Those of you with narcissistic mothers

[endthefarts]

I don't know if my mother fits the criteria for being a narcissist or whether she's just a passive aggressive, self obsessed pain in the arse who likes to talk about how amazing she is. However, whichever she is, I find her extremely difficult to be around and my hackles are up within minutes of being in her company.

She's definitely got worse with age and has become unbearable over the last 10 years, and until I was about 30 I could be in her company without feeling like punching her quite happily. When I look back on my childhood, she was always highly strung and over protective and rubbed other women up the wrong way, but I can't work out if she displayed the behaviours that she displays now or whether she was actually a lovely mum. Were you aware that your mums were awful as a child or did you love them because they were your mum and children love their mums? I'm trying to get my head around whether she damaged me as a child without me having any idea or whether she's just become a monster as she's aged. Thanks.

Where does anyone say only mothers can be narcs?

I would say that my mother has borderline personality disorder rather than narcissistic personality disorder but there are many similarities. She is incapable of a normal conversation and she still flies into rages. I was the black sheep with my siblings the golden children. I still have contact with her but I think it will affect me my whole life. Its very damaging when the person who is supposed to be the one person who will always love and care for you is the person most harmful to you who you need to protect yourself from. Ofc it doesn't help that bpd and npd mothers deny everything - its never her fault, only mine. Even episodes of violent attacks are because she was provoked or else completely denied even hours later.

Flowers to everyone here with a toxic mother.

Still - its not a debate . Its some women talking about their toxic mothers and how damaging they are. Its not their fault that their mothers are awful. I think a different thread would be more appropriate for your comments.

The point of this thread is that the op has observed something about her mother and has asked for other people’s experience of the same thing. By reading those experiences ( and unfortunately there are many) the op is able to take comfort and get advice on where to go from here.

What the op DID NOT do was come on here and ask who were most likely to be narcissist? Mothers or daughters? If she had, then your point is valid.

But she did not. She did not ask for a debate, she asked for advice from people who were in a similar situation.

And for what it’s worth. I have seen threads from mothers posting about their narc daughters and have had nothing but support.

My mother has always told me verbally what a brilliant mother she is, how much better she is than other mothers. While acting in neglectful, abusive ways. She still spouts the same trite crap but after years of sorting out the headfuck of my upbringing I know it's just a lie she's telling herself to make herself feel better. I don't want or need her to be the best mum in the world. I just wanted her to be my mum, instead of an insatiable emotional black hole who dominated my every waking moment.

When I became pregnant she took me aside and had a weird conversation/emotional outburst at me about whether or not she would be allowed to see the baby when it was born. This is in the context of no nc, regular phone calls and visits. I was mystified.

Now baby is almost a year old, I'm finally considering nc. Combination of her outrageous behaviour and because becoming a mother myself has been the final straw in terms of thinking there's any justification in what she did to me. I wonder if that conversation she had with me was because she knew the game was up, she knew once I was a mother I would gain the ultimate insight into her sickness.

Genuinely that's how I feel. It's over. Whatever semblance of a relationship we had, it's over now. I can forgive her in the sense of not harbouring resentment, but there will be no reconciliation. God knows I've tried so many times to have a real conversation with her and got nowhere. So it's over.

Strange how she predicted it. I never did. I used to think we were best friends, she was my strongest ally. Nope. She simply owned me.

I don't think my mother has NPD, but she certainly has narcissistic behaviours, and as a result I had an emotionally abusive childhood, as the scapegoat (my older brother is the Golden child).

My Grandmother on the other hand, ticked fair more of the classic NPD boxes, and I think my mothers behaviour is the consequence of being raised by a narc. My mother has very low self esteem, high anxiety (which she projects onto me), and very poor parenting technique (emotional blackmail/ mind games as punishment from a young age, controlling, and very negative about me, my appearance and achievements even though I was a generally high achiever).

My Dad died 6 months ago and in the year that he was terminally ill my mother was an even bigger nightmare (partly because I had to see more of her), but she also got herself so exhausted/ stressed out caring for my Dad that she ended up physically ill (and nearly black listed by the care agency providing home care to my Dad, but that's a whole other story!!!). Since Dad died it is far more obvious how fragile and vulnerable she is, and rather than going NC (which was my plan whilst Dad was ill) I now pity her. She is trying to make an effort now as well, so will see how it goes (she is still a proper pain in the arse at times though!!).

Spoke to my uncle when he came back to the UK during my Dads illness, and it turns out my Mum was the Golden child, I had always had it in my head that she was the same as me, the scapegoat, but apparently not....just goes to show that it does not really matter which you are, scapegoat or golden child, have a narcissistic mother can really screw you up for life.

All I can hope for now is that I have enough insight and understanding into narcissists and the fallout that results that I won't make the same mistakes with my soon to arrive DD, but it does terrify me that I might not be able to break the cycle.

Remain, your mother sounds very much like mine.

