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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

I hate my son's dad so much and need outsiders to help me be reasonable.

38 replies

Splandy · 23/07/2017 10:55

I'm struggling to be concise because there is so much backstory. I probably am being unreasonable. I have a son who is nine and a half. His dad has been shit for his entire life. He has never lived with him but started every other Saturday overnights at the end of last year. To sum up, I would have to say that my whole life has revolved around our son (and my other child with current husband) and his life is all about himself. He puts himself first at all times.

It's difficult for me to give a brief description to explain why I hate him so much, but I'll try. He has paid maintenance for less than a year of his life in total, yet still has money for himself and nights out/tattoos/clothes/holidays. I suffered with extreme mental health problems and was dirt poor for many years. Raising my son alone was the hardest thing I have ever done. Having a child had no impact on his life whatsoever and he acted as though he was a young, single man. He would go months on end without turning up and not even let me know. His parents took over the visits. He seemed to think that was fine, as though the issue was him being taken off my hands and as long as somebody was doing that then it was all fine, rather than that he was his dad and should be involved in his life. His lies are constant and I no longer trust ANYTHING he says. He lies about tiny things that he doesn't even need to lie about. It is second nature to him. I went to great lengths to involve him in our son's life when he was young, even having him over at my house and cooking for him when he claimed he had nowhere to take him so couldn't see him. I arranged to meet him at neutral places a couple of times to try to calmly discuss that he was letting his son down and would regret it, trying to get him to see sense, Nothing I did made a difference. I used to invite him to parents evenings/hospital appointments etc. I have stopped doing that now and he never asks about them. The last parents evening he went to was at nursery. He turned up, showed no interest whatsoever in our son showing him his work (he thinks he is extremely cool and it was embarrassing to read to him etc) then loudly said that one of the other moms looked like a stripper from a strip club in our local town. She was there with her husband, to see the progress of her child, we were their to see ours, and that's what he was doing. Spent the rest of the time saying 'mmm' to our son if he spoke and eyeing her up. Our son has a medical condition. He had to have some pretty invasive tests and really struggled. His dad told me he was ill on the day and couldn't come. Fair enough, not much you can do about that, he hadn't been able to go into work because of it either. Took my son out to cheer him up afterwards and saw him out with his girlfriend. He'd taken her shopping. He even tried to pretend he hadn't seen us and walk right past. Those are just a couple of examples, his whole life is full of that but my son doesn't remember some of it and the rest I protected him from. He is still frequently 'ill', his own mom has told me that he refuses to pay her any rent and swears and rants if she asks for any and she thinks that he often isn't working away, as he claims, but can't be bothered to come and fetch him. I'm sure that he sometimes is working away, but he has been caught in lies so many times over the years that I no longer believe a word he says. He's going to be thirty soon, so not a child. He is a terrible, arrogant, vain person who frequently quits jobs because he thinks he's too good, or they dared ask him why he has so much time off ill. Then he just lives off his mom. He is aggressive and banned from local pubs for fighting. Nothing is ever his fault. He even got sacked while I was pregnant for having a fight with a man in the street whilst at work. That wasn't his fault either.

Our current arrangement is that he has him three times a week, with one of them being overnight every other Saturday. The reality is that he sees him once a week at best. One of the days has been taken over by his mom as he just never turned up and she wanted to see him. The other has fizzled out, because I just stopped asking after months of it not happening. I have to ask him whether he is coming and at what time every single day he is supposed to see him and I fucking hate it. He would never tell me he wouldn't be able to make it, I have to text and ask. I am forced to be a doormat. What I want to do is tell him that he knows the times we have arranged and if he doesn't come, he doesn't have him, because he is a priority, not an option to fit in around other more important things. He lets me know whatever time he fancies picking him up that day, sometimes up to 90 minutes late. He expects me to be free at all times and rearrange my plans so that I am free to fit around his life. I am stuck doing this because my son is desperate to see him. He absolutely idolises him Sad. He openly tells me that he prefers his dad to me and how nice he is. He laps up his dads lies totally and I've even had him crying because he feels so sorry for him Angry I don't know when he will see him for what he is. I find it very difficult to swallow. I have absolutely tried my best to never badmouth his dad to him or allow my feelings to be seen, but to protect him from him and the emotional pain he causes as best as I can. He is very sensitive to any perceived criticism of his dad so I have to tread very carefully. It honestly feels that my reward for trying to do the right thing for my son and be mature is that I am treated like shit while his dad is worshipped. It's hard to take.

