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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

To give him her passport?

30 replies

skysofblue · 08/05/2017 08:39

Please help me.
My husband is Romanian and I'm African. We have a baby who was born in Africa.

We live in the U.K. now and I'm
a resident. Our baby has no right to stay and easiest option is to get her a Romanian passport.

My husband has been living away from the home since December and we have unofficially separated. He has her on weekends. He has expressed the fact that he thinks she should live with him but is currently picking her up and dropping her off according to our agreed program.

He once threatened to take her away from me so I am reluctant to give him her documents.

Is it a good idea to give him the documents? As it stands our daughter can't travel outside the U.K. because they wouldn't let her back in so this passport is a good idea. But I keep thinking that he will take her
Xxx

OP posts:
ElspethFlashman · 08/05/2017 08:43

So once he takes her back to Romania the baby has no right to return to the UK?

hellsbellsmelons · 08/05/2017 08:45

Do NOT give him any documents!
I've no idea about legalities of your DC right to stay in the UK.
I would suggest you post this in the legal section as well and see if anyone can help you with that.

ElspethFlashman · 08/05/2017 08:48

How long have either of you lived in the UK?

SoulAccount · 08/05/2017 08:50

Do not give him the documents.

I think you need to seek legal advice and think about the long term. Can you get her a passport from the African country she was born in? Though I presume she had this for when you brought her here? How did your dd arrive here if she now wouldn't be allowed in?

It may be a good idea to apply for a Romanian passport, but could you do it together and sent to your address?

But you need to think of implications for the future. For example if he took her to Romania, and you couldn't go there, and whether the UK authorities would assist as she is not a U.K. citizen.

Why does he think she should live with him?

SoulAccount · 08/05/2017 08:51

Can you not get your dd a secure status to live here?

MrsBertBibby · 08/05/2017 08:54

Is your status in the UK dependent on your marriage to him, or are you here in your own right, as it were?

You really need to get proper immigration law advice on this. Especially with Brexit coming: a Romanian passport may not be enough anyway.

Original poster
skysofblue · 08/05/2017 09:03

@ElspethFlashman yes if he takes her then she can't come back in.
She has a Zambian passport at the moment.
My status here is dependent on the marriage yes. So I hers I assume as all she has is her Zambian passport.

OP posts:
Original poster
skysofblue · 08/05/2017 09:05

I have lived in the U.K. for a year. And my daughter also. The husband has lived here for about ten years

OP posts:
Thissameearth · 08/05/2017 09:09

Hi @skysofblue what is your exact immigration status i.e. What document/passport insert do you have and what does it say? Is it as family member of EEA national or in your own right? How long have you held that status for? How did your daughter originally enter the UK? You say the Romanian nationality is easiest option - have you spoken to an adviser?

Sorry for all the questions, I'm a lawyer, used to do immigration law, and have close friends who still do so if we know your exact status then we could give you some help. Either way you may be able to get your daughter's leave regularised without leaving it to your husband. if Romanian nationality is a part of that (and we don't know that yet) perhaps you could attend the embassy in U.K. together, taking your daughter's original passport and a certified true copy, show them the original and leaving only the certified true copy as you may not want to rely on them saying they'll return it to you - just human error plus your husband may call up and try to divert it to him.

Sorry you're having this problem 💐

Thissameearth · 08/05/2017 09:10

I'm off to work now will look into tonight

MrsBertBibby · 08/05/2017 09:10

If you have separated you need to tell the Home Office

www.gov.uk/visas-when-you-separate-or-divorce/tell-home-office

Please get immigration advice straight away.

NameChange30 · 08/05/2017 09:11

What do you plan to do? Immigration law is complicated and you won't have the right to remain in the UK if/when you divorce. You need specialist immigration advice on your own status. You could visit Citizens Advice - they can only give basic information but should be able to refer you to an immigration specialist.

If I were you I wouldn't give your DD's passport or birth certificate to her father. And if you get her a Romanian passport you should keep that too.

There is useful information about this issue at rightsofwomen.org.uk/get-information/family-law/children-law-relocation-holidays-abduction/
Rights of Women also have a free legal helpline you can call.

Is/was he abusive?

NameChange30 · 08/05/2017 09:20

Sorry, just to correct my previous statement:

you won't necessarily have the right to remain in the UK if/when you divorce

Actually you may well have "retained rights of residence" (more info at www.gov.uk/family-permit/retained-rights-of-residence).

But you should still seek specialist advice.

ElspethFlashman · 08/05/2017 09:21

If he's been in the UK for 10 years he can make steps towards citizenship.

However he would have to want that as it costs money.

But my point is that he could ultimately get a UK passport and then she could get one through him.

But if he has no interest in doing that then she's out of luck.

One thing is for sure, if you want to be the one to raise your child, you do not let her have a Romanian passport. He could take her to Romania to be raised by his family and that will be that.

Original poster
skysofblue · 08/05/2017 09:38

@Thissameearth thankyou so much.
I have a five year residency card. It says family member of an eea national. I've had it for a little over a month.
I have spoken to immigration lawyers about the fact that he's not living at home and I've been told I will have to apply to stay here on my own right.
He was verbally emotionally abusive and controlling and I had a case open on him with a domestic violence organisation.

OP posts:
Original poster
skysofblue · 08/05/2017 09:40

@Thissameearth my daughter has an African passport. We entered the U.K. On a EEA family permit visa after living in Romania for nine months.

OP posts:
Original poster
skysofblue · 08/05/2017 10:39

I've been advised to give it to him as in the long run it helps me as well to be able to apply to stay in the U.K. Independent of him.
I have recorded a conversation with him where he says he will give it back.
I have certified some copies of it with an immigration lawyer.
So thankyou ladies and I'll just keep my fingers crossed.
He is on his way bringing her back after having her for the weekend. So I needed to think fast.
Thankyou

OP posts:
Original poster
skysofblue · 08/05/2017 10:40

I've been advised to give it to him as in the long run it helps me as well to be able to apply to stay in the U.K. Independent of him.
I have recorded a conversation with him where he says he will give it back.
I have certified some copies of it with an immigration lawyer.
So thankyou ladies and I'll just keep my fingers crossed.
He is on his way bringing her back after having her for the weekend. So I needed to think fast.
Thankyou

OP posts:
NameChange30 · 08/05/2017 10:52

"I've been advised to give it to him as in the long run it helps me as well to be able to apply to stay in the U.K. Independent of him."

Does the person who advised this (your immigration lawyer, presumably?) know that he has been abusive and has threatened to take her out of the country?

SusannahL · 08/05/2017 11:05

As you have separated from your child's father I think your best bet is to go back home to Africa.

Original poster
skysofblue · 08/05/2017 11:07

Yes he does. I'm really unsure but he says I just keep the evidence I have of all this

OP posts:
Original poster
skysofblue · 08/05/2017 11:41

Hi we haven't officially separated. Still trying to work things out. Xx

OP posts:
FizzyGreenWater · 08/05/2017 12:11

I would absolutely NOT give him any documents.

He could abduct her and there would be very little you could do.

Is there a way you could make the application for the Romanian passport through your imigration lawyer, stating that you cannot trust him with her documents, make him engage with them in order to complete documentation?

If you have DV case open against him surely this would help.

NameChange30 · 08/05/2017 12:16

Get advice from Women's Aid (or the domestic violence organisation you mentioned, if it's another one) and Rights of Women. They have a free family law helpline.

NameChange30 · 08/05/2017 12:18

And please don't "work things out" with him Confused
He is abusive and won't change. He will do huge emotional damage to you and your daughter. Possibly physical damage too.

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