I thought I had processed my relationship with my mum, we have pretty much non-existent contact, meaning exchanging cards at birthday, mother's day etc. I had a 'big' birthday in the last few days, not even a card arrived. I had many other cards and messages and feel loved and valued by many but to not receive one from my mum has really hurt which has taken me by surprise, I thought I had moved on but obviously not. Even if a card arrives in a few days, it just shows how unimportant I am. I know she is ok as I have heard from extended family. Such is life, just wanted to tell someone how I feel and not dwell on it!!

My mother has definitely become worse as she’s aged but she’s always been a shocker. As a child I didn’t realise and kept trying to make an emotional connection with her and would get really upset when she shut me down or disappeared or humiliated me when I did. But I kept trying and kept trusting her, only to be ripped into each time. Made me feel pathetic. I imagine that’s exactly how she wanted me to feel.

As an adult, particularly since becoming a mother myself, I’ve come to realise she’s not a normal mum. Always just thought she was tough but fair, but I was wrong. She’s got serious issues but can’t say I would ever be in any position to know how to classify her. Pretty sure only a psych could do that.

When I think back to all the damaging things she did when I was young I think about little ghostedgirl and feel really, really sad for her. She’s definitely damaged me and I believe I would never have such a messed up idea of what love really means if I had had a “normal” mum, and never tolerated the abuse, bullying and neglect I’ve tolerated in my life without battering an eyelash in the face of it. I don’t know how to be a normal person myself. Don’t even know where to start. Just hope I don’t do the same to my child.

Mine is probably a narc - certainly had those tendencies. Her mother did too. As I child I loved her but was utterly terrified of her too. The behaviour swings were totally unpredictable. As I grew older she tried to be a friend, not a mother - so long as it was on her terms, of course. I have been emotionally drawing away for the last 20 years and it is about 10 years ago that I saw the light, as it were, about her behaviour. Everything is about her. If a family member is ill or has a problem she will make it all about how badly it affects her.

I would not have thought it to be of much value to agonise over whether one's mother is a narc or not. Now you know of the possibility, OP, I am sure you will do much reading up on the subject. I'd recommend concentrating on what you can do to make things better for you, not what might or might not afflict her.

You have my sympathy. It's helpful when the realisation comes, as it explains many things - but it's grim too.

I was always aware, she abused me and I had a deep fear of her but I had to put on a brave face. She's gotten worse with age. I confronted her and she turned very nasty indeed, (jekyll and hyde!) I hope to never hear from her again. I found Richard Grannon on youtube, his videos are a big help in letting me know I'm not the crazy one :)

I used to often stay for a week in the summer with cousins when I was a child. I never wanted to go back home.

I should have known from this that thee was a problem with her but it was all I knew and thought all kids were treated pretty similarly. I did try to please her but it was a losing battle. I can remember her being very unhappy a lot of the time and being nasty about a lot of people. I used to get very confused as she was really nasty and went on and on year after year about several relatives which I either had no problem with or knew were lovely. My brother was the golden child and I was scapegoated.

I was confused by one girl at school who told me how her mother hadnt liked mine when they were at school. Couldnt see why. Now I can.

I never felt loved . Sometimes family did feel nice and we had some nice times but then she would be horrible about something or be unhappy about something and the atmosphere would change again.

So glad I have been NC for about 6 years. Any time I think of her I just feel relief that I dont have to have anything to do with her any more.

My mother has got progressively worse with age, now she has a terminal illness it has certainly made the situation unbearable.

I am the scapegoat or the black sheep of the family. My younger brothers have always been the golden children. I have known this for as long as I can remember.

She is very toxic, nasty, selfish, mean person. I didn’t realise until I had my first child, then it hits you, I could never treat my child like this.

It still hurts, I have to really try hard to not seek her approval, I would never get it! To try not to make her like me, love me even. How can a mother never show love or affection to a child? So damaging.

If I don’t do exactly what she wants or jump through her hoops, she is vile. Tells me don’t contact me, your dead to me. I don’t exist.

I the past I have taken this as I need to try harder, she will love me.
Now slowly I am realising I need to walk away, buts it’s not easy, all my life I have gone running to her. How do you walk away?!

I am trying to stay away. To protect myself.

My heart goes out to anyone who has this damage in their life

@endthefarts - look up enmeshment. That's the problem I have with my mother. She very much believes that I am her and can't cope with me having thoughts, opinions and beliefs other to her. I don't know if she did ever read my diary, but she warned me my sister might (which I think was code for 'she might') but she would insist on reading any text messages that I got and hated it when I eventually put my foot down and said they were private, as she just couldn't comprehend how they could be.

Everything I do that goes against her beliefs etc I obviously only do to hurt her. The fact that I might want to say work in a bookshop instead of teach, again, she can't comprehend. Apparently I spend my life trying to hurt her as much as possible rather than living my own life.

It's my sister who's a narc. She wasn't physically abusive, but she ticks every other point on the earlier list. I have little to do with her.