His dad now has a new girlfriend. I didn't know about this, my son mentioned that his dad had a friend who really wanted to meet him and could he have him for longer on Sunday so they could have lunch together. He doesn't usually feed him or feeds him inadequate things like toast so I have to feed him again when he gets home. So it was different. All fine, I said yes. As an aside, he came in his work van but parked it down the road so I wouldn't see. He hadn't told me where this friend lived but I suspected it would involve a drive so I asked how he was getting there. He told me in his van. I don't trust him, so asked whether he had a car seat. Turns out he didn't. That's why he parked down the road, he didn't want me to know that he didn't have a car seat. I assume he was going to tell my son to lie to me Sad because he can't be bothered to even sort out getting a car seat for him. Luckily, my husband wasn't at work so I had my car seat for him to use. But I can't even trust him to take care of basic things like that. When my son came back, it became pretty obvious that this was in fact a girlfriend. The next weekend, his dad acted cagey again and asked to have him earlier. I outright asked where he would be sleeping and he told me 'my friends house'. I pointed out that it would be nice if he could see him alone because he hadn't seen him for two weeks and it's not a great idea to have him sleeping over at the house of somebody he has only met once. He would have to share a room with her son, who he has only met once, he doesn't have a bed there, he is extremely anxious and scared, won't go upstairs alone and I have to go into his room every night to talk through his worries with him because he can't sleep. He is currently waiting for a camhs appointment. This started his dad shouting and swearing about what a shit mom I am etc... he doesn't actually argue any points if I ever disagree with him, he just lays into me. The simple fact is that he wasn't willing to give up one night of seeing his girlfriend for the sake of his son. To make matters worse, my son was insisting that it was all fine because he would be grateful for any shitty scrap of attention his dad offers, so I was the absolute bad guy. It was agreed that he would meet her a few more times before staying overnight, which seems fair. Since then, my son hasn't seen his dad alone. Every visit involves driving for an hour to go to his girlfriends house. He won't actually refer to her as his girlfriend, he sighed when I asked it and said "we don't want to define our relationship like that..." yet she's clearly so important that he couldn't possibly see his son without her. He actually drives there on Saturday evening, then drives back to sleep at his house, then drives back there on Sunday morning and drives him back home in the afternoon. There is no doubt in my mind that this is so that his dad can see his girlfriend rather than it having anything to do with being good for my son. I felt really sad when my son came home and said oh it's ok, I still see my dad loads, the settees are quite close to each other so I can still see him. Turns out he's obviously sitting there chatting with his girlfriend and my son is just expected to play with her son (who he does like). HOWEVER... there is no denying that the girlfriends house is a nicer place for him to be. His dad is asking to have him for longer and he is eating proper meals. One of his dads reasons for having him sleep there overnight was "she's got loads of toys and stuff and there's nothing at mine for him", as though he hasn't had nine years to get used to the idea that he is a parent and create a nice environment for his son. He never takes him anywhere or does anything with him. But it's true, it does sound nicer and more stable there. If this works out and is long term, assuming that she is a nice normal mom, i think he would be better taken care of.

But a huge part of me just feels so fucking angry. His reward for being a fucking shit dad all of his life is that he has now conned a single mom into believing that he's some kind of great dad and a good father figure to her son. Nobody has shunned him. It's like he's been bloody rewarded for everything he's done and he is such a great dad that somebody else even wants him to raise their child now, too. Child maintenance are in the process of changing him over to the collected payments through them. Surely, if she knew this, she would run a mile? A good dad wouldn't be in that position and he definitely presents himself as a great dad. I feel like my son is being used as a prop to impress this woman. But if it doesn't work out, and she doesn't become his 'official' girlfriend, it will all go back to him seeing him whenever he feels like it. I know that, rationally, I should be thinking that it's good he's asking to see him for longer and stepping up a bit, but my gut reaction every time is to shout NO, YOU SELFISH PIECE OF SHIT. Why should I miss out on some nice time with my son for you? I do all the hard stuff and actual parenting, we don't get time to spend lots of 'fun time' through the week because I'm busy with real life, keeping a roof over his head and daily family life. Of course I say yes, because I know my son will want to. But he swoops in and gets the fun stuff. No acknowledgement of the terrible impact he has had on our son, nothing at all, just deciding that he'll have him for longer now. But again, for selfish reasons, because it shows him in a positive light to his girlfriend. He's come home and told me that they had the paddling pool out and played and it all sounded great, so much nicer than anything his dad has ever done before, so I know I should be pleased about that. But I'm so angry and I don't trust him. What should I do? Just go with it and hope it all works out or try to prepare my son for this coming to an end? I'm really struggling with how much he seems to prefer his dad to me. Why does he get adoration when he's done nothing but hurt him? I'm really struggling to continue biting my tongue and I'm worried he'll grow up and believe all of his dads bullshit.

