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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

I love him and he loves me but is this hopeless?

82 replies

mumptywumps · 25/10/2017 22:09

I’ve name changed for this.

I’m having trouble forgetting a man who I’m totally in love with (and who I know is also in love with me), but who I cut contact with nearly a year ago. This is going to be long ...

I ‘met’ him over 3 years ago, sort of through work - he lives in another country, we made contact, and became friends on Facebook. Over the next year, I came to really love his mind - he is so intelligent and funny, and is weird/eccentric in similar ways to me. We would exchange the odd comment/message. But it never occurred to me to wonder whether I fancy him, maybe because of the distance and also the fact that he’s 8 years younger than me (he’s 35), and I was also in a relationship. Then it did occur to me how attractive he was - about 8 months after my previous relationship had ended. Since he lived so far away and I knew I wasn’t going to run into him in the street or anything like that, I decided I had nothing to lose by messaging him to tell him that I fancied him. He replied and it turned out that he felt the same way, and had done for some time. We started to exchange long emails, and 10 days later we met up for the day in a city that is roughly mid way between his country and mine (he was going to be there anyway for work). We had the most amazing time - he was wonderful, we talked and talked, and ended up back at his hotel room, although we didn’t have sex (I wanted to, but he held off - he said in an email the next day that he was fearful of falling for me). I went home that evening, and he came with me to the airport. We continued to write emails and also instant messages, he told me that he loved me, our messages were pretty constant and passionate. He came to visit me for a couple of days about a month later, he met my kids and was really sweet with them (e.g. kept asking me before he arrived what they liked and trying to think of ways to please them and make a good impression - he doesn’t have kids of his own). About a week after he left, he seemed to withdraw from me. He was less passionate in his messages to me, though we would still message for hours. In retrospect, having read up on this and discussed it with male friends, I think he was probably doing that man thing of needing solitude in order to recuperate from strong emotions - but I went a bit paranoid and interrogatory and he was a bit bewildered. After a few days I got a message from him early in the morning where he basically dumped me, giving the most bizarre and implausible reason - he said he had suddenly realised that he wants kids at some point and thinks it would be best not to be involved with someone who already has kids, even though he loves me. I was confused because we had actually talked about this - I had said that I would consider having another child if he wanted that, so he needn’t think that he would have to choose between getting involved with me or having children. He was grateful for that gesture, but clearly seemed like the thought hadn’t even occurred to him before. (I should say that it wasn’t just me talking about big future plans - he did too, in fact he initiated it by talking about one day moving to be with me.) So, anyway, we broke up for this weird reason and didn’t have contact for over 3 months.

