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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Love but not in love ..... that old chestnut

25 replies

DollyBright0n · 13/07/2017 17:17

I've been with the same man for 21 years now and we have two kids. I was happy and life was ticking along nicely until last year when I found a text from him to a (much younger) woman at work posted at 7:30am Sunday morning whilst he was on his bike ride. He had recently been distancing himself from his family and becoming increasingly obsessed with cycling. The text appeared innocent enough, just a picture and a few words about his bike ride BUT the text was just to a mobile number, so no contact details in his phone. I went to have another look at the string of texts (a lot about meeting up in cafes etc. because they go on visits together for work) the next day and it had been deleted. When confronted he said they were just friends. I wouldn't text my own family at 7:30am on a Sunday morning, my friends have a name attached to their numbers on my phone and I don't tend to delete my messages so I have my suspicions. She is 15 years younger than me and heavily into cycling. He denies any sort of relationship but when asked if he still loves me he refused to answer, he refused to answer this question for many months. When I said I couldn't stay with someone who doesn't love me he said he doesn't want to end the relationship. He said he still loved me but in a different way. He said he needs to find himself. He says he doesn't know what he wants. He appears to have eaten the cliche dictionary. When I told him I felt his work was more important than his family he said that actually it was more important to him than his family and my heart broke, both for me and our children. I'm now stuck in some sort of limbo hell, unable to move on or fix what's broken because I didn't break it and you can't force someone to love you. He said we should go to relate but I pointed out that they can't make him love me and he would need to be totally honest and now he isn't so sure anymore. He's not a bad man and our relationship has never been perfect but we've always got along and worked as a team. I thought we'd stay together for the rest of our lives so it's hit me very hard. I thought he was in some sort of midlife crisis but nothing has changed a year on. He makes little effort unless I'm upset, because, I assume he feels guilty when I am. He keeps saying I shouldn't talk about parting and he doesn't want that but I can't go on like this. I don't know if it's worth trying to sort out this mess, risking my self esteem deteriorating further, if that's even possible or just ask him to leave whilst we sort out splitting up. I feel dreadful and I'm starting to get seriously depressed. I can't manage financially without him either as I only work part-time and he has a good job and pays all the bills. We're not married.

OP posts:
Adora10 · 13/07/2017 17:23

I wouldn't go on either with a man that has checked out and is basically telling you he is not good enough for you because he can't love you that way; then there's the deleted messages to a woman at 730am, nah, I'd not carry on like this, you are just making yourself suffer OP. He will have to provide for his children, surely he will want to.

You said yourself, little effort, that says it all OP, you deserve so much more than this crap.

I'd make plans with him for a temporary split, if nothing else it will show him you are no push over or some poor woman that can't cope without him.

Messelina · 13/07/2017 22:37

Get a bike and go cycling with him?
Try to focus on looking after you, not on what he might or might not be doing (I know it's easier said than done).
Andrew Marshall has written some books you might find helpful, check them out if you haven't already. Best of luck!

OccasionalNachos · 13/07/2017 22:44

I don't have any good advice (except that if you can financially find a way to separate, I think it would be good for you to get some head space) but just wanted to wish you luck in figuring things out Flowers Wine Cake your post resonates with me a lot. I hope you figure out a way forward that's best for you & your DC.

SandyY2K · 13/07/2017 23:08

You aren't married, so I suggest you look for a full time job, as he's not legally obliged to support you financially if you split.

He'll have to support the children financially, but it seems he's honest in not professing love for you.

It doesn't sound like it's sustainable long term, and you you might as well make plans to leave while you're younger.

Otherwise once the kids are older, he'll leave you anyway, and it will be harder to start over then.

DarklyDreamingDexter · 13/07/2017 23:13

He seems to have it all on his terms at the moment. He doesn't want to part, yet he has said outright that his job is more important to him than his family. That leaves you in complete limbo. How long does he expect you to go on living like this - six months, a year, 20 years? If you've been together 21 years you're probably in what, your 40s? Can you seriously imaging living the rest of your life like this - never having a full relationship, feeling second best, getting depressed, self esteem plummeting? I think he might have more respect for you and your feelings if you shake him out of his comfort zone by making him leave while you consider what you want. You can't make him love you, but you can take back control of your life and start making plans for the rest of it, plans which probably don't include him.

Categoric · 14/07/2017 10:46

I had a colleague who did this. He left his wife the day his youngest finished school and announced to her that he hadn't felt the same way about her 'for a long time but had done his duty by the children'.