OP posts:
Squirmy65ghyg · 23/07/2017 11:02

He's an absolute bastard. Don't worry - your son KNOWS you love him unconditionally while presumably feels very unsure and left out by his father hence the protests of "oh yes he's amazing."

Stop facilitating, if he gives up he gives up. He sounds a terrible waste of space.

Splandy · 23/07/2017 11:37

Thanks for the reply. I know the large body of text will put a lot of people off! Yes, I believe he tries to impress his dad a lot to make him want to see him and it breaks my heart. He copies things he says and has started dressing like him. I am just boring old mom, and when his friends have seen his dad they've said things like 'who's that man in the cool clothes'? He dresses like a 'cool' teenage boy. I live in fear of him telling that he wants to go and live with him because he is just such an awful role model.

I have stopped facilitating things, I don't ask during the week anymore but he has mostly kept up with the weekend arrangements. It's probably true that he is sometimes working away during the week, but not all the time. It's him that's asking for more now - wanting to have him all day today instead of the three hours he normally would have had him and asking to pick him up earlier on Saturday and drop him back later on Sunday when he has him overnight. I know that I should be thinking it's good and happily saying yes to this, but I'm not happy. I'm feeling stressed and worried about it. I can be a bit of a control freak so keep wondering whether it's just me being overly controlling but the reason I'm like that with his dad is that he has shown he can't be trusted even with things like car seats! He took him out in terrible snow with all his mates without a car seat when he was 5 and when I called him out on it, told me that our son way lying. He'd rather call his son a liar than admit what he did. And he always always has an ulterior motive or something else going on. It's never straightforward and I am tired of dealing with him. His whole family is pretty dysfunctional so I don't think it's something that he will eventually grow out of, it is just the way he works. So I distance myself from it all. I hate having to think two steps ahead, why is he asking this, what's really going on here... it's shit.

OP posts:
cowgirlsareforever · 23/07/2017 11:40

I hate him too!

YoungGirlGrowingOld · 23/07/2017 11:49

Yep, I also hate him OP! What a cockwomble he sounds.

I think your son is going to learn the hard way that his dad is a twat. I went through a similar process with my not-so DF who was also a waste of space. I recognise the need for his approval you describe in your DS and it made me feel sad. Sorry you are going through. It seems quite possible that your ex-twat will break your DS heart at some point. All you can do is be there to pick up the pieces and as a PP said, he knows you love him unconditionally.

Splandy · 23/07/2017 11:49

Haha, I don't think anybody could claim he is a good dad when they know the facts. His own family have said things to me, but I have to be careful because they are still his family. But it does please me to know that other people around him do see how terrible he is, the only people who are taken in are people who haven't seen the reality of it.

So what would you do in my situation? I think my hands are tied, really. Dad wanting to see son more should usually be a positive thing, and my son definitely wants to do it, so I can only say yes. And it probably is loads nicer for him to be in the family environment that his girlfriend is providing rather than the way things have been before. He must have totally pulled the wool over her eyes, though, and obviously I couldn't say anything to her because he paints me as some crazy ex. I suppose I should just hope that she is a normal woman with a child of her own so her life is already child focused which will mean things are nicer for my own son.

OP posts:
YoungGirlGrowingOld · 23/07/2017 11:50

Oh and YADNBU.

MadameJosephine · 23/07/2017 12:08

He's an utter twat OP.