After a little over 3 months, during which I missed him intensely and intuitively felt certain that we would get back together because I knew he loved me and his reasons for breaking up just didn’t make sense, he started interacting with me in an indirect way, by ‘liking’ my tweets. For a few days I didn’t do anything, but after that I messaged him saying that I missed him. He said he missed me too. Long story short (ahem, a bit late for that) we resumed regular contact, though not as intense/frequent as before - we weren’t instant messaging, it was more exchanging an email or two each day. He seemed pretty reserved but I didn’t doubt that he loved me - he told me he did, said that he had a connection with me that he didn’t think he’d ever have with anyone else, and he just showed the sort of interest in me that someone who was faking it simply wouldn’t bother with (e.g. not wanting to out myself, but my job involves writing stuff that he is quite interested in, and whenever I would write something new he would ask to see it, read it straight away, and want to talk about it … even though it was often quite dry and heavy-going stuff that a lot of people would get bored with). Basically we kept up that schedule for about 8 months. During that time I expressed a wish to see him again, but he was reluctant - at one point he said that he thought seeing me again would be very intense and emotional (he didn’t say whether that was because of his emotions or mine or both) and that he didn’t think he could cope with that. But anyway, we did meet up - we spent a couple of nights (with my kids) in a city in another country, and then he came back with us for a couple of nights. When he was with me all of his reservation seemed to go away - he talked about moving here (not a direct ‘I’m thinking of moving to be with you, what do you think?’ but more things like, ‘If I were to come and live here, how would we address practical problem X?’), he kept telling me I was perfect, he was extremely affectionate, we talked for hours and hours into the night, he was amazing and engaged with the children, and we had amazing sex. But when he went home again it was back to his somewhat reserved manner. Then, about a month after he’d left, I saw a job advertised in his country, in a city a few hours from his. Given deadlines etc I didn’t have time to broach this with him in the manner I’d like and had to raise it while he was travelling and jetlagged - but I messaged him about it and told him that if he would move to that city to be with us, I’d apply for it. His reaction was a little negative (he told me that his first thought was that it wouldn’t be a good idea) but he said he thought he should have a think about it. He didn’t mention it again until I reminded him, at which point he said that he didn’t want to. He gave reasons only when I pressed him: he didn’t like that city, he was afraid of not being very good at relationships, he wasn’t sure about the big change in lifestyle that would come with living with and being partly responsible for children. Obviously I was disappointed, but given his manner it wasn’t wholly unexpected. I reassured him without trying to persuade him (I didn’t want to make him feel pressured/obliged). So that was that … except, of course, it wasn’t, because then I started thinking about where all this was going, how I’m constantly dissatisfied with things because I’m sort of always waiting for this messaging relationship to develop into something else and it never does. I ended up getting angry with him about something unrelated (unfairly, it turned out), and that brought my emotions to a head … after I calmed down I explained that I was really unhappy with having this relationship that was based on just exchanging emails each day but not really anything else (we’d spoken on skype too, but only once!), and that unless we were going to make plans to be together properly I didn’t think I was able to remain in contact. He said that he couldn’t do that (i.e. be with me ‘properly’), although it was obvious that he didn’t want us to cut off contact. But I did - our last message exchange was nearly a year ago.

Since then I have thought of him pretty much constantly. I know he loves me, and I love him. I find that, in my heart, I know that we’re going to be together again (or at least I did - I’m writing this partly because so much time has elapsed and nothing has happened, and it’s hard to keep hoping). A similar pattern happened again, like the last time we weren’t in contact: 3 months of nothing, then he started liking my tweets. This time I ignored him - if he wants me he will have to use actual language. He kept on doing it, increasingly. After about 4 months of this I hand-made him a gift and sent it to him with a card that said, ‘stop trying to interact with me on twitter and come and live with me instead. I adore you.’ I know he received it. That was in early summer and he never responded … but he did stop interacting with me on twitter, and also (this sounds really stalkerish) I noticed from his instagram that shortly afterwards he visited both of the foreign cities in which he’d met up with me - they are not places he usually visits. A couple of months after sending that package, I sent him a plain card that just said ‘Come and live with me’. That was about 6 weeks ago, and still no word. I know that he’s not a complete arsehole and that he wouldn’t just not reply out of rudeness of lack of concern - he would put me out of my misery if he wanted that. Then there were a couple of tweet likings again - the first I thought could have been an accident, but after the second I blocked him.

My take on this is that he does love me - I really have no doubt of that. And his reluctance to do anything about it arises from a fear of getting more emotionally involved and losing control. There is also the long distance thing, of course - his work doesn’t particularly tie him to one place so he could do that even if he lived with me, but even so he has always lived in the city where he was born so obviously it’s a big step. The way I see things, he loves me but wishes he didn’t, and so his ‘messaging once a day but not seeing each other’ strategy was maybe to give himself small, controlled doses of me (which he wanted and needed) but without committing to me. So going no contact was the right thing to do, I think.

Occasionally I have tried to forget him - a few times I have joined dating sites and tried to give other people a chance, but I am so uninterested in even the ‘objectively’ attractive ones that I feel bad for wasting people’s time, and anyway all it does is hammer home to me that there is only one person I want. I don’t miss male company in general - I’m content(ish) with it being just me and the children (we have no contact with their father), and if nothing happens with the man I love then I think I will just be single - which I say not in a folorn, can’t-live-without-him way, but just as a matter of fact - that’s just how I think things will pan out.

I suppose what I’m interested here is in your reactions to all this. Do I sound mad/deluded? Does it sound like there is any hope for me and this man? There is, after all, nothing material keeping him from me, and I wonder how long someone can keep away from the person they love by sheer willpower/fear of commitment. I keep coming back to the following thought: all I can do is nothing, and whether anything will happen just depends on whether he can live without me.

