Why does my mother open a conversation about politics when she knows it causes rows?

[flamingnoravera]

My mother just called. We don't get on, we don't agree on anything and on politics we are as far apart as we could possibly be.

She opens the conversation with "are you voting on Thursday?" She knows I've always voted, that I always vote labour. I'm 55 and have never ever not voted. So I say "yes of course, why would I not vote?" .

She follows it with "I suppose youlll be voting for that incompetent Mr Corbin". I should have said "that's my business" but I said "yes, I want a health service and good schools and asked if mum had read the naylor report". She repeated that Corbin is incompetent and I asked for evidence. She admitted she had none and went on to character assassinate him further, personal attacks on him not on policy.

I could feel myself getting cross with her and got her but back by telling her how I feel about TMay. She got huffy and pissy with me and said "we'll never agree " and I said yup, that's true. She said ok I'd better go and I said "Bye" and put the phone down.

I'm now feeling guilty that she'll be upset and cross that she started a conversation, yet again that always ends badly. This happens every time we speak, she knows we clash on politics and anything really that isn't the weather but seems to be unable to recognise that her questions open up the worst in me.

I seem unable not to rise to the bait and it feels like she's baiting me. We are stuck in this pattern and I'm sick of it but don't know how to stop it.

I'm an only child, she's just about to sort out power of attorney papers so I can look after her affairs if she becomes unable to do it herself. But right now I'd be happy if I never spoke to her again.

She was a teacher 20 years ago and treated me like another kid in her class rather than her daughter. She cannot admit she's wrong and I spent my childhood scared of her and her looks of disgust when i behaved like a normal kid, teenager and young woman.

No contact is not an option, I'm all she's got apart from her frail and unpleasant husband who she married after the death of my dad. I just don't know how to deal with her so that these awful stand offs stop.

"No contact is not an option, I'm all she's got apart from her frail and unpleasant husband who she married after the death of my dad"

Actually no contact is an option for you, its simply one that you cannot currently countenance. Why is that?. Your own FOG (fear, obligation and guilt) holding you back?. You are still scared of her really and want her approval, approval that she will never give you. Its not your fault she is like this. You did not make her that way

What does she bring into your life apart from arguments?. If you really cannot countenance no contact currently, what about further lowering all forms of contact with her?.

People like your mother really do have no friends; they usually fall out with everyone around them and drive them away. Such people also never apologise nor accept any responsibility for their actions.

Would suggest you have caller ID for your phone if you do not already have it. When she does call you will see her number appear and you do not have to answer the phone. If you do answer the phone to her say its not convenient for you to speak now and hang up.

You do not also have to accept her role for you in her power of attorney. Send the documents back to her solicitor saying that you are unwilling to do this.

You need to drop the rope that she keeps on holding out to you; you need to completely detach emotionally and physically from her. She still uses you as her emotional punchbag because you give her an audience.

Where are your boundaries here with regards to your mother; it sounds like she encouraged you not to have any but to serve her interests instead by putting your own self last.

I would suggest you read "Toxic Parents" written by Susan Forward and post also on the "well we took you to Stately Homes" thread on these pages.

I am still scared of her. She seems able to have friends and is a martyr to the church and the parish council and her husband. Her sister (my aunt) is around but she clashes too, not as bad as me and mum but enough so she keeps her boundaries well and refuses to get drawn in.

The POA stuff was my suggestion because she's getting forgetful and I think she's going to need help and I have a duty to look after her. The FOG thing is spot on. I need to think again about whether I can do what I have assumed was my duty. I suppose I hope that if she's unable to look after herself I will be able to get assertive and stop the nonsense. I only speak once a week or so and visit only 3 or 4 times a year because it's so excruciating.

I certainly won't speak to her again until the election is well over.

Why?
Because she wants an argument!