You, on the other hand, sound like a wonderful mum. I've been where you are and it's really hard but it sounds like you are doing everything you can to make sure your son has a relationship with his father which is his right. I tried to remember that it was all about my DS's rights and not XH and as long as he wanted to see his dad I did my best to facilitate it, eventually he lost interest and my DS has not seen his dad for years but he knows that it's not because I stopped him and that's important.

swingofthings · 23/07/2017 12:27

I've been exactly in your shoes, feeling the same sense of injustice. Still I prided myself in doing everything to encourage the relationship between the kids and he, always reminding myself I was doing it for my kids and not his, and that if he benefited from this too, then I would have to close my eyes to it.

Witnessing the kids thinking their dad was God, just feeling sorry for him because they believed all his sob stories was infuriating. The time has come though. DD is 18 and although she still has a lot of affection from her dad, it's because she's taken a caring role towards him, almost her being his parent rather than the other way around. She is realistic about the person he is though and now can see why I got so frustrated.

DS15 though has decided he doesn't want any contact with him any longer. Of course he plays the victim, DS being horrible, unable to look into himself and his actions and accept that it was only a question of time.

I should feel a sense of satisfaction after all these years. I feel none at all. I feel sad for my boy that he feels he doesn't have a father. I wished he loved his dad and wanted to spend time with him. It shouldn't have been like this. I really really hope they make up, but I can't see Ex doing anything about it because of his suffering of the victim syndrome.

MatildaTheCat · 23/07/2017 12:36

The only thing you can do is to continue being a fab mother and mop up the tears. Your poor son, YABVVVVR.

LowGravity · 23/07/2017 12:36

Oh that sounds tough OP. My son is currently going through a stage of idolising a totally absent father and that's hard enough. I just want to scream 'your dad is a selfish cunt', but of course I can't and won't ever. He though, like your son, will eventually work it out for himself and I get no satisfaction from that because that too will hurt. All you can do is be there for him when he does realize and grit your teeth very tightly in the meanwhile.

Splandy · 23/07/2017 12:43

I don't feel like a great mom at all. My son currently has an absolutely terrible attitude and I am struggling to know how to deal with it. I end up shouting at him more than I want to and then in turn confirming that I'm the crap, shouty parent and his dad is amazing. His dad never tells him off because he's never needed to. He's always on 'best behaviour' with him because it's a treat to be with him. It all works against me.

I have said a few little things about his dad now that he's getting older, because it's difficult for me to say no to something without giving him any kind of reasoning now that he's older. It's also very difficult for me to hear my son parroting his dads excuses back to me and explaining why it's all ok that his dad didn't see him for a few weeks and it wasn't his fault. A particularly memorbable one was when his dad got a job in a restaurant/pub. He asked to not work one weekend day every week so that he could see his son (he went out every weekend and rarely turned up anyway as he was hungover). They got rid of him at the end of his trial period as he wasn't a team player. He told my son he had quit because they were nasty people who were stopping him seeing his son. Then didn't turn up for a month. He's only a child so he can't see the ridiculousness of it, he just believes whatever his dad says to him. I have to try to remind him not to get his hopes up about things because his dad isn't very reliable. I have really struggled with the crying because he feels so sorry for him and it's a very difficult one to navigate. His dad brings out sob stories. He obviously picks up on my reaction to things and if I ever even seem a little bit angry about something, it makes him feel even more sorry for him because I am so obviously unfairly angry with him. But I'm not having my son feel sorry for his dad and making excuses for treating him like shit!