OP posts:
MistressDeeCee · 26/10/2017 02:55

OP - its easy to get caught up in the romance of it all - star crossed lovers who can't be together, you reading and re-reading his messages etc. But if he wanted to be with you then he would, no matter what. As it is, he is giving you excuses. You'll be there for sex whenever he chooses to pop by, and he likely has someone in his own country anyway. Do stop settling for half a relationship - although its not a relationship really when all said and done - and get busy here do stuff you like and makes you happy, focus on your DCs, aim to meet someone here if thats your thing. Don't lose yourself over a fantasy life that in reality will lead to waiting for crumbs, then inevitably to heartbreak.

He did say in the 1st place he didn't want a relationship and it would have been better for you if you'd listened to him. Unfortunately many men can send sweet messages, ,have amazing sex with you, but still not love you and want you as their lifepartner.

Added to that, its a whole lot of analysing you're doing there over someone you don't know, really. Its not worth it. Look after yourself.

Caprinihahahaha · 26/10/2017 03:05

Hopeless. Pointless
Probably damaging, certainly not healthy.
Mostly in your head

mumptywumps · 26/10/2017 07:54

Thank you for your comments. I know he's not in a relationship but you are right that I need to try to move on.

I was in an abusive relationship for years and I've started to wonder if I'm reacting to that somehow. Before this guy there was a brief thing (pretty much nothing) with a married guy who pursued me and who i was crazy about but who I refused to see unless he made himself single, which he didn't. Now im thinking: married guy, then guy who lives in another country. Maybe my subconscious is trying to get me involved with people who won't work out as a protective thing. Would be annoying if true because it hurts.

OP posts:
Itsonkyme · 26/10/2017 08:01

He's playing games and messing you (and your kids) about.
Have you not thought that when you saw by Instagram he was in the same cities where you had met him, he was "playing the game" because that's all it is, with someone else and was with there with a new "victim" or even his LTP or wife maybe.
There's no future in this "relationship" it's mostly imaginary and in your head anyway.
I'm sorry to say this but you come across as obsessive and naive.
How are your children being affected with an emotionally absent Mother?
Leave it now. You're driving yourself crazy!

Bruceishavingfish · 26/10/2017 08:05

I know he's not in a relationship but you are right that I need to try to move on.

How do you know that?

Bruceishavingfish · 26/10/2017 08:11

You sent him a present and a card that said stop liking me tweets and live with me. He didnt respond. You know he definitely got this.

Then sent him a card saying 'come live with me' again he didn't respond. But then you say

I know that he’s not a complete arsehole and that he wouldn’t just not reply out of rudeness of lack of concern

He hasnt responded twice. Stop making excuses and making him into the hero in this fictional story you have made up. He ignored you. Twice. He doesnt want to be with you.

I am sorry to be harsh, but thos is all in your head. He isnt a nice person. You dont know him at all. And stop involving your kids.

Joysmum · 26/10/2017 08:23

You’ve done all the chasing. All he’s ever done is reeled you back in by liking tweets!

SabineUndine · 26/10/2017 08:29

Whatever you say, I think he’s married.

AnchorDownDeepBreath · 26/10/2017 09:16

He’s just keeping you keen. Probably; to be honest, for the bravado involved in having someone so infatuated that after all the bollocks that he’s put you through; you still send him gifts saying you adore him and he should come live with you - and he doesn’t even have to acknowledge their receipt.

You’re in love with an illusion. None of this was a love story; it never had a happy ending.

Remove absolutely all ways of contacting him and move on. You’ll have a few tough days but you’ve had a few tough years hanging on to this illusion.

PinkTiger · 26/10/2017 11:40

But I did - our last message exchange was nearly a year ago.

Since then I have thought of him pretty much constantly. I know he loves me, and I love him. I find that, in my heart, I know that we’re going to be together again (or at least I did - I’m writing this partly because so much time has elapsed and nothing has happened, and it’s hard to keep hoping)

As others have said, this was always a fantasy relationship. A couple of meetings and a lot of texting is not a relationship.