He then said this to other people as if he deserved a medal!

user1486956786 · 14/07/2017 11:40

You got two choices really -

  1. End it.
  1. Try and fix it. Like someone else suggested, get a bike and cycle with him? Get a hobby of your own. Start having a night together each week when you take it in turns to cook for the other and have wine. Or a night where you cook together. You both can't keep plodding along same shit different day and except it to get better, step up and make changes. If you don't want to do that then I suggest back to option 1.
ravenmum · 14/07/2017 11:53

My ex didn't want to be the one to end the relationship, either. I guess he wasn't sure if it was going to work out with the OW, and it would have looked worse for him if he had dumped his family without going round first telling everyone lies about what a nasty frigid bitch I was.
I'm glad I found such ample proof of his affair. Being in limbo was awful. Worse than splitting up with him.

MoreProseccoNow · 14/07/2017 13:33

In your shoes, I'd start to get my ducks lined up. I'd look at the "entitled to" website & perhaps get some legal/financial advice about where you stand.

You cannot force someone to participle in a relationship, or to love you.

This is beginning to impact on your health, understandably. I'd be concentrating on your health, self-esteem & children, getting out with as much dignity as possible.

Adora10 · 14/07/2017 13:49

Buy a bike and go cycling with him (even if you don't want to), even though he's told you he's not in love with you and not sure if he wants this anymore.

Nah, tell him to get on his bike and not return until he KNOWS what he wants.

He can't drop that bombshell then expect his cushy status quo to continue, it's cruel on you so no I'd not be feverishly trying to find a way to get him to notice me, I'd be doing as above and getting my ducks in a row, without his knowledge of course, just like he lives a life without your.

ravenmum · 14/07/2017 13:59

Buy a bike and cycle a discreet distance behind him so he doesn't notice!

DollyBright0n · 15/07/2017 06:26

Thanks so much for all the replies, especially Adora10 because that's exactly what my head is saying before my heart gets in the way.

Yes, deep down I know that if he doesn't love me then it's over but I don't just want to walk away from 21 years without giving it my best shot. The trouble is knowing whether I'm just being a doormat for attempting to save a relationship with someone who doesn't love me. I think the answer is yes I am, I'm being a mug and I destroying myself in the process. He's booked an appointment with relate which I suspect is going to end it if he's honest during the session.

I've got to get used to the fact I'm going to be a single mother, with no money, and my lovely life is going to end. I'm not qualified to do anything and I didn't try because his career always came first and now I'm left with nothing and no-one. I still love him and thought he'd always love back and I'm finding it so difficult to cope. Our relationship wasn't fantastic but I had no idea h felt like this about me. I know I need to be strong and sort myself out but I'm crumbling and drinking way too much. I have a hand full of friends but not a huge support network. I'm really not sure how I'm going to cope with all this.

OP posts:
MudCity · 15/07/2017 06:45

Right, first of all sort yourself out. Stop drinking. Get some exercise. Think about what you want to do with the rest of your life....studying? Work? Consider enrolling on a course of some sort...you will get to meet new people and find a new interest. If you don't have many friends, join a meet up group in your area and develop new friendships. All this will help you feel happier in yourself.and give you a purpose outside your relationship.

Go to Relate too. Whether the relationship continues or ends, it is worth the effort.

jojo2916 · 15/07/2017 08:37

The minute the man I was with told me he didn't love me I'd be gone. I know it's not that simple in real life but if he doesn't love you and told you this surely the relationship is dead in the water so better to move on , perhaps try counselling first but if he's still saying he doesn't love you in a marital capacity then staying together would just be a facade? You deserve better than that.

DollyBright0n · 15/07/2017 08:43

I know I need to start caring about myself before I'll feel strong enough to move on but this is having the opposite effect on me - it's making me feel worthless. He seems unable to communicate with me and if I bring up the subject of our relationship he gets cross with me and seems to think I'm to blame for the situation because I keep "going on" about it which is making HIM unhappy. It's this limbo which is killing me but I can't move on or sort anything out if we don't even speak.
Yes, I need to take control of my destiny and I'll talk to work and see if I can increase my hours to give me a bit of extra cash but I'm a long way from being financially independent. We jointly own a house but I don't know if I'd be able to stay in it with kids when we split up with a view to selling it once they're at Uni. I can't afford anywhere big enough for all of us by myself.
I want to take positive steps to sort out the situation but keep finding myself feeling helpless and depressed about it all. I still can't believe this is happening.

OP posts:
ravenmum · 15/07/2017 11:20

jojo no, exactly, it is not that simple in real life, it really, really isn't. You really wouldn't be gone just like that, not even you.

Dolly, that's the limbo effect. It makes you feel terrible. The grim face with dead eyes, the making you feel this is all your fault. I was "lucky" in that I found out what was going on and it gave me the reason I thought I needed to end it myself. When he moved out, even though it meant the end of the relationship was certain, it was a huge relief for the tension to be gone.

Get help from the doctor, from friends and family, get therapy for you. You don't have to be fully financially independent, as in able to pay for the kids all by yourself, because he will have to pay too. You might have to change your lifestyle, move. But it won't be the end of life as you know it, honestly. Many of us who've been through this stuff will tell you that they actually end up in a better situation, even without as much money.