I had to have quite a long conversation about it all with my son when his dad sneakily tried to have him sleepover at his girlfriend's house. He heard my side of the conversation, so he heard me say that no I don't trust him to make decisions like a decent parent. He didn't hear his dad shouting and swearing at me and telling me how shit i am. So he felt sorry for his dad. He was shouting and crying in the background that it was all fine and he WANTS to have a sleepover at their house. Fucking mess. He was crying because he was basically having to choose between us. His dad refused to say he wouldn't take him and instead said he'd ask him and if he wanted to then it's fine. There are certain things nine year olds are not allowed to choose for themselves. Parents make sensible choices for them. There is no way he would have said no to something his dad wants to do. So he was stuck in the middle, knowing that I didn't want him to go but if his dad asked him he wanted to say yes. I had to tell him that it was absolutely fine to say yes if he was asked and he shouldn't worry about my reaction, I would never be angry with him for honestly answering a question because he was in such a state about It and I didn't want him stuck in the middle. But his dad doesn't know him as well as I do. He doesn't see him getting out of bed crying because he's scared there's going to be a terrorist attack in our street every night. He won't do that with his dad because he wants to impress him. He's also been told he's not to wake him up so he just stays in bed until his uncle or aunt get up to give him breakfast because he's too scared to go downstairs by himself. Won't tell his dad that either. But his dad put him in the position of having to choose between us and it was wrong. So I had to point out to my son that it is not ok that his dad is making him make this choice and a responsible parent wouldn't put their child in this position. He was coming up with ways that he could possibly change the subject or suggest something else so that his dad wouldn't ask him and make him choose Angry. In the end it didn't come to that because I managed to get his dad to stop being an idiot. But I did tell him a bit about why I was reacting the way I was. It's difficult to know whether I should say anything at all or if I'm going too far. Do you think I ought to back right off and stop saying anything at all? It feels like confirming that his dads behaviour is ok if I don't say anything, and I'm not sure at what age it becomes appropriate. I don't know whether it works anyway, I think he might just be nodding his head to please me and make me shut up because he doesn't believe it. I am really worried that it is teaching him that it's ok to be in a relationship where somebody makes it abundantly clear that you are not a priority and you should just take whatever they offer you. I worry about it continuing as a teenager and accepting that he's not worthy of his dads attention and the affect that would have on his self esteem.

OP posts:
Extua · 23/07/2017 12:49

You sound amazing. I think hard as it is you probably have to continue what you are doing. One day your son will be grown up and he will see things as they are. He's just too young for that at the moment. If he lets himself see what a shit his dad is it will all be too much. Your consistency and continued behaviour of putting your son first will I'm sure pay dividends in the end. Doesn't change how enormously difficult and unfair it is for you though, I know. From what I've seen from my own father, both with me and with my siblings, is that the teen years are not kind to them as the children begin to see them for what they are. You will probably find that your ex will not be able to handle this and will make it difficult for your son, at which point yet again you will have to pick up the pieces. I've no doubt that at some point in the next few years your son will see his true colours.

For now, at least he is having a nicer time. If you want to make sure you have some nice weekend time with him, can you make plans (organise with ds) to do something your son enjoys a couple of weeks in advance? Then when his dad says he wants him longer/earlier you can say well we already have X planned and hopefully if it's something your DS really likes he will also want to stay and do that? If you do this every now and again perhaps you'll still get nice times together without it seeming like you are trying to reduce how much he sees his dad?

Extua · 23/07/2017 12:52

Sorry didn't see your latest post. I'm sure there's nothing wrong with, As diplomatically as possible, explaining in some instances why you feel his dad is being unreasonable. He's old enough for that and from your posts you're clearly able to put it in a way that doesn't make him feel guilty/like he has to pick between you/change his opinion of his dad x

StewPots · 23/07/2017 12:57

I was in this position for a while with my abusive ex. I was the Devil, ex was the best thing since sliced bread, until he had a succession of new GFs and what can only be described as a mid-life crisis.

No money for rent, food or DD...but plenty for GFs, tattoos of said GFs (cringe) and slowly but surely no time for DD either.

To cut a long story short, the visits pretty much stopped (then he moved 200miles away...best day of my life if I'm honest) , the phone calls became less too, but he still attempted to manipulate DD from afar. But here's the thing... DD was 9 when I split with her Dad, idolised him etc etc...but as she grew up and matured, she began to see through him.

She saw through the lies and the bullshit, all the stuff he did for show, and began to see him as a selfish, narcissistic arsehole who only looks out for number 1. I never bad mouthed him because I had faith she would see for herself...and oh boy, did she...

He would call her at 1am, drunk, bad mouthing me, feeling sorry for himself about how his life ha turned out (everyone else's fault, never his!)..she was just 12-13yo at this point.

SparkleSoiree · 23/07/2017 13:01

OP I think you are doing an amazing job under extremely provocative circumstances, I really do. It may not feel like it but your love, maturity and continuity for your son is giving him the foundations he will need later in life that will show him how real relationships should be and how to love another person unconditionally whilst giving him one loving parent on a day to day basis.