You haven't had any contact with him for a year but you are still hoping you will end up together? What would you say to a friend of yours who said this to you? It is deluded. You have no idea what is going on in his life. Even if he wasn't married before (which I wouldn't rule out) he may very well be now.

There is something else going on here that is causing you to mentally cling to a non-existent relationship and not let it go. Maybe it is because you don't really want to be involved with anyone and are clinging to this as a screwed-up form of self protection.

grannysmiff · 26/10/2017 11:55

He probably really really really.likes you.

But he doesnt love you.

Im sorry this is going to be very painful x

CaoNiMwahaha · 26/10/2017 12:00

Maybe my subconscious is trying to get me involved with people who won't work out as a protective thing.

I think this could be the case, OP. I've done this myself, so I feel for you!

Best to try to move on and forget this situation.

Flowers
whiskyowl · 26/10/2017 12:07

I'm sorry you're going through this. He's just not that into you, not in the same committed way you are to him.

I think sometimes we deliberately sabotage ourselves with relationships. We chose people whom we know, at some level, are not really available, and then fixate on them. It can be a very effective way of actually avoiding pursuing more healthy, mutually committed relationships after something traumatic has happened. My best friend had the most awful, sickening affair with a married man in similar circumstances, which ended - as these things often do - very badly.

I suspect that if you spent more time with this man, he would grow feet of clay. What you're in love with isn't really "him" but an idealised version of him, in prose, and at a distance. If he were available, I think you'd be less interested. The real work here is on yourself, to figure out why you're doing this.

You sound absolutely lovely, and there are loads of men who will love and cherish you for who you are, rather than being distance, standoffish and unavailable.

Notonthestairs · 26/10/2017 12:15

I think you want to be in love but are actually avoiding being in a full blown relationship (which would then include unromantic stuff like discussing care for elderly parents and pension planning, and fewer grand gestures).
You've clearly been bitten badly in the past and are unsurprisingly now protecting yourself. Maybe you need more time alone, maybe a bit of counselling to help you explore stuff or maybe you need to try OLD again.
In the meantime, accept that this is not the man for you - bin and block and move on. Easier said than I done I know.

missbattenburg · 26/10/2017 12:15

Like others, I am saying this honestly to help, not hurt.

There is a great saying: when someone shows you who they really are, believe them.

This man has shown you that he does not care about you, does not love you and does not want to be with you. So far, you have refused to believe him. He is showing you the truth but you are not accepting it. Instead you are indulging in a fantasy that he is deeply in love with you but his own fears and troubles are preventing him from 'giving in' to how he feels. This is not true. It is the way you wish it was, not how it really is.

Please believe him. Please move on and please, please stop involving your children in this mess.

chocorabbit · 26/10/2017 13:35

How do you know that he is not involved with another woman? You have only met in other cities or your house. Never in his. He would never admit it.

How could you possibly know the reason why he visits those cities? Maybe he travels for work, anyway. Or he might meet with with nice women and away from his city so his long time partner won't know. He recharges, goes back home, dumps them and forgets and forgets until when the need arises again.

it was obvious that he didn’t want us to cut off contact. But I did - our last message exchange was nearly a year ago.

Ermm, no you did NOT cut contact. You still contacted him after a few months by sending him a gift and again to send him a card.

Also, relationships experts have said that some people might look like ideal for one another and have great mutual understanding from the outsiders' perspective BUT many times men end up with women who do not seem to the rest of us as intellectually compatible as them but rather more simple, simply because they prefer somebody fun. So you are his intellectual connection which COULD veer to hedonism for him occasionally but that's it. You are not the woman he would spend his life with.

And again, in the nicest possible way, this reminds me of teenagers trying desperately to find clues that a boy likes them everywhere where they don't exist. "He is too shy to admit it. He said hello to me in this SPECIAL way! He is too emotionally unavailable with X drama in his life and will finally come round. He is inexperienced and doesn't know how to function in a relationship. He is scared of rejection as he is so popular/handsome".

PinkTiger · 26/10/2017 14:32

How could you possibly know the reason why he visits those cities? Maybe he travels for work, anyway. Or he might meet with with nice women and away from his city so his long time partner won't know. He recharges, goes back home, dumps them and forgets and forgets until when the need arises again.

