Valentines, do I, I don't?

[HarmlessChap]

As I've mentioned ad nauseam on here that DW & I are working on our relationship, trying to get some intimacy back into what has become a platonic relationship.

She doesn't believe in Valentines day, a waste of money..... I agree to an extent but AFAIC a couple of quid on a card isn't the same as a grand gesture.

For years I gave a card but didn't expect one in return, she would get annoyed as she hadn't bought one and said I was just doing it to make her feel guilty, so I stopped.

This year I've bought one again as we are trying to go back to basics to re-build things and I want to send her one, but by the same token I don't want it to be seen as point scoring so now I'm in 2 minds as to whether to give it to her tomorrow or not.

Any pearls of wisdom?

You have a deadline, by which time goals have to be achieved, so you're at ultimatum time. I've never in practice seen this work as people only change if they truly want/need to or through significant change.

Even if she wants to make you happy, after a longterm relationship roles and expectations can be highly ingrained. Without some major change I can't see how she'll change and how the change will last.

You've said that you've "been to hell and back". How does she feel about the past few years?

How does she feel about the past few years?

She thinks thought that its all normal because that's how it panned out for her parents. I.e. you get married, have kids, then when you hit about 40 sex is inappropriate and intimacy just fizzles out so you live like friends until you die.

It's been my insistence that has led her to talk to friends, do some reading and realise that its not like that for most people and its certainly not how I want to go through my 50's, 60's and 70's. Sex isn't the most important part, an occasional hug, not being pushed away when I hug her, a kiss before either of us goes out or when we get home etc. its all pretty basic stuff really IMO.

These things are now happening but they are forced, it needs to become natural, habitual and what we both want. We are going back to basics; dates, making sure we try to show we appreciate and love each other, etc.etc. It's clearly much harder for her than it is for me but she is making efforts now, those efforts are restricted but I have hope that as some level of affection becomes normal those limits will broaden.

Goals isn't the right word, I simply want us to build a relationship that will hold us to each other as we grow old and wrinkly(er) which is something we haven't currently got. I've an idea of what that might be but I'm not closed minded it could be much different but I do want more than friendship.

The time frame is two fold. When its just us two and the kids aren't at home any longer if we've fallen back into our old neglectful habits then how bad it is will be all we have to focus on and also it gives me the space mentally to try to make it work. It doesn't have to be right by then, but if I can see us being a couple and getting close once its just us rather than resenting each other that will be enough.

It's a shame she's not willing to look into futher counselling. It does sound like she has some deeper issues around the intimacy side of things.
My boyfriend started seeing a counsellor (different issues to your wife) it's been a huge help though and he's realising things, I really don't think he had a clue about before.
Although for us, it had to be that I insisted he go, or we were over.
You sound like you're giving it your all, so I really hope it works out for you.

I know this is just one small thing, and I don't want this to come across as blaming you for everything

But the flowers thing made me think... I have been given flowers when I'm really busy and have thought "great - now I have to find a vase and sort these fuckers out". I know that takes only a couple of minutes and they look beautiful, but if you're not that bothered about flowers, this lovely gesture actually means:

• find vase (where the hell is it?!)
• unwrap
• find scissors and trim because they're always too long for vase
• full vase, faff around because they're not the perfect size for the vase, feel rubbish because they've flopped side ways... etc
• put them out, feel guilty for days that I've forgotten to water them (I'm just like that!)
• pick up dead heads and pollen from the floor
• not have a clue if I should remove brown ones or ditch the lot.
• sigh at my flower arranging skills when I pull out the dead ones and it's all looking rather thin and bedraggled
• maybe feel guilty that I'm not appreciating nice gesture
• feel angry that nice gesture is actually more work for me than the giver, and anyway, aren't flowers a lazy go to and therefore not that meaningful? (no offence - my fiancé brings them and I love them, my XH - I hated them. Just made me think - lazy fucker, just like you're lazy in all things) Very much depended on the state of the relationship!

So you know, if flowers don't do it for her and get left... do something different.

At the very least, do what my fiancé does! Present them, let me sniff and admire them, then he reaches for a vase and we sort them out together.

So you know, if flowers don't do it for her and get left... do something different.
Its odd she likes the idea of flowers, will say that I don't get her any but isn't fussed when she receives some, she's had them from work in the past and does just the same. Its simply that at the time it hurt my feelings and I saw it as a metaphor for our relationship. It was however irrational, I see that.

She used to appreciate grand gestures now it seems small gestures and tokens appear are better received.