As for your EX, I have no words. Really I don't know how these men continue to exist in today's society. My son is 25 now and is still coming to terms with now knowing who is father was because he continually shunned him through his childhood. I have taken all the flack from DS's father's family, have had abuse hurled at me calling my son all sorts of names as a young child and never received a penny in maintenance. Yet, somehow, my son is now married to a lovely woman, knows how to respect another person whilst earning his own way and is the most wonderful father to his own child. I like to think I had something to do with that in some way but ultimately he did it himself because he was the one that grew up without a decent father to guide him.

Our children romanticise the role of absent father's in their minds, it's a coping strategy. It has to be better than accepting the reality that your father does not care about you, won't put food in your mouth or clothes on your back, won't give you a kiss and cuddle at night to ensure you sleep soundly or be there to pop on a plaster when you fall and scrape your knee. That is too much for them to think about and, to be honest, we don't want them to be thinking along those lines as it absolutely messes up their self-esteem and emotional development as they grow older.

Personally, if it were me, I would be formalising the access arrangement with an initial plan in the first year of where, where, who with, etc. That will enable the bond between them alone to develop and for your son to have trust in his father and for his father to show that he has the skills to put your son's needs first above his own. It does sound like your ex has found someone he is latching on to who he will ultimately move in with and she will do the bulk of visitation care for your son. Not fair on your son or her to be frank.

It's not easy being a single parent with custody especially when your own feelings are at odds with another's behaviour but as long as you do what's right in your heart for the welfare of your child (regardless of any emotional blackmail your ex may drag him into) you can't go wrong - it will be tough mentally but you shouldn't go too far wrong and so far you're doing a great job.

Splandy · 23/07/2017 13:02

I have said no to things in the past but the fact is nothing I do would ever compete with him seeing his dad, so I can't tell him his dad asked to see him for longer. I do feel like I need to have an excuse. I have sometimes lied or exaggerated things. But if I told my son, he would choose his dad every time, so then I have to tell myself that it's the right thing to do and let it happen. It's been arranged that my son will be having three weeks of holiday during the summer holidays, one with us as a family, one with me his brother and my parents and then just my parents are taking him to their caravan for a week. He absolutely loves this, but yesterday moaned that it meant he wouldn't be able to see his dad that week and asked whether he could just stay at home instead. He'd rather miss out on a holiday than miss out on seeing his dad and his dad can't even be bothered to show up during the week Sad

I know you're all being lovely saying I'm an amazing mom, but I just don't feel it. His attitude is appalling and it is like dealing with a teenager already. I don't get to do loads of fun stuff with him and he's started saying that I care about his brother more than I care about him. When I've asked him about this once he's calmed down, he laughs and says no he doesn't really think that, but surely there must be some truth to it. Unless he knows it will hurt me and that's why he's saying it. I don't drive and my husband works very unhelpful hours. I'm a bit stuck with certain things like having to get meals and bedtime done or a few clubs he goes to, and then his brother having a nap, but I do work some other things around this as well as I can. But I can't compete with his dad only ever having to do fun stuff. I am learning to drive and my husband is applying for new jobs so our family life will work better and I can get more time alone with him. I do make sure time after his brother is in bed is time for us, we often play a board game together and I have started reading to him again so he has quite an involved bedtime routine as it's our time together. He makes it all very difficult to enjoy with his bad attitude, though. I don't know. Feels like I'm failing all the time and his dad has totally conned him.

OP posts:
StewPots · 23/07/2017 13:09

Agggh...posted too soon!

Basically DD started to be disgusted by his behaviour, and began to see why we split up...she would ignore his calls, or send passive aggressive replies if he texted. He started to try and control her, manipulate her even more...slagged me and DH off constantly... last straw for her was when he sent her nothing for Christmas or birthday (very close together) because he was "skint" but she saw on FB a picture of him with a car he'd just bought...the fucking idiot can't even drive for fucks sake...she realised then and there that he was only out for himself, and DD was certainly not a priority in his life and so she decided to go NC.

It has been like this for 2 years now, and honestly, it's bliss. DH is an amazing stepdad, despite being almost half the age of ex arsehole, and DD will change from her Dads name to DHs name next year at 16. She never wants to speak to her father again, has no interest in him at all, but our relationship now is fantastic. All those years of keeping my mouth shut paid off...she watched me struggle with DH to keep a roof over our heads, feed us all, working 50 hours a week and more to do so.