Wouldn't be at all surprised if chocorabbit is bang on the money here. It would totally fit the OPs account.

mumptywumps · 26/10/2017 17:18

*How could you possibly know the reason why he visits those cities? Maybe he travels for work, anyway. Or he might meet with with nice women and away from his city so his long time partner won't know. He recharges, goes back home, dumps them and forgets and forgets until when the need arises again.

Wouldn't be at all surprised if chocorabbit is bang on the money here. It would totally fit the OPs account.*

Ahem ... and post photos on an Instagram page where the username is his actual name? Sorry to disappoint, but there is no such drama. The 'just not into you' explanation is the likeliest, sadly.

OP posts:
Bruceishavingfish · 26/10/2017 17:28

Why is that unlikely?

He is there for work or other reasons. Meets a woman. Also takes snaps in the area and posts them.

I take photos and put them on instagram all the time. You wouldnt know who I was with.

Or he could be single and still be hooking up with different women.

The main odd thing is, that you assumed his visits to those city's had something to do with you.

There are hundreds of reasons he could be there. None of which have anything to do with you.

You seem so sure he isnt in a relationship. You have said he definitely isnt. But you dont know. Fact is, You are still putting him on a pedestal and think he couldnt possibly be a cheater, player or anything negative.

You dont know him. At all. You dont have a clue if he is in a relationship or not. He could be married and have 10 kids. You dont know him or anything about him.

His actions suggest he probably is. Stop contacting him and begging him to comr live with you. You have kids. You dont invite a stranger to move into the home you share with your children

chocorabbit · 26/10/2017 18:14

That's exactly what I was thinking Bruce. You can put photos of a place even from the last time you were there, even 5 years ago.

OP, has he ever put any photos of you and him together so you know he wouldn't be embarrassed for other people to see them? As a family we never do it but IF he has maybe you have a point about him not being into a permanent relationship.

And no, we do not enjoy any drama.

Butterymuffin · 26/10/2017 18:23

This has had plenty of chances to work out. You've made it clear to him that you're interested. It's not happening. Really accept that this time and move on.

rizlett · 26/10/2017 18:23

mumpty the best thing you might consider to do is just to get on with your life and plan what you want to do rather than wait to see what might happen or invest in someone who isn't putting as much into you - either he'll pick up interest or he'll fade away but it might not be as painful if you have other things that are going on.
Have a look at matthew hussey on youtube - he's a bit annoying but I've found his strategies work.

PinkTiger · 26/10/2017 19:24

Ahem ... and post photos on an Instagram page where the username is his actual name?

This doesn't prove anything for a whole mountain of reasons:

  1. Basic point but how do you know his user name is his actual name? There are plenty of OLD scam artists who use fake names - ranging from the cheating husband to the fraud/money scammer. Plenty of people who change their names. Did you ask to inspect his passport and birth certificate?
  1. Unless his name is unusual and easily googable (so will be top hit) like Eddie Izzard or Harvey Weinstein, even if he has an instragram account that is open, it doesn't follow that his wife/partner would find it. A John Smith type name account would take a lot of work to find.
  1. What do the photos show? Are they of you and him together kissing? If not, it means nothing. He could quite plausibly be in another city/place for business. Even if you are shown in the picture, unless the caption says "This is my gf and we had hot sex last night" it is still explicable as colleague/friend of friend I bumped into etc.
  1. You haven't been to his home so you have no idea who is living there or whether he has a long term partner who he doesn't live with. Even then you can get caught out - I know someone who had an unwitting affair with a man she regularly stayed the night with but he had a country house where the wife and the kids lived.
Notonthestairs · 26/10/2017 19:34

Regardless of whether or not he has a partner or a whole string of women this relationship isn't ever going to work out.

He just doesn't want it as much as you do (or think you do).

Find somebody lovely who will value you enough to want to spend his life with you and stop wasting time on this man.

PinkTiger · 26/10/2017 20:26

Regardless of whether or not he has a partner or a whole string of women this relationship isn't ever going to work out.

Yes - this is the most important thing OP. It's quite clear from your posts that your interaction with this man has made you miserable.

That's not how it should be. A relationship should enhance your life more than 50% of the time otherwise you are better off being on you own.