would never ask me the same question even though I am the main breadwinner and DH works pt.

I know the cake wasn’t up to their culinary standards but I don’t give a shit about that- it was made with love by my mum for her grandson. Our house isn’t as pristine as theirs is, but I am ok with that as we both have busy jobs/ lives and two small dcs, whereas they spend literally all their time keeping their house and garden immaculate and cooking.

We are supposed to be going to France with them for a week this summer and I feel like telling DH I don’t want to go if they are Going to be so miserable. They never used to be like this. They are estranged from one of my bils (as are we, long story) and I wonder if that is a factor in their abject misery. But they aren’t like that at their house. Is there any point in addressing this with them? I find some of their behaviour just so so rude.

What does your DH think?

He did comment that they seemed "quiet" but isn't bothered other than that. Now that I think about it it is mil who is much worse than pil, in all of the examples I have described. I could maybe go with the "is mil ok?" angle if I bring it up....

A week when they are hard work for an afternoon? No thanks!!

Your DH is key here. What does he think of his parents behaviours and what sort of a relationship does he himself have with them these days?.

I would cancel the week's trip to France with them given their behaviour towards you all as a family. You would not put up with this from a friend, let alone relations. They are no different.

They were probably quiet also because they are not having their own way here. They showed their disapproval of you all by their behaviours.

Does he want to go to France with them?

What are your DH's boundaries like when it comes to his parents, does he have FOG (fear, obligation and guilt) re them in spades?.
Does he seem to go into "child" mode when they are around him, is he seemingly far more subservient in their presence?.

I wouldn't say subservient or childish. He gets on with them and seems to let this stuff wash over his head.

Personally, I would sit down with them, without any children present, and tell them exactly what you've told us. Not with whinging or crying, but matter-of-factly. Tell them how their attitude makes you feel, and how perplexing this all is. If you don't try to handle this like an adult, the resentment will only build until you explode.

Are they always like this or was it a once off?
If a once off perhaps they had bad news health wise or a financial problem that had them worried.

I think they have got more and more like his over the last couple of years. DH and I have been together for 17 years, married for 10, and mil used to be the life and soul of the party when we were younger. Now she's just so unhappy and sour and disapproving. I went through a tough time with her when I had ds1 as I felt that she was very critical - usual comments re why isn't he sleeping through and "he can't possibly be hungry again" when I was bf, but I got over it and though things were improving. But now I feel like that have got worse!

I should add neither me or DH ever tackled any of these comments re ds1 at the time, which perhaps we should have, but things slowly improved as I became more confident as a parent and especially after having ds2

My PIL are exactly like this. Very hospitable in their own home (even though one tends to feel obliged to wax lyrical over their culinary creations as praise is very much expected) but make dreadful guests elsewhere. A lot of their behaviour when out is fuelled by MIL's anxiety and tendency to define herself by her homemaking skills. We now only see them in their own home where they feel happy. We also minimise visits.

After a couple of disastrous holidays with them we said never again. I'd rethink that week in France if it's possible to get out of OP.

Some women find anxiety increases after menopause. This can result in the social rudeness and taking any difference from what they would do as stressful or perceived as criticism. (Being charitable here, maybe more than they deserve!)
Maybe FIL is mirroring her anxiety, or trying to minimise it by discouraging anything 'different'.
Either way, I'd try to get out of the holiday.

Have you told your DH what you’ve aid here?

I can’t do anything accept withdraw from them emotionally, or even physically, unless he sees and agrees and backs you up.

I have just had a heart to heart with DH about it. He knew I was annoyed but not really the full extent of it. He says he will speak to his dad.

So basically they - or mil in particular - have always been like this.
They just masked the true extent of their self absorption/narcissistic traits.

Now they feel comfortable enough in their 'training' of you - i.e you either don't 'notice' it and if you do then you always tolerate and accept it - that they don't need to wear that mask anymore.
They're using their 'comfort zones' and 'culinary' snobbery to control you and also to keep themselves centre of attention.

You can change all this by enforcing your own boundaries......

I'd have to reduce contact with them. I hate confrontations and would rather keep my distance.

The holiday in France isn't something I'd be going on.

They came to your home for the afternoon and ignored you? No way would I go awya for a week with someone who did that.

I can relate slightly to this in that MIL refuses to allow anyone to make her a cup of tea when she visits. She HAS to make it herself. Only her tea making skills are good enough. If I make her a cup.of tea, she won't drink it. I think it's rude. She is a bad house guest. In the past she had rearranged my kitchen shelves on visits, pokes her nose into things she shouldn't in my home. In her own home, everyone must sit down and be good whilst she plays the dutiful host; I don't even know where she keeps her mugs. If I were to make my own drink... she'd be furious. I think people get ruder as they get older!

Yes she has done the thing of rearranging the cupboards. When I was in hospital having ds1 she came to our house and rearranged things and in our bedroom she moved the Moses basket away from the side of the bed to the other end of the room . She also bought loads of dummies and left them all over the house even though I'd said I wanted to avoid hem at least at first while I tried to establish feeding.

But as I said that was 7 years ago and I thought things had improved.

@HeebieJeebies456 do you have practical advice for establishing boundaries?

This feels like a slightly more extreme version of a lot of ageing couples I know, my parents included. I agree with pp who said just go to their house then. I suspect there is some underlying anxiety that’s probably not about you. Though it’s admittedly a little sad, rearrange things so that you socialize with them on their terms. I wouldn’t confront them or have it out with them. Gah! So many funny behaviors to have to avoid as we age!

They are still in their 50s though! God I hope I don't get like this as I age. My parents are mid 60s and are far more sociable than me!