She saw DH and I have a close, friendly fun relationship where daily arguments and daily abuse didn't happen. She hated the idea of her DB at first but now they are unbelievably close and she is growing into a mature, kind, clever DD and I'm absolutely sure that had she kept up contact with her Dad she may have turned out differently due to his influence (heavy drinker and drug user).

I guess what I'm trying to say is have a lot of patience. One day your DS will have the same revelation as my DD...it may not come until he reaches adulthood but he will realise...and he also realise that you and your DH are what parents are all about - stable, loving, supportive and always there whenever. That's what counts.

You're doing a fantastic job OP. Take solace in that for now, keep going and one day it'll happen...the hate will disappear, and you'll be free.

I don't hate ex anymore. I pity him. Because I know DD does not care for him anymore and would only see him if he was on his death bed. Even that is debatable. Whereas we will be close forever.

emilybrontescorset · 23/07/2017 13:14

I think you should stick to set times.
In life there is no ' oh I really don't feel like starting work today at 9 so I'll go in at 12' or ' I don't think I'll feed the dc today ' or ' I can't be arsed collecting my dc from school so I'll just leave them there'.
In the nicest possible way you are facilitating your exs behaviour.
This impacting on your child.
You have a responsibility to instill in you're child that living things are not disposable.
You are setting him up to think that mothers are submissive and subservient to men.
That fathers can come and go as they choose and all is dandy.
I really do not what to sound harsh, I've been there myself, but you must stop covering up for the twat.
By all means let your son go and visit him, but have boundaries and agreements in place.
If your ex breaks them then let him take the rap and stop making excuses for him, otherwise this will never end.
You will be the baddy and your son will get hurt.
You cannot control the actions of your ex you can control your response to them,
He will never be a great parent. When his new relationship goes tits up he will drop your son like a hot potato, you know that.
You are a great mum and don't deserve this.
Begin to disengage as much as you can,

Splandy · 23/07/2017 13:14

I'm not single anymore, I have a lovely husband who has done a brilliant job of raising my son. I don't know how his dad can even look my husband in the eye knowing that my husband is providing for his son and he never has. When he talks about his family, he means me and his stepdad. He doesn't ask for his dad when he is hurt or sad, it is us. He knows that we'll be the ones taking him to school and to clubs and appointments, going on holidays etc. He does also prefer his stepdad to me Grin perhaps I am just really boring and unfun!

I think he's definitely latching onto this woman and using her to help look after his son. The night he tried to take him to her house to stay over just happened to be the exact same day his brother and brothers girlfriend moved out of their house so he'd be alone with him and have to provide entertainment. His aunt and uncle have always been involved with him and I know they get up with him in the morning instead of his dad. I don't think that would be his sole reason for having her as his girlfriend though. He's had loads of girlfriends and a few have met my son. This is just the first one that has a child of her own which I suppose works nicely for him and means he's stepped up rather than his usual trick of dropping him almost entirely for a while.

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Splandy · 23/07/2017 13:23

emilybrontescorset, yes, that's exactly what I was trying to describe a few posts back. That I am allowing him to think it is normal to walk all over me and to treat his son like he is disposable. It's not so much of an issue anymore but it's very difficult when my son is begging me to text him to ask what time he's coming and up the door every ten minutes to see if he is there. If I refuse to text and ask what time he is coming, he cries and I can see that I'm adding to the stress and worry that he won't show up. He can't relax and trust that he will come unless I text and confirm on the day. And then if he says a time later than our agreed time, he says 'oh well at least I know he's coming'. I do hate it but I'm not sure what else to do. I hate that his dad walks around like he's some kind of god and I have to go along with it. It's not so much of an issue anymore because his mom has now taken over the Wednesday visit and the Thursday visit has just stopped. It's now only on the weekend. If he's going to be late, he doesn't tell me he's going to be late with any kind of apology or explanation, he says 'I'll fetch him at 12' like he gets to choose. My options are then to allow him to fetch him at 12 or to say no sorry got plans. The plans are a lie, I never have plans and my son knows it so he'll know I'm lying to stop him seeing him. He's twitchy about my phone on a day when his dad is coming so as soon as I have a text he will be saying 'who's that, is it my dad, what did he say, when is he coming' so he will know. There's no easy way for me to do that kind of 'tough' thing so I end up doing what makes my son feel better in the short term and hate myself for being a pushover. I have quite a few times said right I've had enough, why should I have to confirm that you're coming, it's not good enough. If there is a problem, you text me and let me know, you know the agreed times and you don't get to change them.' But it has NEVER worked and it has only made my son even more anxious. I feel trapped.