It does sound like you have much bigger issues in your relationship than your political differences, though.
I am sure many people will be able to offer much better advice, but if it was me and I felt that someone was deliberately baiting me, I would gently bait them back a little. ie, very calmly express views which you know she will find annoying. There is no point in rational arguments with someone like that, so just tell her that you are voting for Corbyn because you love his beard, and did she know that Theresa May is going to impose a 60% tax rate on retired teachers?
Keep it light and breezy as you counter bullshit with bullshit. That's not very mature, I know, but it might make the conversations more fun for you.

squishy and maria I think I could manage the "no contact in my head" and I need to remember to not rise to the bait but to deflect it with a question if I can. I love the idea of telling her that TM is to bring in a 60% tax on retired teachers! That made me laugh out loud. I also Like the suggestion of "Mum, the last time we spoke about politics we couldn't bear to speak to each other for a month. Is that the sort of relationship you want to have with your only child?".

You are right there are much deeper things going on, it the fear thing. I was always so frightened of her that I lied and covered my tracks about everything I did because she was so dissaproving. My dad was as soft as a kitten and he adored me and I think it made her jealous that he loved me so much. But he always sided with her when I was caught out on anything she didn't approve of- I suppose he had to because he was scared of her too. My aunt is the most anxious person I have ever met but is able to stand up to her in a way I that is more adult than I seem able to do. I revert back to angry child as soon as I am my mother's presence.

I rely on having my son or partner with me when I visit because its just too awful to contemplate seeing her alone but I have promised I will go and see her on my own and have a conversation about what she would want if she does become unable to make her own decisions. Maybe this very adult to adult conversation will shift something but I am dreading it.

^Sorry should mention that normally I think it best to counter bullshit with facts, but not when you are arguing with someone who pushes all of your buttons like that. If you have to have those conversations, do whatever you need to do to remain emotionally disengaged, including making it into a game that only you know you are playing. If she's predictable, play stupid comment bingo. Or try to answer goady questions with endless, irrelevant anecdotes, etc.

When she asks anything about politics, tell her you're not discussing it. It really IS as simple as that.

Just don't explain your vote to her. It gets you nowhere.

Never wrestle with a pig. You get dirty and the pig enjoys it.

This is basically what is happening when your mum rings to talk about politics. You don't need to go NC if you don't want to, but you do need some ways to end the conversation.

DM: Have you voted?
You: Yes
DM: I suppose you've voted for that nasty Mr Corbyn?
You: Hmm. What are you having for dinner? We're having a BBQ as the weather's so nice. Best make the most of it as the forecast says it might turn at any moment. You don't get too many chances for a BBQ do you? etc etc without drawing breath

It is a private ballot though isn't it? You are not compelled to tell anyone who you vote for because of this very reason of not being persecuted for your choice.
"It's a private ballot" is all you need to say to her, repeat, repeat as a stone wall until the subject is changed.

I agree with detaching emotionally. Stop caring what she thinks. Stop listening to her. Umm humm. Is that so? How interesting. Amazing. Really? It is what it is. How extraordinary! I'll think about it. Maybe, I'll check my schedule.

Reduce visits. Three times this year. Two next year. Then once a year after that.

I agree with Attila that you were not bound into a contract to care for this woman simply because you sprang from her womb. She has certainly has already had her pound of flesh out of you. As you live a bit of distance from her (may God -
or what ever higher being you believe in- bless every one of those miles) your help may be in organizing others to care for her. ,

Her unpleasant husband is her problem, her doing, and not for you to solve for her. (He might very well have his side to the story though, if he is in the teacher's firing line 24/7.)

Oh god. Sounds like my mother. I started to limit my contact with her when every conversation became a reason for her to either be passive aggressive or just plain rude to me. As she gets older the plain rude seems to be coming out more.
I have learned to nod and smile and pretty much ignore everything she says.
It's takes practice and I can tell it drives her nuts as I don't argue back or engage with her gossip etc.
I just do ALOT of oh that's nice.... Sounds interesting.
Don't engage. It makes life so much easier.
Oh and also don't be guilt tripped into having a relationship with someone who makes you feel like this.
I went Low contact with my DM a few years ago after an incident which was what broke the camels back.
Life is too short.
Smile and nod!