Choosing partner and younger children over unruly older children

[Storminateacup74]

There is lots going on in my extended family at the moment and my cousin has just had to put her two teenage children into care. Her oldest child left home at 16 and she doesn't know where he is or what he does now and her middle 2 were out of control and both had been excluded from school. She has a new partner now and 2 other children who are 5 and 7 now who are close to exclusion - she has been very lax in her parenting style no boundaries at all no bed times total free rein and her new partner has left her before because she will not disipline the children. Due to school exclusions social services have been involved and have said that they think the reason the younger ones behaviour is so bad is probably because they are copying the older ones. So to give the younger ones a chance she has to get them away from the older ones. Older childrens dad is inside so no option there. Social services asked us if we could have the older ones for a while but i hate admitting it but i would be scared knowing the things they have done and the way they treat people so we said no. Her partner also said he is willing to stay and try be a family but only if the older ones dont live with him anymore. Basically making her choose between her older kids or her younger kids and their dad. Social services said the only option is foster care for the older ones. They have been in care now for a few weeks but both kids have completely disowned her and she is beside herself with guilt ahout putting them in care. On the upside though her 2 younger ones are like different kids and I have heard on the grapevine that her teenage daughter is with a lovely family and is starting to conform more with societies norms. She says she should never be forgiven for choosing her partner over her children. Everyone always says you should always put your children first but in this situation I think she had to do what she did. Just wondered what others opinions are.

I hope she goes on a parenting course.
I hope she gets some counseling to unpick her issues.
I hope the older children get help and support to grieve the lost and abandonment they almost certainly feel. Plus help to process the anger they will feel.

I hope in time sibling contact is resumed in a safe supported environment.

A complete mess and one which needs a lot of SS intervention .

Your cousin would do well to realise Social Services didn't do this to her. They simply had to react to the situation.

You sound like a bit of a enabler too op to be honest. It’s not the older ones leading the younger ones astray. It’s your sisters piss poor parenting. Maybe you should have stepped in sooner to support the older one instead of providing care and sympathy to your shitty sister

She sounds awful . The whole family sound rough and the poor kids deserve better ! I can't understand how anyone can be like this towards their children

this isn’t always because of laziness...

It sounds like she was a permissive parent in response to her authoritarian childhood.

It is perfectly possible that the whole problem was that she was very caring and loving and warm but because of her hang ups rejected any form of structure, discipline or expectations.

If that’s the case it is, obviously worse for the kids, sad for everyone.

I'm surprised at how hard everyone is being on OP'S cousin. I agree with Offered, it sounds like she reacted against her own upbringing and went too far in the other direction.
It also sounds like SS made the right call to remove the elder children so that cousin can concentrate on bringing the younger ones back on track.
Very sad for all involved but sounds like things are moving forward in the right direction. OP: I don't think your cousin should feel she "chose" one family over the other. She took the sensible course of action, as identified for her.
I hope everyone takes the support offered to them and makes the best of things from here

This is a very sad situation, and I hope that your sister is going to get herself on a parenting course and/or counselling so she changes the way she parents the younger children.
With regard to the older two, other relatives could offer them a lot of support and show their love for them. Having said that, it can be difficult
to feel love for teenagers who are angry/ acting out/ rude. Sometimes the most you can do, is just to stick with them until they eventually get a bit older and hopefully more sensible. Would it be possible for you and lots of other relatives to offer them weekend stays (maybe separately?) with you? Or days out, over for Christmas etc etc? This sort of support will be invaluable to them, and make them feel that they still have a family. It may also help repair some of the damage done by your sister in due course,
Please bear in mind that permission from ss will be required to do this, which will take time to get, especially if you want it in time for Christmas.

Thousands of pounds of taxpayers money no doubt having to be pumped in to sort out the mess created by these inadequate people. Poor kids. "Lovely" - I don't think so.

Firstly I hope that your cousin realises she shouldn't have any more children.
Secondly it is possible to be a kind, caring parent yet still discipline your children.
The fact that the teenager is making progress after a short time with another family is very promising.
I'm deeply concerned that a 5 year old is at risk of exclusion that is not normal.
I agree with the poster who suggested that you, along with others offer days out/day restbites to the dcs. The foster parents may well want a break to and the dcs need to know that they are loved and wanted.
Teenagers are hard work, you can't just disown them though!

Well yes it is Emily, but my point was really that people scarred by their own childhood often lack the skills to be adequate parents.

The generally accepted view is that children respond best to authoritative parents who match their love and warmth with high expectations, structure and fair punishment. Children of authoritarian (parents know best, rigidly structured, low warmth) or permissive parents (warm and loving but low expectations, lack of boundaries/structure) can have problems.

I don’t find it hard to imagine that someone who was scarred by an authoritarian might grow up to be an adult that a. Had no appropriate model for parenting her own kids and b. Had a ‘what not to do’ model that caused her to reject all structure or discipline etc.

It’s perfectly plausible and it isn’t true at all to say ‘well her siblings turned out ok’ because some children are naturally more sensitive than others and so more badly affected.

I just think it is very sad all round, especially because no-one seems to have picked up on it before the cousin’s kids were quite badly damaged; not the cousins herself and not any of the services, yet her children were in the system and on their radar as struggling.