My ex got a whole lot more cooperative after we split up. Take baby steps, plan through it, find out what you are entitled to and don't worry about trying to be the nice non-nagging wife: that cliché was invented so that in trying to avoid it we shut up and don't demand what we deserve.

Dowser · 15/07/2017 16:57

I got this after thirty years of marriage.
I'm now happily married to my second husband...who does love me and is in love with me..and you can feel the difference.

MudCity · 15/07/2017 20:38

Really feel for you Dolly. Please don't lose heart. Focus on yourself and getting through each day. Flowers for you.

Messelina · 15/07/2017 21:41

Dolly, you say he has booked an appointment at Relate. Are you going with him? If he is trying to get counselling for your relationship, it seems to me that he may be trying (though not very well so far!) to make a go of it - at any rate he's not leaving you right now is he? And as you say, you can't afford to leave him just yet. Are you sure the relationship is beyond saving?

Calm yourself down and stop drinking. Try to think what you want to happen. Maybe have a look at Andrew Marshall's book It's Not a Midlife Crisis, it's an Opportunity which is an encouraging take on this phase of life. Chin up - lots of people have been in this situation, and it always gets resolved, one way or another! May be hard to believe it now, but whatever happens you will be fine! x

ivykaty44 · 15/07/2017 21:47

Reading your post I wouldn't know if you love him and wonder if you stay as it's easier than going it alone

whirlycurly · 16/07/2017 08:15

Pretty much exactly what ravenmum said. The tension of living like this was greater than anything I've ever experienced, before or since. The relief of it ending (and I was also fortunate (Hmm) enough to make a discovery that gave me the push I needed was immense.

The best thing you can do to help yourself is retrain if you need to and get yourself a job. I went into a decent company at a junior level and quickly worked my way up. Now I could be self sufficient if xh can't pay maintenance and also have a means to support myself when the dcs are older. That was really important to me.

The loss of the family unit and change of expectations take longer to work through- that's a kind of grieving process. Occasionally I imagine what life would be like if we were all still together- he's a very high earner so financially things would be great but if I think about being in an emotional relationship with him now, I literally feel sick.

Try and be as strong as you can - I'd give him a shock and start talking about splitting tbh - throw a bucket of reality on this situation. I know it's hard but don't demean yourself by trying to change anything about you to make him see things differently. He may not be worth keeping.

GelfBride · 16/07/2017 08:39

He's swallowed the cliche' dictionary, he's blaming you (so following the script to the letter) It's over. Find your inner anger as it will give you the impetus to carry through. You may not ever find out the full truth of the OW but as he's followed the script in every other sense.....
Get advice, get the ducks in a row and separate. His bleati.ng that he doesn't want that is because the set up suits him. I bet my bra strap that once he's free (because you are forcing him to be so) OW will shut the door in his face. The longer you allow this to go on, the more shit you will feel over it.

MsJuniper · 16/07/2017 09:38

I would think that it's less that he "stopped being in love with you" or whatever and more that his head has been turned by this other woman and your carefully-crafted, loving, family-centred relationship has suddenly paled in comparison.

If he is genuinely keen to save the relationship, then the counselling may be worth pursuing, but you will have to consider your own needs and boundaries and be prepared that he may not agree to meet them. Don't settle for anything less than you're comfortable with or it will eat away at you.

Otherwise, you may decide the relationship cannot be saved and focus on setting up a protected environment for you and your children. Hard but plenty of MN women have done this and come out the other side.

Either way, the answer is not in a bottle.

DollyBright0n · 16/07/2017 10:18

I can't believe how wonderful people are on this site. Thanks again absolutely everyone for your replies, it's really helped me to know most people are thinking along the same lines as I am and that I'm not going completely mad or over-reacting to the bloody "love but not in love" bombshell. Lovely to hear how much better off some of you felt once making the decision to leave and getting out of a miserable relationship.

We've booked an appointment with relate so I'll see how that goes whilst keeping a very close eye on those ducks and having a talk with my manager to see if I can increase my hours. I'm hoping that it will resolve this situation either way because I clearly can't go on with it like this. I've also been looking into some local meetup groups to keep me busy as well as having arranged days out with friends which has left me feeling much more positive about myself this morning. I'm just hoping that it will last.

OP posts:
Catchytune · 16/07/2017 10:24

I was in a similar relationship for 10 years or so ( wasted another 3 being on and off as well).
I totally get the thinking behind having a " working" relationship rather than a romantic one. The main problem with this is that neither of you are actually happy. It's a an OK life but not a fulfilling one.

You will never get these years back. You perhaps need to see it as an exciting new start. Go back to uni ( very supportive financially of single parents) , meet new people, find someone with a passion for you. Believe it's possible and it can be.

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