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ClopySow · 23/07/2017 13:32

The best thing you can do for your own sanity is just let go of the hate. It is such a bad use of your energy.

I knoe it's not that simple - believe me, i've been in your shoes.

And remember, you get the shitty stuff from your son because he can relax and be himself around you. He can't with his dad. And he will figure the twat out eventually. I promise.

daisychain01 · 23/07/2017 13:37

You'll never change your ex, no matter how hard you want him to behave better and be a role model for your DS. Thankfully there is a comparison of your DH2, but your DS may still have conflicting loyalties even if his DSF is the most amazing person.

Don't be tempted to try and put your DS straight about the realities of who his DF is, let him find stuff out for himself.

If you can, put a lid on those feelings of hatred no matter how well founded they are, and get on with living as happy a life as you can despite the Ex. He won't be relevant in a few years from now, because your DS will be making more adult choices of his own.

emilybrontescorset · 23/07/2017 13:41

Firstly buy a cheap pay as you go phone for the sole purpose of contact between your son and his dad. Don't use 'your' phone.
Next I think the fact that your ex has a new girlfriend and will no doubt be playing the fabulous father role is to your benefit. Make plans and stick to them even let your son speak to the girlfriend about the set times so she will think on Saturday at x time we are having splandys dc over.
This will help to formalise the times.
Is it possible to get counselling for your son?
You need someone to tell him in terms he will understand that it is important that grown ups stick to their promises.
A professional would be the best person as it's not something your son can then throw in your face, but rather in a this is what needs to happen way.
At the moment your son is in the tenable state of accepting any crumbs his father cares to flick in his direction. This is very unhealthy and forms the basis for many abusive relationships.
I would make the most of the exs desire to impress his new girlfriend as at least your son gets to see his dad.
As your son grows he will then be able to say I want to spend time with you alone to his dad.
That decision will be your exs and hopefully your son will see this for himself and see his dad for what he is.
You have a done a brilliant job in raising your child.
You now need to step back slowly from the dick of a father and disengage from him.

PyongyangKipperbang · 23/07/2017 13:44

Regarding behaviour, its the parent that they feel the most secure with that they kick off at. He knows that whatever happens, you will always be there for him and love him. He doesnt know that about his dad. He has to be on his best behaviour incase his dad doesnt seem him anymore. He can be his true self with you which he can never be with his dad. Also, he can display his unhappiness at his dad's behaviour to you because he knows he can trust you. So the kicking off, the "Dad is nicer than you" stuff his him verbalising how unsettled and insecure he feels about his dad, he is unhappy but cant show his dad this so you get it.

Sad as it is, its good that he does do this with you as it helps him get his frustrations out in an environment where he wont be punished for it (in his eyes) by his dad dumping him again.

Splandy · 23/07/2017 13:54

I don't even say anything bad about him but he just picks up on it. He will mention things about his dad in front of me or his stepdad or even his grandparents and unless they say something really enthusiastic and positive he just knows, I can tell. He told me a few nights ago that he went out to play while he was there and I said 'oh right', which is something i commonly say. He then said 'you're annoyed at my dad now aren't you?'. I wasn't annoyed about him playing out and pointed out that he plays out here all the time, so it's a normal thing to do, but he is quick to jump to his dad's defence all the time. I did think it's a bit shit to take him to his girlfriends house and then send him out to play when he hasn't seen him for a few weeks, but it wasn't like I wasn't super angry or thought about it much. If his dad has done something he knows is off and wants to tell me, he will tell me oh this happened and then very quickly and in a rushed voice say 'but it was ok because this this and this' so he has pre-empted my reaction and come up with some reasons why it is all ok. I don't say anything bad to him but anything less than 'your dad is so amazing' is seen as bad and he clearly worries about it.

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