Reviving this thread - tis the season - to feel crap about having a narc mum. Family occasions are the worst - even though I have been NC with both my parents for going on 3 years. Don’t regret the decision, but still crippled by the pain of having to do it. DH supportive but understandably tired of propping me up after all this time, and dealing with the buckets of tears when I am triggered. So f*ing hard

I'm with you. This will be my second Christmas no contact with my parents and golden child sibling. I am trying desperately hard to get excited for my little children, going overboard with decorations, presents, festive trips out, Xmas food etc and lots of social activities. But my heart hurts. I can't ever see myself wanting to reconcile but also can't imagine this void/pain/shame will ever leave me.
I cry most days. Not over the loss of my actual mother, but over the loss of the family I thought I had. Christmas just brings it all to the surface. I also feel ashamed and guilty when people ask why I'm not seeing my family over the festive period. I have to keep reminding myself I have nothing to feel guilty about. All I have done is walk away from my Narcissistic mothers abuse. The guilt lays with her.

There is no ‘debate’, still , this thread is obviously for people burdened with toxic, abusive narcissist for mothers, if you want a ‘debate’ or to chat about your shit daughter, feel free to start a new thread instead of hijacking this one. HTH.

www.bethanywebster.com/you-dont-owe-your-mother-for-your-life/

OP there’s an excellent long running thread here for those of us burdened with scum for relatives 💜

It gets easier with time (as does everything but it doesn’t help much when you are in it)

I look back at my Christmas’s and compare them to my dhs and I can see how they were lacking. My dh has such wonderful memories of his. They didn’t have much money but they were full of love and happiness. Mine were not.

So I am thankful that I never have to go though that again and that I can provide my children with happy and loving memories that they will look back on and cherish.

The grieving for what should have been is harsh but enjoy the silence and be thankful you aren’t in it anymore.

And when you need it, give that inner child of yours a big cuddle of love.

Thanks for responding - it’s nice (?!) to know others are out there feeling the same and I am not alone. I agree @whattheactualduck and @Aussiebean it’s totally the fantasy of what it should have been like that I am grieving, the reality would/did suck. And the guilt and shame for NC that should be theirs, we carry. I found myself lying to new work colleagues about our xmas plans, then cursing myself for wishful thinking. I hope time and making new memories with our actual loving family and children will heal us all. Big hugs all round xx

Sounds like she is. Sorry

Sorry I don't know how to tag. I find I can't lie about my estrangement, I just try to change the subject very quickly if asked about my family at Christmas. It's especially hard when my in-laws enquire about what's going on as they wouldn't understand.
I don't know about anyone else but I have lost my entire extended family, bar 1 Aunt, as a result of going NC with my parents & sibling. It's so very sad, my heart breaks a little more each day that they have all turned against me and in turn are supporting my Narcissistic mother. They will all be gathered together exchanging gifts spouting their hatred of me. My mother will be playing the victim, lapping up the attention. She will have a lovely Christmas, continuing her abuse through her smear campaign against me to isolate me as much as she can.
As lonely as I am, as heart wrenching as it is to think of what this means for my path in life, it's still 100 x better than being in contact with that witch.
Peace & love to all daughters of Narcissistic mothers!

Personally I think it’s ok for still to add her bit, it’s not totally directly relevant but does add some perspective. Maybe not so helpful for someone in first “heat” or pain of realisation. I have / had a v difficult relationship with my mother. I would also say that there is a difference between full blown NPD, and someone with a number of narcissistic traits. Anyway lots of helpful posts on here, I hope helpful to you OP

PS my sense growing up was not that my mum was “lovely”. I am a bit amazed / puzzled when people talk about their wonderful mother or father. I would have had the same outlook as a child I think. My mother was not abusive to me as a child but there was a lot of distant behaviour. In some ways like being brought up by a great aunt. We went through more hellish “relationship” when I was an adult including NC. We are closer now though, she seems more chilled and even warmer. Though her old madness does peak through occasionally...

This thread really resonates with me. @ghostedgirl, I could have written your post. The damage done takes a long time to resolve itself, if it ever does. I look back at 5 year old me and I want to pick her up and cuddle her and tell her she is loved and she is enough.
I think I was a teenager before I realised it might be my mother rather than me that was the problem. Other girls mums seemed to like them, wanted to spend time with them and buy them fashionable clothes etc. My older sister and myself were criticised, belittled, physically abused, sworn at, laughed at; at times she was like a nasty, spiteful child. I'll never forget one day (I was about 10 or 11) and my friend said to me "Isn't it funny how my mum's so nice and yours is so horrible?" I think it brought it home to me then. She WAS horrible, even other people could see it. But, like she told us, that was our fault and we were terrible, useless, hateful children and. I spent most of my life trying to win her love and approval. I gave up when I had my own children and did my best to protect them from her.

Oh I wish I’d been as quick off the mark as you Sagittarius!

Unicorn81's list is so similar to Ex's mum. I don't think children realise exactly what their parents are like until they are older and see other families operate. This often happens when they move away from home and then more dramatically when they have children of their own. Age seems to exacerbate behaviour and narcisstic traits are known to get stronger in old age.

I wonder if science will help society understand why some people, growing up in a toxic home, become disordered and others manage to avoid it. Genetics must play a part and I read once that genetics loads the gun and environment is the trigger.